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49ers All-Time Quarterback

First off, heartiest congratulations to our All-Time Punter, Andy Lee, who absolutely ran away with the victory, getting 81% of the vote.  I think it's safe to say that Andy Lee will end his time with the 49ers as the all-time leading punter and a fan favorite.

When I was trying to decide what position to go with next, I initially was thinking something safe and non-controversial, like an offensive lineman or maybe a linebacker position or even just declaring Jerry Rice or Ronnie Lott at WR and FS.  Then I thought better of that and decided, let's get controversial and mix it up a little.  When you think of the 49ers, Joe Montana is certainly one of the guys you automatically think of.  he won Super Bowl titles while earning a clutch reputation that endures to this day.  On the other hand, Steve Young brought some sizzle that moves him to the front of the list for some folks.  People are quick to forget greats like Y.A. Tittle and John Brodie who may not have won titles, but certainly made an imprint at the quarterback position.  I'm not sure Tittle or Brodie will get many votes, but they certainly deserve consideration.

The plan is to go with a starting QB and a backup QB.  I've decided to go with five options in this poll, with the four losing options then being revoted on for the backup position.  I have a pretty good idea of how this vote will turn out, but I want to include all the potential options anyways.

Joe Montana (1979-1992): I could include absolutely nothing here and it wouldn't matter.  Joe Montana was the face of the 49ers in the 80s as they went from perennial doormat to Team of the 80s.  Montana stands #1 in franchise history in career passing yards, touchdowns, completions and of course Super Bowl rings.  In polls of who you would want leading your team down with less than 2 minutes to go, most people take Montana.  While he was surrounded by plenty of talent, he made the most of it and was a leader of his teams.

Steve Young (1987-1999): It's fitting that Young and Montana will be battling for the starting position.  After years in Montana's shadow, Steve Young got the proverbial monkey off his back in 1994 with one of the greatest single seasons.  Young finished his career with the greatest QB rating in NFL history.  While he may not have had the sped of a Vick, Steve Young was one of the truly great rushing quarterbacks in NFL history.  Combine that with uncanny accuracy and you're talking about an all-around threat rarely seen in NFL history.

John Brodie (1957-1973): Brodie finished his career third in the NFL in all-time passing yards and ranks as one of the greatest players NOT in the NFL Hall of Fame.  Brodie ranks second in 49ers history in passing yards and third in touchdowns, while playing for plenty less than stellar teams.

Y.A. Tittle (1951-1960): While Tittle spent plenty of time in Baltimore and New York, his formative years came with the 49ers as a 4-time Pro Bowler.  Considering the slowly developing passing game back in the day, 16,000+ yards in San Francisco is nothing to sneeze at.

Jeff Garcia (1999-2003): While we might all agree Jeff Garcia was not the greatest quarterback on straight numbers, he certainly ranks up there for what he did in spite of his shortcomings.  Garcia was rescued from the CFL by Bill Walsh in one of his best moves since trading for Steve Young.  Garcia was a 3-time pro Bowler in his five seasons and in spite of such a short tenure, he ranks 4th in franchise history for passing yards and fifth in passing touchdowns.  While he was certainly not a scrambler the caliber of Steve Young, he was quite fleet of foot, which helped for his lack of traditional passing tools.  And the fact that he had to put up with T.O. certainly counts for something.

Poll
Who should be our All-Time QB?
Joe Montana
477 votes
Steve Young
111 votes
John Brodie
8 votes
Y.A. Tittle
7 votes
Jeff Garcia
19 votes

622 votes | Poll has closed

0 recs  |  Comment 82 comments

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Comments

Display:

I hope whoever voted for Garcia was really high when they did it.

"I been waitin' a long time for this! I been waitin' since the f**kin' amateurs!" --WILL "THE THRILL" CLARK

by Josh from Hollywood on May 6, 2008 6:18 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

+ infinity

I’d rather Garcia never be mentioned as a niner… he sucks!!!

Joe and Steve were under the same system for years... don't expect Smith to be super so soon.

by bayboy on May 6, 2008 6:37 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Garcia didn't suck as a Niner

In fact, he was pretty darn good for a time—3 straight Pro Bowls, 2 straight 30+ TD seasons (something neither Montana or Young were able to do). It’s just that Garcia’s prime with the Niners was so much shorter than Montana or Young, his personal and team successes so much inferior to theirs, I think it’s kind of ridiculous to choose him over two such clearly superior players.

"I been waitin' a long time for this! I been waitin' since the f**kin' amateurs!" --WILL "THE THRILL" CLARK

by Josh from Hollywood on May 7, 2008 3:08 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

actually

I credit most of Garcia’s success to TO… during those 3 years TO was beginning to be a beast and Garcia looked good thanks to him… but when it came down to games that counted Garcia was not great or clutch… I think when you play steps up in the playoff is when you can be considered a Great… Garcia never will be that

Joe and Steve were under the same system for years... don't expect Smith to be super so soon.

by bayboy on May 7, 2008 7:18 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ah, the clutch argument. More like cRutch argument…BAM! You know, because you’re desperately looking for something to stand on….ok, I’ll leave now.

Neglectful father of David Quinowski

by marcello on May 7, 2008 10:04 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

+1

Whiny Niner fans who just got so spoiled by having two all-time great quarterbacks absolutely irritate the hell out of me. Obviously Garcia wasn’t the best, and was nowhere NEAR the class of Montana or Young, but the guy was a solid pro, who led this team to a playoff victory, and put up solid numbers for himself. Look no further than the fact that he was thrown into the fire after Young went down with his final concussion, and sucked big time. After getting benched for a few weeks, and got to spend more time learning the offense, he came back and lit it up. The following year was a banner year for Garcia on a 6-10 team. He kicked enough ass to go 10-6, but the defense couldn’t get it together until late in the season.

And with all due respect, bayboy, but if you’re going to say that Garcia’s success all came to him because of TO, then you abso-fucking-lutely HAVE to say the same damn thing about Montana and Young with regards to Rice, Craig, Taylor, TO, Clark, etc. Relying on the “well I think his success was due to someone else” is one of the worst arguments you’ll ever hear regarding someone’s success. Now if you simply don’t like Garcia, that’s cool. But just say so.

Personally, I voted for Montana and had a good laugh that someone voted for Garcia.

"He called the sh** POOP!" -- Adam Sandler

by JRPhillips on May 7, 2008 12:54 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ooh! Ooh! Pick me!

I simply don’t like Garcia!

My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.

by howtheyscored on May 7, 2008 1:22 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I hear your argument..

though I don’t consider myself a whiny individual, I can see how I got spoiled on having two Hall of Famers to root for… I just don’t get why people praise Garcia so much… he lacked arm strength, had to jump to be able to see his receivers and was never clutch in big games… Montana and Young ran the show as QB, an essential requirement as QB… Garcia never did.. to me he will never be considered Great (well maybe to his dad) and to be dubbed All-Time QB as a 49er… is an insult.

Joe and Steve were under the same system for years... don't expect Smith to be super so soon.

by bayboy on May 7, 2008 3:21 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Sorry, I didn’t mean to call you whiny. But we’ve been so spoiled by the likes of Montana and Young, we could make a trade for Peyton Manning and a great number of Niner fans wouldn’t be impressed. But here’s what’s mind-boggling to me… You said he lacks arm strength, a measure that Joe Montana was knocked for too. And he had to jump to be able to see his receivers. Neither hindered him from completing over 60% of his passes in four out of five seasons, throwing 31 tds to 10 ints one year followed by 32 and 12 the following. It didn’t prevent him from having a quarterback rating of 97.6, 94.8, and 85.8 in three consecutive seasons as a Niner. As for clutch, what was more clutch than his playoff win over the Giants? You can certainly make a case to the contrary, I’m sure, but he did have a playoff win that was pretty Joe Montana-esque (okay, I don’t know that for sure, I think I missed the game), so that’s a clutch performance. And clutch is such an ambiguous term anyway. What is clutch? How does one really define it? The knock on Manning was he couldn’t win the big game, until he did. The same was said of Steve Young. But how much does “clutch” rely on the rest of the team? Receivers can’t drop catcheable passes. And if you look at some of the Niners playoff games during the Montana years, the score was so close, and so low. What if the Niners defense gave it up like a drunk chick on prom night? If Montana hadn’t been able to come back because it was a blowout, would he still be considered clutch? It’s just way too ambiguous and really not something that can be easily measured, outside of one’s gut.

I’m certainly not saying Garcia was great, but he was a very good quarterback for us. Unfortunately, Niner fans couldn’t stand him only being very good, so he was run out of town. And in the years since he’s been gone, we’ve had a great stew of mediocrity under center for us. Tim Rattay, Tommy Dorsey, Alex Smith, Shaun Hill… Jeff Garcia would have been an improvement over any of them the last number of years.

And again, for the record, I think we need to find out who the four people were that voted for Jeff Garcia and ban them from the site.

"He called the sh** POOP!" -- Adam Sandler

by JRPhillips on May 7, 2008 4:38 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ill agree to your last statement...

but for everything else… to compare Garcia to Montana.. wow!!.. I dont remember seeing Montana jump in every pass (except for “the Catch” replays) but Ill give you the arm strength thing… though clutch maybe too ambiguous to define.. his playoff win was due mostly in part to TO…. http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/recapPlayoff2002?gameId=230105025… and a lucky botched snap by the giants…
ill give the “gutsy” title to Garcia but not Great… and to reiterate your statement for those who voted for Garcia .. you should be ashamed!!

Joe and Steve were under the same system for years... don't expect Smith to be super so soon.

by bayboy on May 7, 2008 5:37 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Like I said, Montana is obviously hands down better than Garcia, but you’re using some really idiotic measuring sticks to make a case that Garcia wasn’t any good. He had to jump? So what? Did that prevent him from winning? Did that actually make him less of a QB in your eyes?

Again, I mean no disrespect to you, it’s just that I’m not impressed by the anti-Garcia crowd (except for Howtheyscored, but he gets a free pass for just not liking Garcia). The points made about how he sucked are very trite, based mostly in immeasurables, like clutch, height, arm strength, and looking/smelling like a rat.

"He called the sh** POOP!" -- Adam Sandler

by JRPhillips on May 8, 2008 12:59 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah.

I don’t like Garcia either. While he was just starting out, I never wanted to give the guy the benefit of the doubt, and he showed to be a VERY competent NFL quarterback. It’s easy to say he wasn’t clutch or that he didn’t have ideal arm strength or height, but it doesn’t show that he wasn’t able to win.

Saying T.O. was the primary cause of all his success is like saying Rice was all a part of Montana’s. Garcia knew how to make things happen, and just because fans saw the masters of improv (Young and Montana), it should not take away from that.

If all of a sudden Alex Smith breaks out this year, the people who say T.O. made Garcia will probably say Bruce or Johnson made Smith. You can’t fault a QB for his surrounding talent. Montana and Young had A LOT more than Garcia did, on offense. If people think Young got the short end of the stick in terms of pass blocking, Garcia must have gotten a negative length stick. They were good at blocking for Hearst, but I don’t remember them being too great in pass protection.

I still don’t like the guy, but that doesn’t preclude me from admitting he was a pretty good QB. Not just ‘gutsy’ or whatever, but actually a pretty good quarterback.

by sfgfan on May 8, 2008 8:38 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Who the hell is Tommy Dorsey?

I...drink...your...milkshake! I drink it up! - Daniel Plainview

by methodrampage on May 8, 2008 7:40 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ken...

... was just that forgettable.

by sfgfan on May 8, 2008 8:39 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ken Dorsey was Joe Montana without Bill Walsh

I...drink...your...milkshake! I drink it up! - Daniel Plainview

by methodrampage on May 8, 2008 9:01 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

This too is a joke

I...drink...your...milkshake! I drink it up! - Daniel Plainview

by methodrampage on May 8, 2008 11:08 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Tommy Dorsey

Tommy Dorsey was a jazz legend, a trombonist and big band leader. He and his brother Jimmy were greats in their time. Today, people don’t know Tommy Dorsey from Glenn Miller.

"He called the sh** POOP!" -- Adam Sandler

by JRPhillips on May 8, 2008 10:49 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

But Garcia was also annoying. Let’s not forget the annoying factor!

My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.

by howtheyscored on May 7, 2008 11:37 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Garcia? Reallly?

Might as well throw Jeff Kemp up there. Someone will vote for him.

by Nineraguan on May 7, 2008 9:59 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

It doesn't surprise me that Montana is winning.

But I am shocked that he is winning by so much.

by spenczar on May 6, 2008 7:01 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

andy lee

Had a similar victory…still not so sure whether to bother with the formality of having a vote for Jerry Rice or Ronnie Lott.

Niners Nation - The premier 49ers blog on the Internet!

by Fooch on May 6, 2008 10:26 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

You could save those for the end, sort of a fun/easy post if there is still slow time.

Neglectful father of David Quinowski

by marcello on May 7, 2008 10:11 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Do you mean that it shouldn’t be surprising that Montana is winning by this much? Or are you agreeing with spenczar?

Neglectful father of David Quinowski

by marcello on May 7, 2008 10:08 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Let's do some math

Who’s the majority voting for?

I...drink...your...milkshake! I drink it up! - Daniel Plainview

by methodrampage on May 7, 2008 10:10 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I know!

Joe Montana! I still have no clue which way you were leaning though. I can’t tell if you were being sarcastic or serious.

Neglectful father of David Quinowski

by marcello on May 7, 2008 10:15 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Steve Young > Joe Montana

I...drink...your...milkshake! I drink it up! - Daniel Plainview

by methodrampage on May 7, 2008 10:26 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Check.

I disagree, but at least I understand now.

Neglectful father of David Quinowski

by marcello on May 7, 2008 10:34 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

One of my top ten favorite things is when someone voices an opinion and likes to pretend that it’s gospel truth with no room for disagreement. It makes me smile.

"He called the sh** POOP!" -- Adam Sandler

by JRPhillips on May 7, 2008 1:00 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

If you're in disagreement with me

You are wrong.

I...drink...your...milkshake! I drink it up! - Daniel Plainview

by methodrampage on May 7, 2008 3:50 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

See me smiling?

You make me smile.

"He called the sh** POOP!" -- Adam Sandler

by JRPhillips on May 7, 2008 4:41 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

You see this foot?

It’s going up your …

I...drink...your...milkshake! I drink it up! - Daniel Plainview

by methodrampage on May 8, 2008 7:31 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Haha! It's funny because it's not true!

I love the boldness some people show by making threats online. That’s also in my top ten favorite things!

"He called the sh** POOP!" -- Adam Sandler

by JRPhillips on May 8, 2008 11:01 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

It was a joke

Obviously you take internets postings way too seriously.

I...drink...your...milkshake! I drink it up! - Daniel Plainview

by methodrampage on May 8, 2008 11:05 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Obviously

"He called the sh** POOP!" -- Adam Sandler

by JRPhillips on May 8, 2008 11:08 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Either that or...

You need to refine your online sarcasm craft.

I’m not taking the blame alone, my man.

"He called the sh** POOP!" -- Adam Sandler

by JRPhillips on May 8, 2008 11:12 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

No thanks

I can’t help the density of some people.

I...drink...your...milkshake! I drink it up! - Daniel Plainview

by methodrampage on May 8, 2008 11:13 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Or their denseness.

"I been waitin' a long time for this! I been waitin' since the f**kin' amateurs!" --WILL "THE THRILL" CLARK

by Josh from Hollywood on May 8, 2008 1:50 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Because this was clearly a dead serious comment

I...drink...your...milkshake! I drink it up! - Daniel Plainview

by methodrampage on May 8, 2008 11:12 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I missed the clue as to the joke.

Was there snarkiness I missed?

"He called the sh** POOP!" -- Adam Sandler

by JRPhillips on May 8, 2008 11:19 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

No you're hopeless

Give up

I...drink...your...milkshake! I drink it up! - Daniel Plainview

by methodrampage on May 8, 2008 11:24 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I guess I should apologize...

Sorry I missed the sarcasm in your comment that many idiotic people would say while being completely serious. You are very smart AND witty, and may I say… Probably a very handsome man to boot. So I apologize for missing that you were being witty, with no proof to the contrary. I give up, and concede to you, who is evidence that we do in fact evolve as you are obviously on a higher plane of existence than the rest of us.

Now if THAT didn’t ooze sarcasm and insincerity, you can call me hopeless.

"He called the sh** POOP!" -- Adam Sandler

by JRPhillips on May 8, 2008 11:31 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

So where you talking for dinner on Friday night?

I...drink...your...milkshake! I drink it up! - Daniel Plainview

by methodrampage on May 8, 2008 11:33 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

You probably should have posted that in the body, because according to your rules below, it appears that’s a statement of fact. If you put it in the body, you could have italicized it, thus indicating that was a joke. Now I have no choice but to think you’re serious.

I plan to have dinner at home with the wife and little one. I’d invite you over, but we don’t know you, and I’m not sure I’d feel comfortable having a stranger over at my house around my little girl.

"He called the sh** POOP!" -- Adam Sandler

by JRPhillips on May 8, 2008 11:37 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Therefore I motion for my vote to count for 100 votes

I...drink...your...milkshake! I drink it up! - Daniel Plainview

by methodrampage on May 7, 2008 10:09 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

The majority of 49ers fans, experts, pundits, game historians, and fans of other teams, too!

I voted for Montana, perhaps unfairly. I’m the first to admit that Montana to me is the mystique of having never seen him play (except as a Chief), so it’s not a particularly well-reasoned opinion that I’m pulling from when I cast my vote. It seems like as a general rule, though, regardless of what demographic you’re talking about (whether expert or lay), Montana tends to be consensus here. Not that Montana might not be the wrong choice, just that saying he’s obviously the wrong choice is obviously quite a stretch.

To be fair, though, most people simply don’t know what they’re talking about. Even if they’re supposed experts.

My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.

by howtheyscored on May 7, 2008 11:56 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don't know man.....

If you all don’t vote for YA Tittle, the Nortenos may come after you.

MURS for President!!!!!!!

by jtoj on May 6, 2008 7:34 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Can Brodie get love??

Joe and Steve were under the same system for years... don't expect Smith to be super so soon.

by bayboy on May 7, 2008 7:22 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Can we PLEASE have a back-up QB and maybe a 3rd string QB on the All Time Team?

Had to vote Montana, but would love to see another QB or two from this list on this team.

by drink409 on May 7, 2008 10:03 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

backup QB

We are going to have a backup QB and in fact that’ll be the next position. It’s gonna be a vote among the 4 non-Montana’s, since it appears Montana will be the starter. I’m only going wth 2 because otherwise we could go on forever at every position. Although, based on voting we could conceivably develop an entire depth chart…

Niners Nation - The premier 49ers blog on the Internet!

by Fooch on May 7, 2008 10:50 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

In favor of Steve Young

I know I am in the minority amongst Niner fans, but I always preferred Young over Montana. This is not to say that I dislike Montana or anything. Montana is clearly one of the great QBs in our history, no doubt about it. I think Young was hurt by 3 factors:

1. Spent a large portion of his career on the bench watching Montana. This may have helped his development considerably, but it also took away some of his prime seasons
2. Salary cap era. The 49ers couldn’t surround Young with the same level of talent as Montana (although he still had one hell of a supporting cast)
3. Injury. No further explanation needed.

As a side note for your consideration. Steve Young is currently 8th on the 49ers all-time rushing list. This places him ahead of Frank Gore. Oh yeah, he also did it on fewer attempts.

by Exhibit G on May 7, 2008 12:15 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Mayonegg

I think most everyone here, when they search their hearts, know deep down inside that Montana was the better QB, and I think that because most of us here never even got a chance to watch Montana in his prime, Young’s going to get more votes. We live in the ESPN era, where what happens today is infinitely more significant than what happened yesterday in people’s minds.

To address your issues:

1. Prime years? I’d argue his prime years were spent as a starter. He maybe lost a year or two of quality years because of Montana starting, but no more than that.
2. From my knowledge, I don’t know that this is true. Ricky Watters and Hearst were pretty damn good, not to mention having William Floyd, I’d say the RB position is a wash. They both had Rice, and I’d say a young TO wasn’t too far off of Taylor’s quality. Brent Jones is one of the best TEs in Niners history. This isn’t even mentioning their totally dominant defensive corps (especially the ‘94 team). The one part of Young’s teams that always seemed to need improvement was the OL, especially in his later years. I’ll give you that one.
3. The concussions did cause issues toward’s Young’s later years, but I think he was headed downhill talent and ability-wise anyway. The last team they could have gone all the way was ‘98 anyway, and he wasn’t hurt (seriously, at least) that year.

Proud pappa of....STEVE HOLM!!

by UnleashTheGore on May 7, 2008 1:33 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

#2

I guess it depends on how we’re defining supporting cast. I don’t think that just throwing out the words “salary cap era” means anything, because Young had the advantage of playing during the current free agency system vs. Montana playing for most his career without that luxury, and at the tail end playing under the ridiculous Plan B system. If you can point to anything to explain why the talent level might not have been as good, it would be because of poor drafting for a stretch in the 90’s vs. the excellent drafts Walsh pulled off in the 80’s.

"You're a terrible ballplayer, but you've always been a great asshole."-salb918 on Ozzie Guillen

by gatling on May 7, 2008 1:55 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

And by the way,

if you voted Garcia as the best 49ers QB, you really ought to be banned. Seriously. You have some kind of problem in the head.

Proud pappa of....STEVE HOLM!!

by UnleashTheGore on May 7, 2008 1:34 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Garcia's Dad

May be it was Garcia’s dad that voted for him. He never had a problem calling in to sport talk radio shows

Tom will never be as cool as Joe

by wader251 on May 7, 2008 1:36 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Montana v. Young

To me trying to make this decision is like a father trying to pick his favorite child. I wonder if it really can be done.

Tom will never be as cool as Joe

by wader251 on May 7, 2008 1:35 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

I can pick MY favorite child!

It’s my daughter. Easy. This isn’t even a competition.

Literally, it’s not a competition. She’s the only kid I have so far.

"He called the sh** POOP!" -- Adam Sandler

by JRPhillips on May 7, 2008 1:43 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I wonder what the age breakdown is

It would be an interesting study. It seems to me from personal experience, most people who think that Young was better than Montana are too young to have seen Montana play in his prime, and rely heavily on stats to make their determination.

"I been waitin' a long time for this! I been waitin' since the f**kin' amateurs!" --WILL "THE THRILL" CLARK

by Josh from Hollywood on May 7, 2008 3:07 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Young Era

I’m from the Young era, just old enough to remember Montana as a Chief. But I still voted for Montana because like u said, a lot had to 2 do with stats and a lot of ESPN Classic.

by good as gold on May 7, 2008 3:18 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

scrambling ability

Montana was no slouch in the pocket, but Young is obviously the better scrambler…It seems like the discussion has not touched on that too much.

Niners Nation - The premier 49ers blog on the Internet!

by Fooch on May 7, 2008 3:24 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Improv

Both were certainly masters of improv. Montana was a true artist in terms of manipulating the outcome of a play while in the pocket, while Young was just as good at doing that outside of the pocket. Both guys were very efficient and VERY good at what they do. I personally think Young was the better QB, but I don’t know if that’s because I’ve seen both of them play or if I’m just more attached to Young. I really can’t believe the outcome has been THIS one sided. This is approaching Andy Lee territory, and I find that pretty odd.

by sfgfan on May 7, 2008 3:52 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Montana was a product of the system

Again, if you disagree you are wrong.

I...drink...your...milkshake! I drink it up! - Daniel Plainview

by methodrampage on May 7, 2008 3:54 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Can you prove it?

"He called the sh** POOP!" -- Adam Sandler

by JRPhillips on May 7, 2008 4:48 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

It's an opinion.

What kind of dumbass response is that? Don’t try to throw the burden of proof on me when you can’t prove the contrary.

Walsh was a genius, revolutionary, and the father of the West Coast Offense. Montana had the extreme luxury of playing under Walsh and in an offense that defenses hadn’t seen before and weren’t prepared to stop. It’s probable, my actual opinion is that it’s highly likely, that without Walsh’s tutelage and offense, Montana would just have been some average to slightly above average QB that nobody would be talking about today.

I...drink...your...milkshake! I drink it up! - Daniel Plainview

by methodrampage on May 8, 2008 7:51 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Burden of proof is obviously on you

Any simple minded retard could figure out that a person who states his claim must be capable of backing up his claim. You made a statement, that Montana was the product of the system. Then you followed it up by saying that if you disagree, you are wrong. There, you are trying to say that what you said is fact, and there can be no counter-argument. You didn’t say that what you said is an opinion, you presented it as a fact. And facts must be supportable. Therefore, if you are going to say that your opinion is a fact, and dissenting opinions are wrong, you aren’t saying it’s an opinion, it’s a fact.

So while I agree that Montana happened to be at the right place at the right time, this was really a marriage of talents. If Montana had been in someone else’s system, he might not have been as good. And if Walsh had a different quarterback, he might not have looked like quite the genius. There’s obviously room for disagreement on this, because I’m stating this as an opinion. Conjecture and anecdotal evidence aren’t admissible as proof.

I completely agree with your second paragraph. Your opinion is a completely valid one. But just remember, it’s only an opinion, it isn’t fact.

"He called the sh** POOP!" -- Adam Sandler

by JRPhillips on May 8, 2008 10:59 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Apparently sacarism is lost on you.

I...drink...your...milkshake! I drink it up! - Daniel Plainview

by methodrampage on May 8, 2008 11:07 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

or sarcasim

which ever you prefer

I...drink...your...milkshake! I drink it up! - Daniel Plainview

by methodrampage on May 8, 2008 11:07 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Sarcasm

"He called the sh** POOP!" -- Adam Sandler

by JRPhillips on May 8, 2008 11:07 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

And yes it is

"He called the sh** POOP!" -- Adam Sandler

by JRPhillips on May 8, 2008 11:08 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

or sarcasm

even better yet

I...drink...your...milkshake! I drink it up! - Daniel Plainview

by methodrampage on May 8, 2008 11:08 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I find sarcasm online works best when you use wildly outlandish statements, all capa, and lots of exclamation points.

My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.

by howtheyscored on May 8, 2008 11:12 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

The problem is I’ve seen too many people who post comments online who think that Young was just a lousy quarterback, and many people have said Montana was only good because of the system. I’ve also seen people who claim that they are stating a fact, not an opinion on idiotic comments like these.

So when no attempt is actually made to show that what you’ve said wasn’t serious, well… Call me dense all you want, I say show me you’re kidding.

"He called the sh** POOP!" -- Adam Sandler

by JRPhillips on May 8, 2008 11:22 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

O RLY?!?!

There’s something to be said about subtlety. But I’ll give it a try.

Wildly Outlandish Statement (Sarcasm Attempt 1): “If you’re in disagreement with me…you are wrong.”
(Seems pretty outlandish to me, but the wildly-ness is questionable, but the use of bold was used which is a little more pleasant to read than caps)

Wildly Outlandish Statement (Sarcasm Attempt 2): “If you’re in disagreement with me…you ARE A DUMBASS AND DON’T KNOW SHITbecause I KNOW ALL(PERIOD)!!!!!!!!!!!(OR EXCLAMATION)!!!!!!!!!!!

I...drink...your...milkshake! I drink it up! - Daniel Plainview

by methodrampage on May 8, 2008 11:22 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Now you’re just being a dick. No offense.

"He called the sh** POOP!" -- Adam Sandler

by JRPhillips on May 8, 2008 11:28 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

WHOA!!!

My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.

by howtheyscored on May 8, 2008 11:28 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Hey Fooch it seems we've got an problem

In order to help JRPhillips with his reading comprehension I motion that Niners Nation should adopt the following comment posting rules.

1. Opinions, which are the vast majority of comments, shall be posted in regular font.
2. Facts shall be posted in bold font.
3. Jokes shall be posted in italics.

Sometimes special rules are needed for special people, I think all of you’d agree and if you don’t you are wrong.

I...drink...your...milkshake! I drink it up! - Daniel Plainview

by methodrampage on May 8, 2008 11:32 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

As the late, great John Candy once said...

Whoa, hostile AND intolerant. That’s borderline criminal, you know!

"He called the sh** POOP!" -- Adam Sandler

by JRPhillips on May 8, 2008 11:34 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Just trying to help you out, I'm here for you

Ah, good, I’m glad that title was bolded. Well at least I’m conforming to the new JRPhillips posting rules.

I...drink...your...milkshake! I drink it up! - Daniel Plainview

by methodrampage on May 8, 2008 11:37 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Garcia is beating out Y.A. Tittle!!!

4 to 3!

"He called the sh** POOP!" -- Adam Sandler

by JRPhillips on May 7, 2008 5:29 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

I’ll go vote on my home computer for Tittle to try and amend this travesty a little.

Ballot stuffing FTW!

Neglectful father of David Quinowski

by marcello on May 7, 2008 6:12 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

easy everybody

This discussion of sarcasm and fact is fine but no calling people dumbasses and general insulting…

Niners Nation - The premier 49ers blog on the Internet!

by Fooch on May 8, 2008 1:19 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

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