Second Guessing
by hudd07 on Oct 23, 2009 11:34 AM PDT
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PrintIs anyone else starting to second guess what the Niners are doing here? I want to open this up for discussion because by keeping up with all the posts I feel like the Niners are making some big mistakes, and due to the fact that it's spread out over 15 posts it's getting a bit watered down. Let's see if I can hit each one individually after the jump....
Rossum being let go. While he isn't Joshua Cribbs or Darren Sproles, he is however, far and away our BEST option to return kicks and punts. I know he has been hurt, but we have absolutely NOBODY waiting in the wings. It's like cutting all of our QBs because they are so so. Then putting Barry Sims back as QB. Which brings me to....
Sheets being allowed to leave. Ok, so he has problems with pass blocking MAYBE. Does anyone here think Sproles is the best pass blocking RB in the league? NO. However he sees a LOT of playing time in KR and PR duties, in running plays, screen passes etc....Who says that Sheets has to come in on a play where he has to pass block? Why can't he come in on a running play, or on a screen pass play, or why can't he be our Joshua Cribbs and return kicks which he has more history of doing than Coffee. We have no RB on the roster who can take it to the house. Have you guys seen Duplicity with Michael Keaton? Our Running Backs are like that movie. We have Gore, then Gore cloned whom is worse than Gore (ie Coffee), than that guy cloned who is worse is Robinson. It seems like we built our RB based off the same type of runner, just not as good. Where is our Sproles, our Leon Washington, our Steve Slaton, our Chris Johnson, our Ray Rice? I mean we don't have any homerun hitters on this team. Bad decision to let Sheets go unless we grab Javhid Best next year.
Brandon Jones signing in Free Agency. Reports are that the Niners staff didn't want him so why sign him? I get it, we didn't know Crabtree would be available, and we didn't know that Bruce would come back, but why sign a #3 WR on a running team, and pay him like our #1? Why have a WR that is FAST and a downfield runner, when our QB can't throw the ball further than 30 yds without it coming down like a punt (thanks Morgan, that was funny). Why not go after Housh? Ok, so now that we have him, let's see what he can do. I get it that he has been injured, but he HAS to be better than Battle, let's let Jones see the field on 3 WR formations at least.
Chilo Rachel draft pick. Can you say lost? Talented yes, but get a clue buddy. Right tackle leaves a guy for Chilo to block and the dude wanders 4 yards away blocking air. Give me a break.
Kentwan Balmer draft pick. Who? Exactly, has the guy even seen the field lately? When he does, is he even disruptive because god knows he isn't making any tackles.
Marvel Smith signing. I liked the signing and thought we could've potentially gotten a Pro Bowl RT on the cheap. That's not my concern, but not having a contingency plan in place has really hurt us. We are a running team, playing our backup Guard at RT. You build a running team with a SOLID starting oline, with lots of depth. Another huge oversight by the Niners.
Jimmy Raye hiring. I'm not so upset with the hiring. I really don't think we had anywhere else to turn to since nobody wanted to come here. I just think maybe Singletary was so hell bent on his beliefs with the offense nobody would come here and put their reputation on the line if they couldn't use their own vision of the offense. With Raye, the real problem I have is that he telegraphs everything we are gonna do. Hey guys, we are gonna run the ball, go ahead and put 9 in the box, we will still run it. Then, he actually DOES run it. Cmon Raye, let's throw the ball, make them pay for stacking the box. Every other team allows their QB to audible into a passing play when there is 9 in the box, however, we are so stuck in our ways that we run anyways. I just see a lack of adjustment by Raye. I don't think he is doing a good enough job of seeing what works and what doesn't, and adjusting his game plan accordingly.
Coffee pick. I was upset when we grabbed Coffee. Why do we need another Frank Gore? We have Gore already. I thought the reason for your #2 RB was as a change of pace back. See the players I mentioned above. For every LenDale White, there is a Chris Johnson. For every Jerome Bettis, there was a Willie Parker. Every Thomas Jones, a Leon Washington. I just don't get this pickup. It's easy now in hindsight to second guess this pick since he is the worst RB in the league but it didn't make sense at the time either. I was hoping for an explosive back, someone that could take it to the house, instead we built our offense around what is on the field currently. An offense that has a hard time putting up 14 points on the Rams. An offense that is top 5 in the league in sacks again. This coming from an Offensive Line that Coach Sing said could be the premiere line in the league.
Now guys, don't blow up on me here. I am a DIE HARD Niners fan, and I know they have made a LOT of good moves with Crabtree, Willis, Staley, Singletary, etc....Its just that I love this forum and it's ability to bounce thoughts and ideas off of each other. I just wanted to build a post where we can discuss some of the moves the Niners have been making recently that I have, and I'm sure others have been second guessing. I know a lot of us are drinking the Kool Aid and thinking, hey we are winning, but I think there are some moves being made that leave lots to be desired.
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of Niners Nation's writers or editors. It does reflect the views of this particular fan though, which is as important as the views of Niners Nation's writers or editors.
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i completely agree
with every point you have made. my single biggest irritation is the Raye hiring he reminds me of my high school football coach who ran bubble screens(really?) and had suspect playcalling (cost us two division champs). Let’s bring in somebody else PLEASE… sherm “B5” lewis anybody?
B-I-N-G-O....lol
I’m praying that Raye is just keeping the seat warm for when Turner get’s fired this year.
I Am Not Too Upset With The Rossum Release
but the decision to have Coffee return kicks baffles me. Spurlock showed the ability to return kicks with Tampa Bay, taking two to the house in one season. Why not give him a chance?
Regarding Kory Sheets. Well he was on our practice squad and Miami decided to put him on their active roster, it’s not that we gave him away or something. He hasn’t showed the ability to block or be consistent in the run game so there was no room for him on the active roster. As much as i would have liked to hide him on the practice squad to get more seasoning that just wasn’t going to happen. To me it is more about the league needing to change the practice squad rules when it comes to first year players.
I also questioned the Raye hiring from the outset, i have no idea why we decided to go in that direction, especially when there were so many option out there. But now we are stuck with him and must live with it. Lets hope he changes it up a little bit after the bye week, i know Singletary has his ear.
Marvel Smith was a low risk high reward signing, i just think the 49ers overestimated Snyder’s ability. But in reality the signing of Tony Pashos cancels and mistake we may think the Smith signing may have been.
"Cannot play with them. Cannot win with them. Cannot coach with them. Can't do it. I want winners. I want people that want to win!!!"
by nocal81(Vincent) on Oct 23, 2009 11:58 AM PDT reply actions
I too didn't like the Raye hire
But what other options were there that we didn’t take>
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
Brandon Jones signing in Free Agency. Reports are that the Niners staff didn’t want him so why sign him?
I don’t think the staff didn’t want him. I think the reports were originally that there was ONE assistant who wasn’t happy about the signing because the FO didn’t approach him for his opinion. Also, the last game was the first game Jones was back and playing, and he actually got on the field, if I’m not mistaken. He just didn’t have anything thrown his way (much like most of the 49ers WR group).
Chilo Rachel draft pick. Can you say lost?
He’s in his second year after leaving college a year early. Lost or not, he’s more than likely the 49ers best option inside until Adam Snyder proves otherwise. Yes, people would LOVE for their draft picks to work out, but please wait more than one season before judging a draftee, yeah?
I thought the reason for your #2 RB was as a change of pace back.
You could look at it that way, or you can look at it a multitude of other was. A #2 back, a true back up, should be someone who can step in and not alter the game plan. Coffee is like a poor man’s Gore because maybe the plan is to have the offense not change when Gore isn’t around. Yes, Coffee is lost, but again, give a draftee some time before blasting them.
I don’t want to sound like a 49ers apologist or anything, so please don’t take my comments/responses that way. I totally understand the 49ers are struggling right now, but I don’t think it was all that unexpected. The 49ers are a VERY young team, and young teams are inconsistent. Chilo Rachal is a perfect example of this. Toward the end of last season, he improved the offensive line play. So much so that fans were calling for him to be a starter again. However, he starts to show his age and now so many people are blasting him for it.
I agree that I think the 49ers screwed up by letting Rossum and not Spurlock go. However, I still can’t knock the Jones signing until I see him healthy and on the field again. With the impending disappearances of Bruce and Battle, I don’t think the WR group is going to be as crowded in a few months. Also, the 49ers signed Jones because he could stretch the field. Maybe they did that because they already realized toward the end of last season that Jason Hill may not cut it? Hill basically disappeared off the face of the Earth, and while I’d love to see him succeed, I trust the judgment of the people who have seen him day in and day out for the past three to five months.
The only move I truly question is still the Rossum move. The other ones are still in the “too early to tell” category. As has been pointed out previously, I don’t mind that they cut Rossum. What I’m peeved about is the fact they cut him because he wasn’t “versatile” while a guy like Spurlock (who supposedly is “versatile”) isn’t returning kicks instead.
Maybe I’m just not as inclined to think the sky is falling, or something.
I don't feel
that the sky is falling by any means. I’m just starting to second guess some of the moves the Niners have been making. Ok, so let’s sign Jones because he can stretch the field, do we have a QB that can get him the ball, or an oline that will give him enough time to throw downfield?
As for Coffee, I don’t even think he is the poor man’s version of Gore. Coffee is horrible right now. Worst in the league per Football Outsiders. Maybe he will get better, but a LOT of rookie running backs have managed to turn the corner. Coffee I’m not so sure can do that.
Coffee
I didn’t mean to imply he was a poor man’s Gore right now. I was just saying he was drafted to be that. I understand a lot of rookie running backs contribute their first year, but I guess I’m just not ready to give up on a player a few weeks in, even if he has looked pretty dang bad.
Don't judge any RB behind this line
There isn’t an RB in the league who can be successful when the offensive line doesn’t make holes for him.
I completely agree with your assessment
And wonder how many of us and experts would feel about this team, same players and coaches, if we don’t get burned by a miracle catch in Minnesota? Yes, I know that we did. But perception quickly becomes reality even when we’re 30% into a season but with a winning record and everyone knew coming in that his was not a SB team.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
Even if we are 5-0
does that keep you from making bad decisions. I think a 5-0 team can still make some questionable decisions. I don’t think our record has anything to do with me, or any others second guessing our team. The fact is, I don’t agree with some of the moves we have made recently, and I am second guessing them. Regardless of whether we are 5-0, or 3-2, our decisions are questionable. The Eagles are typically NFC East Champs, that doesn’t stop people from questioning the Vick pick up. Just don’t think the record has as much to do with it as you think.
Didn't say you couldn't or shouldn't
I was talking about perception. If we’re 4-1, decisons seem better because the wins show that something is working, certainly better than a possible alternative. If we’re not winning, it’s easy to question almost anything even if the made decisions were better than the alternative.
I think it’s too soon in the season, and in regards to specific decisions like Sheets and Rachal, to make an intelligent assessment one way or the other. Questioning Rossum, Marvel Smith, drafting of Bass, those do make sense. IMO.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
gotcha
Even with our wins however, I feel like we can easily question the 7 WRs we are carrying and 3 RBs if you even call Coffee and Robinson a RB. I don’t think the wins can mask how bad our offense looks, how bad the play of the offense is, etc…Even though we have 3 wins, our offense just isn’t clicking.
Yes
Question away (please media) as to why we have 7 WRs on the roster. There may very well be a great reason and if so I ’d like to hear it. Especially since none of the 7, except Spurlock I guess, is a return-man.
I also happily question the progress of the offense, be that questioning Raye, the line, the line coach, and/or the QB. I was happy that Sing hinted that Smith could play if Hill does not perform well. I’d now like to hear about the resume of our o-line coach (please media) and what he’s doing to improve this unit. Are most of them that bad or is the coaching not helping them show what they can do.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
Funny you said to question the media....
I posted on Barrows blog a couple hours ago asking him to be the voice for us fans and question those exact things….
On 49ers.com interview Singletary addressed the 7 WR's on the roster
He keeps them to keep our starters off of special teams. We are light at LB and he doesn’t want players that get defensive playing ime in those positions. It makes sense because the D-Backs after 3rd CB suck as well as backup safeties.
"Optimist Prime"
"Child Please" -Ochocinco
It's the Shogun of no fun
WR's are better on ST than RBs? Or extra LBs?
So why the WR’s though? You can only have so many gunners on STs.
We (or at least I) have been second guessing them for a long time now
The Rossum release:
A bonehead move.
He wasn’t injured. He was released because they couldn’t use him in any other roles other than KR/PR.
Sheets to Miami:
This isn’t really on the 49ers.
Miami has the perfect offensive system for RBs.
RBs don’t have to block out of the wildcat.
Brandon Jones:
I was actually on board with this when it happened.
Right now I still think it was a good move, BUT they’re not even using him.
I’m pissed because he’s not being used, not because he was signed.
Chilo Rachal:
I’m not going to crap on Rachal.
Instead I’m going to crap on Scott McCloughan.
Rachal isn’t the only lineman that Scotty has drafted: David Baas is no good, and Cody Wallace has shown ZERO signs of improvement.
Kentwan Balmer:
You can’t really insult the pick.
Issac Sopoaga has played very well this season and there is no playing time left for Balmer.
If they decide to move Issac to NT next season, Balmer will get more playing time.
Marvel Smith:
If you want to second guess someone for this pick up, second guess the doctors that gave him his physical.
Jimmy Raye:
We all knew he wasn’t very good when he was brought in. I don’t see why we are all so surprised.
Scot Linehan didn’t want to come here so we were in a hole.
I am still holding out hope that Mike Johnson (the QB coach) can replace Raye soon.
He has play calling experience and he might actually have a brain.
Coffee:
He’s a rookie.
We can’t judge him just yet.
Final thoughts:
I don’t exactly like where the team is going. It looks like they’re trying to become the Baltimore Ravens. When they probably should be trying to model the New York Giants.
I actually thought Mike SIngletary could take on a role similar to Tom Coughlin.
Of course, Tom Coughlin has Jerry Reese…..so he actually has talent to work with.
What we've got here is a failure to communicate.
agree on so much here..Sheets i think though is on the Niners i think because they could have moved him up instead of letting him go..we could have used him for at least PR and KR’s IMO if they are gonna use coffee in that way.
Judgment day is coming!
I agree with Sheets, I think it's on the Niners.
Do we keep 7 WRs when we are a running team or do we keep another RB? Do we keep that RB, elevate him to the squad, knowing that we are going to release the only KR we have?
As for Raye, I feel ya, he was all we could get, but cmon guy, let’s adjust the play calling a little bit. Instead of bringing 2 TE sets, and leaving a RB to block, let’s run screen passes, or quick slants. We don’t always have to protect the QB for 7 seconds. We just have to execute the play before the rush gets there.
I don't like Raye
But I think he’s called more of these plays than you realize. They haven’t worked. Now, perhaps that’s on him for not having good formation variation, thus defenses know what’s coming. Or is it on the line for not blocking well enough for any of these things? Or is Hill not seeing/able to hit open receivers down the field?
Raye is never going to coordinate a top 5 offense but I think his play calling has been more varied than we think. It’s that the results often end up the same regardless of what he calls: small gains, incomplete passes or tackles for a loss.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
If we can have their o-line and a top 10 QB
I think we would model NY. Coaches can only do what the talent allows.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
Who says we can't have their O-line?
If Scott McCloughan was half as talented at Jerry Reese he would be able to find good O-linemen and build a solid line in the mold of the Giant’s.
And Eli didn’t become top 10 until just recently.
What we've got here is a failure to communicate.
by SportsChicken on Oct 23, 2009 1:13 PM PDT up reply actions
Exactly
Our young players have to develop plus drafting a better Guard and Tackle. Wnd we need an upgrade long-term at QB. I didn’t say it would be easy. Even NY wasn’t what they now are four years ago.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
But the team isn't trying to be like the NYG
They’re modeling Baltimore.
Who had a terrible O-line, a mediocre QB, and a legendary defense.
What we've got here is a failure to communicate.
by SportsChicken on Oct 23, 2009 1:17 PM PDT up reply actions
I think that was Nolan's model
I don’t know that that is Sing’s. I believe he has a higher opinion of the QB position than Nolan. Remember, SIng’s great defenses in Chicago only won one SB in large part because of no consistency or game changer at QB. Yet the Niners and Redskins won more because of ability at those positions. No doubt he wants a top defense and solid running game. But I don’t think that makes him different than many coaches, especially those with a background in defense.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
We'll see where we are in 4 years....
What we've got here is a failure to communicate.
by SportsChicken on Oct 23, 2009 1:33 PM PDT up reply actions
QB
I don’t think Sing puts a high priority on QB so in this fact I agree with chik. Sing thinks we can go all the way with a game manager. While it’s possible, it’s not probable.
Possibly
I thnk he’d prefer a better QB but will not blast the guys on the team. He likes and appreciates Hill’s leadership and I think would like that kind of attitude with an Aaron Rodgers ability. I also think his focusing on the smarts of Hill was a way to tell Alex Smith what kind of leader he needs to be if he wants to have the job.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
Jimmy Raye
is, always was, and always will be a man without creativity. He will never be a good OC; his brain just doesn’t work that way!
I don't like second-guessing ...
… and almost all of those decisions made sense at the time.
Really, 70% of our team’s problems right now are that our O Line can’t run block to save their lives. Hopefully benching Rachal will solve that, but it may not.
Don’t evaluate draft picks – particularly linemen – too early. Rachal and Balmer may both end up with solid careers ahead of them. They may not. But we don’t know yet. That being said I agree with Chikmagnet … we’ve spent a lot of picks on linemen and not really gotten value for them yet.
Jones was a very reasonable signing. He’s not being paid like a #1 receiver.
Marvel is the most second-guessable pick, but it’s not clear that there was a better option available at the time for RT, once you’ve decided to take Crabs over Oher.
… and almost all of those decisions made sense at the time.
Very key quantifier there. Outside of the Rossum move (which I’m assuming you don’t think makes sense, so please correct me of I’m wrong), what (if any) other decisions didn’t make sense?
For me personally...
Letting Sheets go is a big one especially if we knew we were going to let Rossum go.
Raye signing didn’t make sense. Granted Linehan didn’t want to come here, but was it out of our control, or not? I feel like it was. I think Sing had it in his head the exact offense he wanted, and he couldn’t get any respectable OC to be willing to put their reputation on the line to run an offense circa 1960. Just my opinion…
Had Linehan come here
We’d be at about the same rankings and questioning the decision to hire him. He’s not dynamic and he’d have the same players as Raye. So really, we don’t want Raye or Linehan. Or most other people. Niner fans want someone from the Bill Walsh or Shanahan tree. I know I do. Before then, I’d take an upgrade in line and QB play(ers).
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
Disagree on Linehan
Dude has worked wonders for Detroit.
Their offense is much improved and can put up plenty of points when all of their key players are healthy.
What we've got here is a failure to communicate.
by SportsChicken on Oct 23, 2009 1:14 PM PDT up reply actions
We do disagree
I don’t see him as dynamic at all. His team averages less yards per play and points per game than we do yet has a better WR (Johnson) than any we’ve put on the field this year. And I don’t know but would guess his o-line has not played worse than ours.
Obviously we’ll never know but I don’t believe that our stats would be much if at all better and we’d still be unhappy with this offense.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
His O-line was supposed to be the worst in the NFL
He may not be “dynamic” but I just guess I see more in him than I do in Raye.
What we've got here is a failure to communicate.
by SportsChicken on Oct 23, 2009 1:26 PM PDT up reply actions
Yeah but Denver was supposed to be an awful and dysfunctional 3 win team
Preseaon predictions, especially when changes are made to the coaching staff, carry little weight.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
Denver
People just decided to forget that Denver had talent on the roster.
They have a beast OL…..
What we've got here is a failure to communicate.
by SportsChicken on Oct 23, 2009 1:35 PM PDT up reply actions
Denver had GREAT offense not just line
Defense was struggling and they remade that defense. Nolan has done a very good job there.
I know it wasn't just the line
But I didn’t feel like posting the names of all their talented players.
What we've got here is a failure to communicate.
by SportsChicken on Oct 23, 2009 1:54 PM PDT up reply actions
So are you saying...
that any OC here would not succeed with our staff or just Raye and Linehan couldn’t succeed with them?
Raye and Linehan couldn't
Or most of whom I recall being available. I would prefer that we hire someone from the Walsh and/or Shanahan tree. A young guy that could grow into the job. But I do understand Sing’s logic; he wanted someone who was experienced which lessened the options. With a young team and two avg QBs battling it out, he went with a “been there done that” guy.
The only veteran coach I would want, and wish Nolan would’ve hired one year earlier, is Cameron who’s now in Baltimore. He or Norv would be fine by me if we don’t hire a young guy from the Walsh offense.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
I'm still hoping Mike Johnson gets his shot soon
Maybe Jimmy Raye tires out after this year and lets Mike take over.
Besides that’s just what we need, more coaches named Michael!
What we've got here is a failure to communicate.
by SportsChicken on Oct 23, 2009 1:28 PM PDT up reply actions
This I would support
And hopefully, coaching under Raye has taught him some tricks of the trade as well as a bunch of what not to do. This experience can pay off on both ends.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
I like him because he has play-calling experience.
Plus, he’s the QB coach.
:)
What we've got here is a failure to communicate.
by SportsChicken on Oct 23, 2009 1:36 PM PDT up reply actions
LOL... Hey ever had a boss where you thought
When I’m in charge I will be sure to not do that. That is Raye at OC and Nolan at HC.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
I do think Sproles is a good blocker for a guy his size
And with his experience in the league and in the SD system, a rookie deserves zero comparison to him. If his ability to pick up the blitz and fit in the offense was not up to the coaches standards, fine by me. They know more than we do. He was still an undrafted rookie that no team picked up when he was waived.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
Waived? No team picked up?
Are you talking about Sheets? Granted he went undrafted but don’t think for a second we were the ONLY team talking to him. We were just the one that signed him. If the BEST rushing team in the league is willing to put him on their active roster than that’s good enough for me. I mean really, you think a Defensive Minded Coach (granted I LOVE Sing) and Raye who doesn’t even know which foot to put his shoes on know more about RB than Sparano and Parcells? And yes I know that Raye was the Jets RB Coach last year. But we don’t know who decided to let Sheets go. Maybe Sing didn’t want him, and Raye did. The point is, I think it was a mistake.
As for comparing Sheets to Sproles. In no way do I put them in the same league in terms of accomplishments, they have a similar skill set.
We waived Sheets at the end of preseason
He wasn’t claimed. We then signed him to the PS. All other 31 had a chance to grab him then and did not, not even to their PS.
Sparano and Parcells didn’t sign him then. They singned him because they’re RB is out for the year. If Gore or Coffee were out for the year, we likely would’ve elevated Sheets.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
End of preseason I forgot
However, during that time most teams are focused on their own players, and trimming their own roster. Not trying to grab other teams players. Especially RBs whom are a dime a dozen. Point is, Sheets has talent, I question the decision to let him go. If he is good enough for Miami, he was good enough to be elevated over Spurlock. I mean, what is his role with the offense again? How about J. Hill? Whether he can pass block or not, he brings more to the team, in MY eyes, than Spurlock or Hill. Obviously not in Sing’s eyes, and while I’m giving him the benefit of the doubt since god knows he knows more than me, I am still 2nd guessing that decision.
That I agree with
I understand why he wasn’t on the roster and have zero complant about that. I don’t understand his not being here in comparison to Spurlock being here. I guess it’s mostly a special teams coverage issue and I don’t want to minimize that, especially since we’ve had injuires to guys who excel at that. If Sheets can’t cover kicks and is a liability in blocking, he’s not doing enough as a 3rd string RB to justify a roster spot. But I would have enjoyed that risk over keeping Spurlock. At this point, I hope for our sake Spurlock does something memorable in a positive way to justify and earn his spot.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
Just seems like...
we have all these guys that can play special teams, but nothing else. Ulbrich, Robinson, Spurlock, Rossum, Hill….when do we get the guy that can score TD’s more than anything else. If we can keep a guy as ST depth, why can’t we keep a guy as RB depth, on a team, that wants to be a running team?
Fair point
But the running game, with Gore and Coffee, would look better with improved line play. That’s the real key to running. Shanahan had all those 1000 yard backs because of line play.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
agreed
but don’t you think Sheets could help? Sometimes beating a guy to the outside can negate bad blocking. Is Raye running up the middle because he doesn’t have a guy that can get to the corner? Or would he try to run Sheets between the tackles. I guess that’s a big question. I agree an oline would make it easier though.
If I recall, the touchdown that Coffee made was a run to the outside
"Whether you think you can, or you think you can't, either way, YOU'RE RIGHT !"
yes it was
but he also got caught. I can see a play like that going for a couple yards as his did, but to me, getting to the corner means being able to turn it upfield and run for 10 yards, not getting caught at the corner but using your momentum as you are falling to carry you into the end zone.
Just making a point. Raye is not afraid to run on the outside
I also would rather have seen Sheets in the backfield making plays like that.
"Whether you think you can, or you think you can't, either way, YOU'RE RIGHT !"
Watching SD on Monday night
Visually it looked like they and even Denver ran about the same type of running plays we do, based on hole location, with two exceptions: they block them better than we do. And their success means they ran more total plays overall thus it allows them to use more of their playbook.
Whether we run or pass on first down, we’re not having success and the majority of the time we end up in 3rd and long. We don’t very many opportunities, especially in the same drive, to call a variety of plays. I do think that if our runs were blocked better and Coffee utilized better vision on the cutbacks (or if Gore had just played) the run offense would look less basic.
That said, I still think Raye is part of the problem in that he does mix up formation variation. If you do that effectively, you can call the same plays and the defense won’t expect it.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
Spurlock can play on ST and apparently Sheets could not.
I think the coaches liked him enough to sign him to the practice squad to help build him into a pro RB.
Also, Sheets could not block and they need RBs to not only block on Passing plays but also running plays… the fact he could run like the wind was not enough to get him on the team.
By the way.. I liked him too and would have liked him on the team.
"Whether you think you can, or you think you can't, either way, YOU'RE RIGHT !"
Is Spurlock on ST?
I thought he was supposed to be back returning kicks and punts? What exactly does he do on special teams? I don’t believe he has registered any tackles…
Sheets couldn’t play special teams? Get ready to see him this sunday returning punts and kicks with Dolphins. Its up to him and Ginn and Sparano isn’t talking….
Pretty sure he's a gunner on punt coverage and KO
If I recall correctly, it was his lane that Harvin went through (he left his lane and got caught too far inside) for the KO-TD. Since he’s been on the inacitve list (twice I think) he’s obviously replaceable. I understand not wanting the starting LBs and CBs on coverage units so I guess they feel Spurlock is better than what we could sign at a different position. I certainly don’t see Sheets as a gunner so it would only be at returner that he would play ST.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
So, if Sheets were on the bench
would he do any worse than Spurlock? Seems to me that he left his lane per you, was partially responsible for the TD, and then is inactive. So, again, why is he on the team over Sheets? I think we are on the same page with that though right?
Instead we have our 2nd string TE returning kicks. And guys, don’t give me the whole, he was a WR in college and so he is fast, because he isnt’ fast enough to be a WR in the Pros, that’s why he is a TE and should NOT be running back KO and running end arounds like Raye has him doing.
We are on the same page about Spurlock
And I want either Sing or McClo asked about it. It doesn’t have to be singling out Spurlock but 7 WR on this roster while losing a seemingly talented (and fan favorite) rookie RB is deserving of clarification. I’d like to know why Spurlock is not retuning kicks. I’d also like to know if we asked Sheets to practice returning KOs and if we felt he did well at it in college.
Perhaps even a question asking if kick-returner will be a high priority this coming offseason, just to get it on record, because even if we had kept Sheets or Rossum, the position could use one guy to lead the way and be in the top half of the league for years to come.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
That end around went for a first
We play to get 1st down after 1st down in every game. How can you knock a play that got us ten yards? The main reason he sholdn’t be on KR is the chance at injury especially since we have only two TE’s
"Optimist Prime"
"Child Please" -Ochocinco
It's the Shogun of no fun
I'm not knocking the play...
I’m knocking who ran it. Granted it got 10 yards but does it get more if Morgan does it instead?
What I don't understand is wy people are ragging on Raye and Sing and McBooFoo
For the acquisitions being made. If Shaun Hill is your best option(best chance to win) and his achilles hill is downfield passing, maybe we have to reserve the finger pointing when we pass up on a better option at QB. Raye understands what Hill is weak at, hence SOME of the playcalling woes. He’s a little too old fashion, but if he were a great OC he’’d be a head coach somewhere and not an OC. There are OC’s that match what Sing wants they’re just employed at the time. (see any team with a balanced attack)
We’re not run happy, we play field position, and we are being built like the Ravens of old. However they had several trips to the playoffs during their run. Imagine there was a good QB here, our offense would look 10 times better. Remember we were 7-9 last year with one of the easiest Schedules in the league. We are 3-2 and the schedule isn’t weak it just isn’t HARD at least not yet. We have some tough games coming up and it will easily let us know where we stand.
My biggest problem remains to be the Crabtree pick. Yeah he could be a HOF WR but when will we know? We could have traded down that pick and picked up another 2nd along with a late first and bulstered the line this season, and still made the deal with the panthers. We could have drafted our lineman last year (RT) but didn’t because of the Crabtree pick. This kid better be the real deal. If he falls on his face, I can imagine the jibberish that will be on this site.
Hud07 …….Absolutely marvelous Post
-The Heckler
"Optimist Prime"
"Child Please" -Ochocinco
It's the Shogun of no fun
Thanks Lott
I am not against the Crabtree pick. He is believed to be by MANY NFL execs the best talent in the draft. I think we need his game breaking ability BADLY.
As for QB, you are VERY correct. If we pass on QB in this draft. I’m gonna go beserk.
I'm ragging on McBooFoo
Because of the OL picks he has made.
Only Staley has panned out.
Maybe it’s the scouts (I doubt it), but this teams just loves drafting fat and slow-footed interior linemen with high picks.
I’m disappointed with us trying to become the Baltimore Ravens of the past. They had a terrible offensive line and just a below average offense in general.
What we've got here is a failure to communicate.
by SportsChicken on Oct 23, 2009 7:44 PM PDT up reply actions
Or maybe it's the o-line coach too
We could get better talent but the position coach is a question mark.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
The o-line coach and draft picks have to be syncronized
Typically the offensive coordinator and o-line coach will provide a profile of lineman to acquire. If Bobb McKittrick were to walk through the door he’d scream at Mc Boo Foo to stop drafting fat, slow footed lineman.
He'd also design better running plays for Raye
Since he designed those for Walsh.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
Mckit designed the run plays?
Not debating you here just didn’t know that. I agree that the OL coach doesn’t seem to be good but that is on the previous coach isn’t it? I think the OL coach should be fired. The OC no because we want at least some continuity for one year please. Not saying Jimmie Joe Raye whatever is good or bad just want some consistency.
by ChesapeakeBay9er on Oct 24, 2009 2:18 PM PDT up reply actions
I read that a few places but have no links
McKittrick designed the run plays and Walsh the pass plays. He then of course made all in-game play calls. I think there are some o-line coaches, the best of the best, that have done this but I could be wrong. It’s interesting to think of designing a run play based on formation, down and distance, defenses’ tendencies, blocking scheme, etc. I think one of our problems this season is not the type of funning plays that have been called but the lack of variation in formation from which they are run. Defenses know it’s a run and know where it will be run. I think Norv was/is very good at disguising this.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
THE O-Line in Baltimore was fine, I thought it was the play calling and QB
"Optimist Prime"
"Child Please" -Ochocinco
It's the Shogun of no fun
No, the O-line sucked
What we've got here is a failure to communicate.
by SportsChicken on Oct 25, 2009 7:53 PM PDT up reply actions
How about this for our 2010 starting offense:
QB – Nate Davis
T – Marcus McNeil (FA from SD)
G – Daryn College
C – Eric Heitmann
G – Chilo Rachal
T – Tony Pashos
RB – Frank Gore
FB – Moran Norris
TE – Vernon Davis
WR – Michael Crabtree, Josh Morgan
I don't dislike it. But in a way I do.
But what about Staley? He’s not that bad really I think you’re discounting him.
Picking up Pash for another year makes a bit of sense. Chilo is possible at RG but you have to have the option of Snyder in there. He should probably be the starting RG and backup RT (and possibly LT).
So then you have:
LT Staley or McNeil whichever wins it in camp.
LG Colledge (or Jahri or Mankins or a few others)
C Eric Heitmann
RG Snyder with Chilo in the wings.
RT Whichever doesn’t get the LT spot with Pashos as backup
plus you try to pick up a G and a T in the draft.
by ChesapeakeBay9er on Oct 24, 2009 2:25 PM PDT up reply actions
Your line is ugly.
Pashos isn’t that good. Colledge isn’t that good, from what little I’ve seen of him. He’s missed almost as many blocks as Rachal would in the couple of Green Bay games I’ve watched. GB’s line isn’t any better than SF’s, and Colledge is part of it. Hopefully, there’s somebody else available when it’s time to sign a new guard. I’d also get rid of Rachal. He’s David Baas, Jr. Staley’s probably the best lineman on the 49ers right now, and you start Pashos over him? I also don’t think Nate Davis will be ready for primetime by the 2010 season opener. If McNeil could be signed away from San Diego, that would probably be a good move. Let’s hope McCloughan makes fixing the line a bigger priority than he has been.
No kidding on Mcneil and Collage
The Chargers OL looks like poo as well, and I wouldn’t want the money invested there. Lt can’t run in either direction and MCNeil owns one side. We need inept study of prospects and we also need to be active in trading picks from the first. We should trade both of our first rounders if we can’t get exactly who we want.
"Optimist Prime"
"Child Please" -Ochocinco
It's the Shogun of no fun
Yep Colledge would be the bottom rung of choices for guard
I think we have a chance at having the following available in FA Mankins from NE and Jahri Evans from NO and after that we seem to only next have Colledge unless someone else knows of any guys that will be good and will be FA next year most probably.
As far as LT yeah keep Staley there as he seems the only solid part of the line to any degree besides Eric at Center. Snyder should be ok at RG and hopefully with Seasoning Chilo might be able to turn into something. I could be wrong but we can’t let him go because we would take a hit for releasing him early. If I’m wrong about that then let me know. If anyone else knows of any good OT candidates other than McNeill let’s toss them out there. Looking in my notes I don’t have anyone but that means nothing in the scheme of things LOL.
Though I often agree with your viewpoints lott I have to disagree with the concept of giving up both 1sts to get a good FA OT (or a good FA OT and OG if that’s what you’re saying). Think of it this way. Would you be willing to give up a chance at Berry to get that? I just think we can handle that in other ways without giving up valuable booty that we need to get some people we need in more than one area.
by ChesapeakeBay9er on Oct 25, 2009 7:05 AM PDT up reply actions
we won't have to give up our picks to get a good OT in FA
I would not be afraid of accumulating picks in the draft by trading down. We need pretty much a whole new OL and depth.
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