49ers 10 - Bears 6: A clinic in not finishing
The 49ers basically showed they could "finish" twice in yesterday's game. Of course they finished the game with Michael Lewis's interception to clinch the game. They also finished after Tarell Brown's interception return, when Frank Gore plowed into the end zone on the first play of the subsequent drive for a 14-yard touchdown run. The series leading up to the game-clinching interception was pretty rough, but they did manage to finish the game there. Before I go on, I would like to say that I actually almost screamed out in class as Lewis made that interception. I was in a class where folks were basically providing group presentations so I was free to watch the game in the back. It was certainly an interesting experience.
But back to finishing. While it's nice that the 49ers were able to finish in those two situations, they struggled immensely the rest of the time in finishing things off. "Finish" is #5 in Mike Singletary's Formula for success, and this might be the biggest issue for the team. I suppose one could argue winning the battle in the trenches is a major problem, but we'll stick with finishing for now.
This game might have been a microcosm of the 49ers problems in finishing. People will point to only getting 10 points off of the 5 turnovers, and that is certainly a problem. The team simply must convert more points on that many turnovers. There is no reason this game should have gone down to the wire. NO reason. The Bears handed this game to the 49ers on a silver platter, and the 49ers did all they could to drop that platter.
However, as big an issue as not converting turnovers was, it was an issue whenever they had decent field position. For example, after the Bears opened the game with a three and out, the 49ers offense moved the ball down to the 21 before stalling out. Joe Nedney missed the subsequent field goal, which obviously nobody likes. However, when you're starting on your own 41, as the 49ers did, and the offense is moving the ball fairly well, they simply need to produce touchdowns.
Early in the second half, Dashon Goldson intercepted Jay Cutler and set the 49ers offense up on the Chicago 43 yard line. Five plays later the 49ers turned it over on downs after being able to convert a 4th and short. And they were actually bailed out after a Smith interception here thanks to an offsides call. Good teams make their opponents pay for mistakes like that. The 49ers did not.
I'm not here to complain too much because the 49ers did manage to win. And when you've lost four straight, a win is a win is a win. The 49ers desperately needed a win, not only to keep their playoff hopes alive, but also to maintain some semblance of confidence about what they could do as a team.
However, the lack of finishing ability throughout the game, and generally seen this season is certainly disconcerting. One could simply blame the play-calling or the offensive-line. However, the team has shown it can move the ball somewhat effectively at times. So why can't they put folks away? One could look back at the Indianapolis game as a sign of this problem. The defense was holding Peyton Manning in check, but the offense couldn't do enough on their side of things to take advantage of great defense.
This is an issue in terms of individual drives, and also games as a whole. When the team is exposing their throat to you, you simply have to be able to go for that jugular. The 49ers had opportunities to decimate the Bears, and they simply could not convert. The 49ers won, and in the end I suppose that's all that matters. But they don't get a home game against Jay Cutler every week!
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I think we just redeemed all the good karma we had from losing the vikings and colts game
to win this one. now we’re back to square one
by foosball4949 on Nov 13, 2009 8:44 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
I think "finishing"...
…is overrated. It would be one thing if we’d been decimated week after week. But we’ve been putting ourselves in position to win most weeks. I maintain a lot of this is bad luck, and eventually things will break our way like they did last night.
by Bigmouth on Nov 13, 2009 8:53 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
Pretty much echoes what I said
though I was referring specifically to the last Niner drive of the game in the 4th quarter.
Yes, it’s wonderful they chewed up 7 minutes of clock when there were only 9 minutes left in the game. However, it’s nothing short of inexcusable to not put points on the board there. When even a field goal puts you up 7 points, you’ve GOT to walk away with that much, at least. A touchdown clinches the game, sure, but coming up with a goose egg there gave Chicago the chance to run their 2 minute drill and try to steal the win.
I konw, everybody will say ‘BUT WTF WE WON AND IT WAS A GREAT SOLID 7 MINUTE DRIVE’ and then I’d point to the Indy game and the Minnesota game as 2 more examples of lost opportunities to finish games out.
They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick
by mikev on Nov 13, 2009 9:03 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
Finishing the game
I think both sides are doing what they can with the pieces they have to finish the game. The problem is that we are missing some vital pieces still to be able to put together a solid performance.
Our OL is not stellar to begin with and with the injury it is hurt even more which in turn means more pressure quicker on the QB and less holes for the RB which means less routes completed and less catches which means less 1st downs which means more defense on the field…well, you see where this is going. Especially if you watched last night.
I dont; think this is something that will change for the rest of the year unfortunately. Can we try and scheme it better? sure but no matter how you dress it up…it is still the same underneath.
by 9erEast on Nov 13, 2009 9:38 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
a great quote about Bill Walsh
whom I know Jimmy Raye is clearly not…but take away the important part:
(paraphrased quote by a former player)
“He didn’t want us to go out there and show who was the bigger guy…the tougher guy…the better guy…No he wanted us to go out there and be the SMARTER guy”
There’s always a vulnerable spot of the defense and a way to exploit it. We have to improve on that. It’s ever changing. We have to keep switching it up so they never know, they think one thing we do another…that’s how you beat defenses when you might not have the best team.
by Tre9er on Nov 13, 2009 11:28 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
granted Walsh's teams were pretty good
so don’t misread that part.
by Tre9er on Nov 13, 2009 11:28 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Walsh/Offense
The reason Walsh’s teams were great on offense was a combination of talent and innovation. Talent we have some, innovation we lack. Players will play up to and beyond expectations given the opportunity. Its up to the coachs to give them that opportunity.
by ninersnailem85 on Nov 13, 2009 8:19 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
tomayto, tomahto
you say innovation, kinda what i was saying…outsmarting the defense with play calling…obviously, we don’t have that…yet.
by Tre9er on Nov 14, 2009 6:44 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
OLine
This to me is the biggest problem for us. Even though Vernon Davis stated the DLine on the Bears were weak, I thought they did a good job of dominating our OL. Many times I saw Gore get hit behind line of scrimmage, and one play stood out to me where Davis got manhandled and missed a block. Sando stated that he hasn’t looked as dominating blocking this year and I agree with that.
Until our OL dominates the line of scrimmage we can’t “finish”. If we are forced to pass the ball when we are on a clock killing drive at the end of the game, we won’t win. We can’t put the game on Smith’s shoulders because frankly, he looks like a deer in headlights out there. Not to mention, it’s pretty obvious that Raye and Sing don’t trust him, with good reason. In order to finish, we either have to run the ball effectively when the D knows we are going to run, or we have to trust our QB to make the throws downfield and make the D pay for stacking the box inside of 4 minutes at the end of the game.
by hudd07 on Nov 13, 2009 9:44 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
I think it is more the OL Coach than the OL. the coach is who helps 5 linemen become an OL
That is not happening here. It hasn’t been happening even when Staley was still there.
The 49ers need to get an OL coach in there that knows what he is doing and is able to work with individuals to create a team in the OL.
"Whether you think you can, or you think you can't, either way, YOU'RE RIGHT !"
by Eastbayjim on Nov 13, 2009 11:10 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
+1 Deer in headlights.
Alex, Memo: get used to pressure. It’s not gonna change soon.
by Tre9er on Nov 13, 2009 11:30 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
They shouldn't have been in the mindset that they were "forced" to throw
or even that it was simply a clock killing drive.
Scoring a TD on that drive puts the game out of reach. THAT should have been the primary goal that drive. After that, it didn’t make a bit of difference what Chicago did, because we would have gotten the ball back with the lead and even less time left in the 4th quarter, at which point the actual clock killing should have started.
They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick
by mikev on Nov 13, 2009 1:25 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
do you really think
the Niners were content with that last drive? They passed on 3rd and 8 from the Bears’ 45! If they were content to run out the clock and punt, they’d have run again. They tried to get a first down and failed! All of their options were sort of equally crappy at that point:
go for it on 4th and 6 with a crappy offense
try a 53-yard field goal which only puts you up 7 (not 8)
try to pooch punt inside the 5.
Maybe they should have lined up, done a hard count, taken a delay of game to help Lee out… but the real problem is that they couldn’t stop the Bears from driving down the field with 2:47 minutes and 1 time out.
FIRE BRIAN SABEAN... UNLESS HE KEEPS DRAFTING WELL. .. AND SIGNS UNDERRATED PLAYERS LIKE AFFELDT OR PHELPS. .. OR ALRIGHT WHO'S PLAYING WITH THE ALIEN MIND-SWITCHING RAY?
-------
PARPG- Indy post-apocalyptic roleplaying game currently in early planning stages.
by zenbitz on Nov 13, 2009 1:34 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Jay Cutler was hilarious yesterday.
by Fearless Frog on Nov 13, 2009 10:01 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
what's going on FF?
Glad you could find as much humor in Cutler’s play as us Niners fans could!
by Andrew Davidson on Nov 13, 2009 10:11 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Field Gulls wanted us to trade for him.
by Fearless Frog on Nov 13, 2009 12:58 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Aaron Curry too?
What we've got here is a failure to communicate.
by chikmagnet_565 on Nov 13, 2009 1:43 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I now only know him by one name
CUTLOLER
"Pat is still just scratching the surface." - Coach Singletary on LB Patrick Willis
by 49erLou on Nov 13, 2009 11:09 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Right on point
This team still cannot finish games. Minn, Indy, now Chi. Frankly, if not for the poor surface of Candlestick, Niners lose this game.
I have supported Raye (against popular revolt), particularly with his play calling in the Titans game. Not so much on this one. Could we run some play action on first down? How about a play action off the Morgan motion counter play that the team has run 3-4 times each game since Gore busted two long ones on it against Seattle? Gore had a great game, but the team must find ways to push the ball down field.
by caslaw on Nov 13, 2009 10:19 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
Finishing
The two keys to finishing a game are having a top pass rusher(s) to stop an opponents drive and a O-line that allows you to run out the clock and/or put up a final score that wins the game or places it out of reach. We have neither. So it takes a collective effort to finish and any one mistake (INTs vs Titans, dropped INT vs MIN, etc) can be too much to overcome. There’s no one dominate phase to make up for a mistake somewhere else.
I do want to compliment Raye for the play calling on the final drive. Running out of the shotgun, utilizing Robinson wisely when Gore had played all game (no Coffee) and putting the Niners in position to run it out or at least add on points. They haven’t done that all season. One more first down gets us a FG, two more runs out the clock. It’s not is fault the line couldn’t block for Alex on the final pass play. Though the drive did not “finish” it still did more than any other in that circumstance this season and it left Chicago with only one possession to try for a win.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
by SpurredOn on Nov 13, 2009 10:33 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
As Far as Raye...
I totally agree! Despite the fact that Raye has opened up the offense as of late, his conservative play calling late in games has prevented us from closing the door on teams. Eventually he’s gonna have to trust the offense to close games out. I don’t care how good a defense is, if you keep giving teams multiple chances to win the game late, you’re gonna get burned eventually. I would love to see more play action and bootleg calls to throw teams off a bit more. I hope they make adjustments soon, because we wont be able to win like this against good teams.
by Jayhov on Nov 13, 2009 10:52 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
"you're gonna get burned eventually"
too late...×3
by Tre9er on Nov 13, 2009 11:32 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
do you think it might have anything to do with the offensive line
that he has to work with?
by zacksf on Nov 13, 2009 7:57 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
again
should we give up because we have a bad o-line?
we need to play to 9 point or greater leads. in other words, keep driving, keep trying to score until we have a two possession lead.
think about it. if we are a low scoring team, horrible on 3rd down…our defense is on the field the whole game. do we want to keep putting games in the hands of exhausted defenses?
by Tre9er on Nov 14, 2009 6:46 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Our pass rush this game was fantastic
All 5 interceptions came when Cutler had somebody in his face. He was hurried a bunch of times, hit a bunch of times, and had at least one pass knocked down and another tipped.
If we can get a consistent rush going (and don’t go into the [site decorum]ing prevent defense on last minute drives) we should have pretty good odds for the rest of the season.
by smileyman on Nov 13, 2009 11:11 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
not all five
not that I saw. Cutler threw two of picks without a defender close to him, maybe I missed it, but I’m pretty sure he wasn’t pressured on at least two of the picks. The pressure was good for most of the game though, I agree to that.
by Andrew Davidson on Nov 13, 2009 12:58 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
The pressure was okay
But when finishing a game, you’ll notice it guys like Freeney/Mathis, Ware, Harrison, Allen, etc that get the back-breaking sack. The one that comes on 4th down or makes 3rd & 7 become 4th & 15. We don’t have that. If we did, Favre doesn’t beat us, Cutler doesn’t get close to and we get one final possession against Indy.
I also don’t think we went prevent on that final drive. Don’t confuse success of the other team with assuming we went prevent. We opened that drive by forcing four straight incompletions, it’s just the refs gave Chicago an automatic first. We also blitzed on a few occassions and did give up yardage.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
by SpurredOn on Nov 13, 2009 4:37 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
In a 3-4 you need a killer linebacker
to enhance the pass rush. Somebody like Wilbur Marshall (or Haley).
I mean I know we were rushing 4 or more in those situations anyway, but I am not sure if we have the people who can really put on serious crunch time pressure.
by zacksf on Nov 13, 2009 8:00 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Exactly
We need that one guy, which every team wants, who gets 12-16 sacks every season even while being double-teamed. The kind of player that other teams game plan around, chip with a back and keep extra players in to help with him on long yardage. It opens up rush opportunities for other players and provides the players who makes that winning play on defense just as a QB can on offense. We definitely do no have that on the roster this season and haven’t since the days of Doleman and Jackson before that. We haven’t developed our own since Haley.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
by SpurredOn on Nov 13, 2009 8:24 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
+100
been thinking of this. Lawson is quick, but he’s small. I’m not smart enough to decide who is on the roster next year, but I’m starting to think about this in the draft:
O-Tackle
Big time pass rusher, 4-3 DE probably who plays OLB and primarily rushes the passer except for some exotic packages.
Maybe we can get one in FA…but I think we need a pass rusher, a stud, a Freeney type.
by Tre9er on Nov 14, 2009 6:50 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe a smallish DE
to play OLB during pass rush situations?
by smileyman on Nov 14, 2009 11:31 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Everette Brown fits that profile..
by Fearless Frog on Nov 14, 2009 7:26 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Of course I just realized
that Manny Lawson played DE in college, so we already have that smallish DE to play OLB, and that’s not working out so hot.
by smileyman on Nov 14, 2009 10:28 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Favre wouldn't have beat us if we had serviceable DB's or a better scheme on the last play of the game.
"Optimist Prime"
"Child Please" -Ochocinco
by rlott#42 on Nov 14, 2009 3:02 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
The whole last drive actually
Our DB’s were getting burned bad. They really need to work on their 2 minute drill.
by smileyman on Nov 14, 2009 4:13 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Or better pass rush.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
by SpurredOn on Nov 14, 2009 4:18 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
You can't really fault the DBs for the final play.
by Fearless Frog on Nov 14, 2009 7:27 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
The hell you can't the clocked went to 7 seconds and there was one throw to make
They needed to get their asses in the endzone and cover it
"Optimist Prime"
"Child Please" -Ochocinco
by rlott#42 on Nov 15, 2009 9:16 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
They were in the end zone
The receiver made an once in a lifetime catch with feet down. Sometimes there is no one to blame. Just gotta tip your cap through gritted teeth and move on.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
by SpurredOn on Nov 15, 2009 5:14 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
If the Niners scored three touchdowns in the first quarter
we wouldn’t be talking about finishing. We’d be talking about starting.
A lot of good things happen when you come out of the blocks firing. You put the other team at a great disadvantage and force them out of their gameplan. Your defense can take risks.
The Niners have an adequate defense, and Manusky strategizes pretty well. The problem is the offense, and unless Jimmy Raye can suit up and play left guard and left tackle at the same time I don’t think that there is much room to criticize the coaching.
Smith is the best option the team has at QB this year, but as long as the O line caves there won’t be much of a ground or passing game. Every game will be tough sledding because the offense is going to remain inconsistent.
by Bob On The Coast on Nov 13, 2009 10:44 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
Agree to Agree
You can’t get blood from a stone.
by kiyoshi on Nov 13, 2009 11:02 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Of course you can from SyFy and horror films... but not from most football games unless it is the Raiders
"Whether you think you can, or you think you can't, either way, YOU'RE RIGHT !"
by Eastbayjim on Nov 13, 2009 11:20 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Fair point
Which is why that first drive not getting any points hurt so much, especially with such a young offense trying to find an identity and confidence. They keep being one play away. Crabs dropped a catch for first and goal. Kevin Lynch is reporting that on the VD false start, Morgan was wide open on the pass play that would’ve been. Self-inflicted errors.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
by SpurredOn on Nov 13, 2009 4:39 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I agree also, oline is a big issue that won't go away
you have talented but inexperienced “skill players” trying to develop an offense and learn to work together in the context of a very banged up and weak oline. It is not going to be easy or pretty this year. I just hope we can continue to develop people like Alex Smith, Crabtree, Jason Hill, Josh Morgan etc.
We will see what they can really do next year when we have a stronger (much stronger I think) Oline.
by zacksf on Nov 13, 2009 8:06 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
We were LUCKY to get a win
And if we lost it would have been right on the coaches shoulders. The team cannot even get a first down when it needs one because they get so concerned with “we better run to make the other team use their timeouts” and that is BS! We need get a first down and keep moving in to score rather then run a running play on 2nd and 10 with about 3 minutes left. Raye doesnt know how to call the plays when we have a shot to hammer in the nail in the coffin.
by Quin on Nov 13, 2009 10:51 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
What are you talking about?
That final drive gained first downs and the final play was a pass attempt. Do you realy think the goal was not to get a first down? Did you also watch the Tennessee game and note what happens when the Niners don’t run Gore some when leading?
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
by SpurredOn on Nov 13, 2009 4:41 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
With a young team and a new coach, a smart fan
will NOT focus on wins and losses.
Walsh was 2-14 or something.
I would judge Sing on how he works with Vernon Davis, Patrick Willis, Crabs, Alex S., etc
(and i would give him an A+ just based on the 1st two players).
Do you think there is a coach who could have done a better job with Willis and V Davis?
by zacksf on Nov 13, 2009 8:10 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
About the play calling
You’re definitely right Fooch, our inability to step on the throat of the opponent when given the opportunity has been frustrating to say the least. This team seems to play either up or down to who they’re playing. They play tough against great teams (Vikings, Colts) while playing down to struggling ones (Bears, Cards, Ten).
My biggest complaint about that game was the play calling, although I like what Raye is trying to do. It wasn’t until 6:02 into the fourth quarter that the niners ran three of the same play (running vs passing) in a row. After two passing plays it seems obvious that a running play was coming, something the bears seems to be keying into as well. I understand they want to be a run-first offense, but mixing it up a little more would go a long way. Calling some play-action might have helped the rhythm, which is the second thing I noticed.. I didn’t see one play-action play called. Perhaps I missed it, but does anyone else recall seeing any?
by Spencer L on Nov 13, 2009 10:52 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
Sigh.
Titans – 24 points off four turnovers vs 49ers
49ers – 10 points off five turnovers vs Bears
You can never resist the game... nor could I... we're the same, so don't even try.
by Ninjames on Nov 13, 2009 11:04 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
sadness
"Pat is still just scratching the surface." - Coach Singletary on LB Patrick Willis
by 49erLou on Nov 13, 2009 11:10 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
No, Sadness would have been if the Bears has scored a touchdown in the end.
"Whether you think you can, or you think you can't, either way, YOU'RE RIGHT !"
by Eastbayjim on Nov 13, 2009 11:30 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
That would have marked the beginning of the end of Singletary.
What we've got here is a failure to communicate.
by chikmagnet_565 on Nov 13, 2009 1:44 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Probably the GM before Singletary. What has Singletary done wrong? He’s gotten the most out of those top picks. The bigger issue this season has been the positions the 49ers failed to address in the off season.
by bignerd on Nov 13, 2009 1:51 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
PLAY CALLING MUST NOT GO VANILLA!
We have to put teams away and we can’t do that by running the ball 90% of the time until we have to punt. We had a real opportunity to seal it or at least go up by a touchdown and yet we chose to run until we stalled past the 35 yard line. You have to have confidence in your offense to make plays. On top of that….the penalties at the wrong times nearly killed us. I must admit that the illegal hands penalty on 4th and 10 at the end of the game was very WEAK!
by LPG on Nov 13, 2009 11:31 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
Time to start a thread on this Vanilla Play Calling versus the so-called Spread
So far the team has won with the vanilla.
How come no one wants to admit the 49ers called a pass play on that final 3rd down? That wasn’t a conservative play call. They called a 3rd down pass play on the set of downs before. Both instances, no one was open.
by bignerd on Nov 13, 2009 11:38 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I admit it
i also admit that VD and Morgan were both wide open in the end zone. that was frustrating.
by Tre9er on Nov 13, 2009 11:44 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Also during that drive
On 3rd and 8 they called a wildcat run for Gore to the right side. I wouldn’t call that vanilla, either.
by Spencer L on Nov 13, 2009 11:48 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
One Dimensional!
Running 90% of the time is Vanilla/SAFE. Safe does not win ball games. We saw that against the Colts.
by LPG on Nov 13, 2009 6:50 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
It's like people must parrot analysis from six weeks ago
Are they even following this team? Claiming 90% runs? And acting as if passing on every play is the answer. Because that works for most teams and had worked for a whole 7 points in the first half.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
by SpurredOn on Nov 13, 2009 4:44 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Did I say passing every down is the answer? NOPE. I said that running every down is going to blow up in our face because it forces us to pass on 3rd and 5 instead of having the option if it were 3rd and 3 or lower. Are you following this team. It was 1 run play that scored the touchdown….not a whole series!
by LPG on Nov 13, 2009 6:53 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
well actually
that run play was the whole series. That series was 1 play, 14 yards, 1 TD.
and the team did not run 90% of the time yesterday, they had a balanced run/pass total. The only drive that saw a large difference was in the final drive of the 4th quarter, and the team was moving the ball well, eating up clock. If it wasn’t for poor pass protection, the 3rd down play may have resulted differently.
by Andrew Davidson on Nov 13, 2009 8:00 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Thank you.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
by SpurredOn on Nov 13, 2009 8:25 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Poor pass protection can be helped if we could have mixed it up before that.
Did not say they ran 90% of the game. I said they ran over 90% of the time that last drive. You back yourself in a hole when you do that and need to pass. All the other stuff you said pretty much copied what I said.
by LPG on Nov 13, 2009 9:37 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Again...
…it’s not the run/pass total that matters. What matters is the allocation of those runs and passes over the course of the game. Any “balance” that’s achieved should be the result of bias in favor of the pass for the first half, followed by bias in favor of the run for the second half (or after we get a lead). The fact that we waited until our very last drive to run out the clock was too risky.
Think about it in terms of investing in a stock portfolio over your life. When you’re young, it makes sense to invest in high-risk high-reward stocks because you have time to recoup any losses. Later in life, however, you should transition to low-risk low-reward investments because a loss would be catastrophic. The same is true of play-calling over the course of a game.
by Bigmouth on Nov 14, 2009 9:35 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Take a chance!
On 3rd and 5 you HAVE TO PASS! Come on man. Maybe if we would have passed on first or second down and taken a chance, we would have picked up the first and scored some points. This conservative crap is only going to bite us in the you know what in the long run. We have to put teams away!! If we can’t take a small chance, then there is no point in throwing our support towards any part of the passing game.
by LPG on Nov 13, 2009 6:48 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Or maybe we'd have been sacked and had 3rd and 15.
You can play that game all day. The drive was working with runs and and a few passes. If you think they can be successful by throwing on the early downs then you should also believe they can convert a 3rd and 5.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
by SpurredOn on Nov 13, 2009 8:29 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
The drive ran out.....how is that working? Almost is what almost lost the game for us
Can’t convert on 3rd and 5 when you know that the run on 3rd and short was not working all game and all season for the 49ers. So…yeah 3rd and 5 is easy to play when you know the 49ers are going to pass.
by LPG on Nov 13, 2009 9:33 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Actually the run on 3rd and short worked on that drive
So there was not guarantee the Niners would pass on third down. Yet when they did no on was open since Alex got pressure so quickly. Face it; you can want to pass more all you want but on Thursday night it was not working as much as you’d like to think it would have.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
by SpurredOn on Nov 13, 2009 11:45 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
And..............
when you run 8,9,10 straight times the 3rd and 5 pass is easy to see as a defense. We played into their hands by doing that. Passing and/or running only works with the happy mix so that defenses are on their toes.
by LPG on Nov 14, 2009 12:22 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Actually its not easy to see
Since another run is quite likely after so may runs on a successful drive. And your MMQB-ing wants Raye to have called pass plays over run plays that were successful. And then you assume the passes would have been successful as well. So instead of a near 7-minute drive, you seem to ignore that we could’ve had a 3-minute drive that ended with a punt, thus giving Chicago 2 possessions instead of one.
You can’t just snap your fingers and say “score again” and it happens. Of course the Niners wanted to score again. They were successfully driving to do so until the sack. On a pass play. Of which many had not worked since the first quarter.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
by SpurredOn on Nov 14, 2009 1:27 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
no clue....
you seriously don’t have a clue about what it takes to win on a long-term basis. All you can see is the present and that is sad. You know there is a team that fits your style perfectly. They’re called the DALLAS COWBOYS. So why don’t you get on board with that team that never gets it done in December to make it to January!
by LPG on Nov 14, 2009 6:50 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Coming from you I'll take that as a compliment
Since I’m looking at reality instead of a video game. But enjoy playing with your remote.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
by SpurredOn on Nov 15, 2009 5:16 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
You don't even make any sense.
That nonsense was the best you could come up with?? Please….now I know how ridiculous you really are. Don’t think too hard about your next reply. I don’t want you to hurt yourself.
by LPG on Nov 15, 2009 7:54 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Your childish tantrum shows you now know you have no argument
You coulda just admitted as much. Or let it drop. Gotta try and win one, right? Oh well, you lose again. Try again when you’re ready to make sense.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
by SpurredOn on Nov 15, 2009 9:45 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Whats the argument?
That you are an not the smartest crayon or that your opinions about this team really suck. There is not an argument about either one. No tantrums here….just stating facts. Just let me know if you can’t handle the truth next time.
by LPG on Nov 16, 2009 8:57 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I'll take your hurt feelings to mean that I hit the nerve of truth
On both the game strategy and you. Thank you.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
by SpurredOn on Nov 16, 2009 10:13 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
We've got a winner!
Say whatever you need to help you sleep at night. I’m done stooping down to your level.
by LPG on Nov 16, 2009 2:48 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
When you're ready to grow up
I’m happy to continue the original debate about running vs passing in end of game situations. Or not; after all it is a philosophy in which both have worked and failed.
You need only look back to your comment on Nov 14 @ 6:50 to see who first stooped to a low level. You took an opposing opinion personally. Grow up, then rejoin the debate about football.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
by SpurredOn on Nov 16, 2009 7:52 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Look harder and earlier..
Actually…look at the comment on Nov 13, 2009 5:44 PM MST to see who stooped. Why would I debate any more with you? There’s no point in debating with you. You want this team to fix it’s gaping wounds with band-aids just so we can get a quick fix. I just want them to keep defenses on their toes so that they don’t have their backs against a wall on 3rd down and long like they have all season. It just takes some good play calling along with the proper execution. 1st half play has been decent to good. 2nd half has been horrible. Can’t go into safe mode on O or D!
by LPG on Nov 17, 2009 3:54 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Totally disagree
We weren’t running enough at the end of the game. We do NOT want Smith throwing with the lead. We should be throwing more until we go ahead, then running out the clock. When Alex dropped back to pass on 3rd and 5 at the start of the 4th quarter, I was cringing.
On that note, I noticed we ran well out of the shotgun once again.
by Bigmouth on Nov 13, 2009 12:15 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
our final drive had
10 run plays, 2 pass plays.
by Andrew Davidson on Nov 13, 2009 12:59 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
and that was our best drive
48 yards. The reason the scoring/missed FG drives looked better is because the starting FP was much better.
FIRE BRIAN SABEAN... UNLESS HE KEEPS DRAFTING WELL. .. AND SIGNS UNDERRATED PLAYERS LIKE AFFELDT OR PHELPS. .. OR ALRIGHT WHO'S PLAYING WITH THE ALIEN MIND-SWITCHING RAY?
-------
PARPG- Indy post-apocalyptic roleplaying game currently in early planning stages.
by zenbitz on Nov 13, 2009 1:23 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
No problem there...
…it was the prior drives in the second half that made me nervous.
by Bigmouth on Nov 14, 2009 9:27 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
the stats support you on this...
you pass to take the lead, run to hold the lead…raye seems to have it backwards the past 2 games
by Florida Danny on Nov 13, 2009 1:20 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
well the last two games except the last one
where he opened up pass, then ran the ball with a 4 point lead at the end.
The problem is not (at least in this case) the stratergermy, it’s the fact that the lead they “ran up” was tiny, and that the defense couldn’t stop Cutler unless he handed them the ball.
FIRE BRIAN SABEAN... UNLESS HE KEEPS DRAFTING WELL. .. AND SIGNS UNDERRATED PLAYERS LIKE AFFELDT OR PHELPS. .. OR ALRIGHT WHO'S PLAYING WITH THE ALIEN MIND-SWITCHING RAY?
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PARPG- Indy post-apocalyptic roleplaying game currently in early planning stages.
by zenbitz on Nov 13, 2009 1:26 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Speaking of which...
…when do we get an advanced stats update? I need my Florida Danny fix!
by Bigmouth on Nov 14, 2009 9:27 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Will only lead to more losses.
That type of play only leads to more losses. We have to know when to call the right plays whether they are passes or runs so that we can put up points. If you can’t put any trust behind Smith, then there is no point in being a fan. We have to ride out the good and bad and trust that he is learning when certain risks are appropriate.
by LPG on Nov 13, 2009 6:56 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
how can you have confidence
in a passing game that ends up with 106 net yards passing in 25 attempts? That’s just terrible.
Overall on thursday night they ran a 50-50 run pass split. This was one of the few games where they were actually running the ball kind of well… (ca. 4 ypc)
The Niners offense is flat out BAD as a unit. There is some individual talent at the skill positions, but no amount of play calling helps when you cannot block.
You are right about the penalties though – they nearly killed us yesterday. Thankfully, the Bears were just as sloppy.
FIRE BRIAN SABEAN... UNLESS HE KEEPS DRAFTING WELL. .. AND SIGNS UNDERRATED PLAYERS LIKE AFFELDT OR PHELPS. .. OR ALRIGHT WHO'S PLAYING WITH THE ALIEN MIND-SWITCHING RAY?
-------
PARPG- Indy post-apocalyptic roleplaying game currently in early planning stages.
by zenbitz on Nov 13, 2009 1:15 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Mix up the looks
Well if you are going to pass, you have to mix up their routes. Defenses are all over them because they are very predictable. If I can sit at home and tell you exactly where the WR is going to run his route most of the time, then that is very bad. I will admit that the routes are getting better and more imaginative.
by LPG on Nov 13, 2009 7:01 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
The finishing would have looked better....
except that the ticky tacky penalty on Dre Bly gave the Bears a new life after they failed to convert on 4th down on their last drive.
Not that Dre should not know better in that situation, but hey, he’s just being Dre (ie, Not Very Smart).
by Grumpy Guy on Nov 13, 2009 11:46 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
I agree with all of this
Just being Dre . . . I’m afraid he’s one and done in SF with that classic line.
by bignerd on Nov 13, 2009 11:49 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
reply fail
Just bignerd being bignerd . . .
by bignerd on Nov 13, 2009 11:52 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I wouldn't mind seeing him back next season
he’s done pretty good in the nickel role, aside from dropping a couple of INTs that could’ve seal some games.
he’s having a pretty good season, which likely means he’ll bolt for greener pastures. I mean money.
by Andrew Davidson on Nov 13, 2009 1:01 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
He would thought of so very differently
Had he held on to Favre and Manning’s easy picks. Being 6-3 as a result would make that Falcon game foolishness seem like some little thing that no one could quite remember. Same guy, same playing time, just finishing two plays.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
by SpurredOn on Nov 13, 2009 4:49 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I still can't believe he failed to nab that pick.
Seriously, Favre made a typical Favre-ish throw under pressure, right at Dre’s hands for a guaranteed pick-6 to seal the game…and he drops it.
by Fearless Frog on Nov 13, 2009 7:39 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
shh
I don’t want to think about it anymroe.
by Andrew Davidson on Nov 13, 2009 8:01 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I couldn't believe it then
Even less when Lewis caught his pass. And still am sickened by it. Changes so much about perceptions, simply by not making a game clinching play.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
by SpurredOn on Nov 13, 2009 8:30 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
How come no one wants to talk about the positives?
We have a ball hawking safety in Mark Roman. Did you see him swoop in and steal that ball from the TE . . . zOmg that was highlight reel.
Michael Lewis continues to play well and he avoided getting his brain scrambled when 49ers gang tackled him after the game winning INT.
Balmer continues to be our best kick returner. Whenever he fields the kickoff the team ends up with great field position. This bonus came out of nowhere considering he was picked to play DT. Maybe it’s time to move him to punts.
by bignerd on Nov 13, 2009 12:03 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
seriously lmao
the balmer line is classic
by Tre9er on Nov 13, 2009 6:02 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
i think...
“finish” is a short-hand term that actually covers two things: executing well in the 2nd half AND taking advantage of opportunities. these two things go hand-in-hand because you can’t take advantage of opportunities if you don’t execute well when given them. what troubles me more about the CHI game (along with the MIN game, the IND game, and the TEN game) is that the Niners were given opportunity after opportunity to put the games away in the 2nd half, but failed to take advantage of any of them. They had MIN dead to rights, they had IND dead to rights, they had TEN dead to rights, and they let these teams linger rather than seizing the opportunity for a HUGE, season-defining win (@ MIN, @ IND) or a “this team can’t even hold our jocks” win (vs. TEN). I know this is a massive hypothetical, but they would be 7-2 right now were it not for their inability to seize the opportunity to finish teams off in the 2nd half. I think that’s the idea that singletary is trying to get across when he preaches his “FINISH” mantra.
by Florida Danny on Nov 13, 2009 1:07 PM PST reply actions 1 recs
i should add, in response to Bigmouth above...
to say that finishing is all about luck, you’re basically saying that the niners have no control over what happens at the end of the game. if that’s the case, what’s the point in preparing at all? if games are won and lost at the end based on circumstances out of the team’s control, what’s the point in practicing, in perfecting 2- and 4-minute drills, etc.? the whole assumption of football during the week is that teams feel they are in control of their own actions, and so they prepare to execute those controllable actions. a bad bounce at the end is unlucky, yes, but sitting on small leads at the end of game @ MIN, @ IND, and vs. TEN is not luck. it’s raye/singletary calling pedestrian offense with a small lead, it’s the defense executing poorly when it matters most (see missed sideline tackle on chris johnson’s 4th down TD run), it’s andy lee punting balls in the end zone (@ IND, vs. CHI) when he MUST pin them at least inside the 20. that’s poor execution of what they’ve practiced during the week. it’s simply not finishing teams off. pointing to unlucky bouces obscures the controllable, execution-oriented things that the 49ers are failing at that they MUST improve if they’re going to be a winning team.
by Florida Danny on Nov 13, 2009 1:18 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
bill walsh...
would have laughed at “winning or losing at the end of a game is all about luck.” no, it’s all about execution, he’d say.
by Florida Danny on Nov 13, 2009 1:20 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Just saw this comment...
…which totally misses my point. I didn’t say finishing was “all about” luck. I said that our inability to finish was mostly bad luck.
by Bigmouth on Dec 9, 2009 12:32 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

What we've got here is a failure to communicate.
by chikmagnet_565 on Nov 13, 2009 1:47 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Almost fully agree
I never thought we had Indy dead to rights, especially since they we never had the lead and the ball during the 4th quarter. Minnesota, yes by far, and yes to Tennessee considering they needed us to hand them the game multiple times.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
by SpurredOn on Nov 13, 2009 4:51 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
OL
I hate the “I read this somewhere” source quote…. but…. I read this somewhere (this morning)… and then watched the game on DVR right after, and it seemed correct…. the article pointed out it’s pretty difficult, still, to make any sort of final judgement on Alex Smith based on last night’s game, because the OL was, again, pretty awful. This reporter pointed out Smith seldom had a real pocket to work behind, and was of necessity on the run for much of the game. personally I’m not sure it was always of necessity, but he was often on the run -I don’t think he had a very sturdy wall in front of him. I just keep coming back to the place many other posters on this board are… I believe the ‘niners biggest most glaring problem is the O-line, and until they solve that problem, it’s difficult at best to know what Smith, or the offense for that matter, is or isn’t capable of.
by mwright84 on Nov 13, 2009 3:21 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
let me ask you this
if you’re flat broke and your car breaks down…makes it pretty hard to get to work doesn’t it? You could be late or miss work, use it as an excuse, I mean, you work miles away and there is no bus!
But it’s your only source of income, there are no options whatsoever. That is your living. Sure it sucks, sure everyone else at your job has transportation arrangements every day whereas you are fighting for your rides to work each day one way or another.
So what do you do? Fall back on your excuse, which is a valid one, and few would fault you for it…or do you find a way to overcome and do your job as best as you can?
Nobody says “hey it’s your job to make good decisions and complete passes but if you get pressure then just do whatever, it’s not your fault…throw it away, take a sack, throw an INT…I mean…what can you do without pass protection? It’s impossible to overcome that…”
When are we, the Niners included, going to find a way to make the best (and then make more) of this situation and find ways to produce in the passing game with what we got?
by Tre9er on Nov 13, 2009 6:10 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
would you replace the engine is you had 3 flat tires??
i mean, you could say it was not producing enough acceleration!
by zacksf on Nov 13, 2009 8:13 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
no, but i'd drive on those flat tires rather than let myself die in the desert
sure, it’d suck…but i can’t refuse to drive the darn car because the tires are flat.
by Tre9er on Nov 14, 2009 6:55 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Same with injuries
you can explain something’s potential cause, but we can’t say “well until this get’s better there’s just nothing we can do”
Clements is out, our COVER CORNER! We perservere. Half our line is injured, either playing or not…we don’t forfetit games.
Alex, Shaun, Nate, Joe Montana I don’t care who you march out there…he better do the BEST he can with what he got and I don’t think Alex is doing that…yet.
by Tre9er on Nov 13, 2009 6:14 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Posting this here from the body of a FanPost:
It´s hard to believe that our offense was almost unable to win yesterday, after Defense brought 5 INT to the table, our last drive was just another sample of how bad our play-calling has been during the whole season, you can´t pretend to run the ball more than ten plays in a row (even though you want to play safe without the risk of turnovers and want to spent all the time) The result was that we gave Chicago the opportunity to win the game with about four minutes left on the clock, and despite the great effort of our defense we could have easily lost again, and if we didn´t was just because we were lucky at the end. Luck has always been part of the game, this time we were lucky and some other times we weren´t, so let´s take this opportunity to get better before next game, now we have to stay focused on adding more wins. The good thing is that even playing a bad game we got the win.
I think Singletary is right when he says that we can beat anyone if we don´t make mistakes to kill ourselves, because this defense will keep us in the game most of the times, but we definitely need our offense to finish games, if they don´t, we can also be beaten by anyone.
Now we have a week to work to solve the problems and adjust the offense, I still think we can be in the play-offs. GO NINERS!!
by Stevie8 on Nov 13, 2009 2:38 PM PST Comment 0 comments
Context, people. More context is good. Less context is bad. If you're willing to be reductive, then you're willing to be wrong.
by howtheyscored on Nov 13, 2009 3:29 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
i know people are happy about the win
but i don’t think a 1st or 2nd year coach should be judged on W’s and L’s.
Player development is the top priority during rebuiiding. Seeing how Coach Sing works with and his rapor with Vernon Davis and Patrick Willis impresses me. I give him an A+.
by zacksf on Nov 13, 2009 8:17 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
+1
I agree. Most experts will tell you it takes several years to build a championship team. We’re doing some things better than we have in years, most noticeably the defense. Gore is having a good year, Davis is involved in the passing game, we have legitamate threats now at WR rather than a collection of….
The foundation of a building isn’t very tall but it takes a long time to do right. Sure you can’t see the building getting any taller…but without it you aren’t going anywhere.
by Tre9er on Nov 14, 2009 7:00 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs

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