Early Christmas present for Vernon Davis?
by David Fucillo on Dec 18, 2009 3:33 PM PST
in San Francisco 49ers News
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PrintI was poking around over at Bleeding Green Nation today and noticed an intriguing FanShot on the front page. According to the article referenced in the FanShot, it is likely that Eagles will have rookie strong side linebacker Moise Fokou handling most of the coverage duties against Vernon Davis. I've always felt Vernon Davis is at his best when a team uses a linebacker to cover him. Whereas a cornerback or even safety could potentially keep up with him speed-wise, one has to wonder what linebacker could keep up with Davis? Julian Peterson in his prime comes to mind (see his game as a 49er against Tony Gonzalez).
This matchup provides some interesting tidbits. Like Davis, Fokou attended the University of Maryland, and both were actually on the team when Fokou was a freshman and Davis was a senior junior. According to Fokou, he was able to keep up with Davis in terms of speed. At the time Fokou weighed 200 or so pounds, while he's not up to 230+. I know the 40 yard dash time isn't the best indicator of anything, but for comparison's sake, Fokou ran a 4.76 40 at this past combine, while Davis came in at 4.38 back in 2006.
Fokou had plenty to say about the matchup:
"I kind of know what he likes to do and what he doesn’t. I kind of know how he releases. For me, knowing him personally and also watching his career helps me in terms of film study," Fokou said.
"I’m going to be out there talking trash. He’s going to talk trash whenever he gets our defense. We were talking trash over the summer when I worked out with him."
Fokou has a head start.
"He thinks he’s more athletic than most linebackers," Fokou said. "We’ll see on Sunday. Me vs. Davis."
Obviously any player can have a good day against one of the best in the league, so I suppose Fokou could contain Davis. However, I just don't think the odds are particularly good of that happening. One thing that does worry me is if Davis were to get a bit too confident in the matchup, as I think he could get in his own way in this kind of instance. Vernon's physical tools have never been the problem (well hands-issues aside). It's been more about the mental side of the game that has gotten Vernon in trouble.
Whatever the case may be, this could turn into the key for the 49ers hanging with the Eagles. If Davis can dominate this matchup, the 49ers could open up the rest of their offense when somebody gets rolled over to help Fokou. I'll definitely be keeping an eye on this potential matchup. Let's hope Alex Smith can pick it apart.
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As every game this season, now I am confident that Davis will have a big game blocking and receiving.
However, just like almsot every game aswell, he has the potential of making a penatly or two, and missing 1 or 2 balls that go straight through his hands.
With that said, I think after 1 more offseason he will have a chance to reflect on those issues that happened this season, and will be the great tight end next season.
So this season, Fokou or any one else covering him has nothing on him. But then 1 or 2 times a game Davis will do something wrong that he will deserve the trash talking for.
8 catches, 80 yards, 1 TD.
You guys KILL me
VD has MORE TD’s than anyone else in the NFL so far this season.
He has MORE TD’s than Antonio Gates and Tony Gonzalez COMBINED in 2009.
And yet, people bitch & moan about his penalties.
Too funny!
Davis
This debate has happened before. His numbers are great and he’s clearly making the leap to become one of the premier tight ends in the league. At the same time, if he could cut down on the mental mistakes, he could be that much better. Obviously they aren’t happening a ton, but it’s enough to make them noticeable. We just want Davis to reach his ultimate potential.
by David Fucillo on Dec 18, 2009 5:30 PM PST up reply actions
This, ultimately, is the problem (as I see it)
And you and EVERYONE else are completely free to disagree.
Unless the HC measures up to Bill Walsh, some will always find fault with MS or anyone else.
Unless the QB measures up to Montana/Young, same thing.
Jerry Rice, etc . . .
Sure it would be nice it VD blocked like a madman, led the NFL in TD;’s, FINALLY started to fulfill his enourmouse potential (thanks in large part to MS) and made almost NO penalties.
It would be nice . . . but not very realistic.
He also has (according to my flawed research) NO fumbles this season.
Greg Olsen of the Bears made TWO critical fumbles last season against Tampa Bay. The Bears lost that game (a game they easily would’ve won without Olsen’s two fumbles) and they missed the playoffs last year by one game.
Sorry. You guys kill me.
by GeoMak on Dec 18, 2009 5:43 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
See Fooch, this is where you guys lose all credibility
Before the season started, if someone would’ve told you that after week 13, VD would lead the NFL in TD passes (even moreso than guys like Larry Fitzgerald) , with NO fumbles, and would be considered the BEST TE in the NFL in 2009, would you have taken that?
Most people would.
But instead (for you and many others), it’s a “Yeah But.”
YEAH, all that’s great and all, BUT he still makes a few stupid penalties here and there.
Got it. That makes sense (not really).
(File this under . . . some people are NEVER satisfied).
Yes he still sometimes ‘showboats’ (so did Mark Gastineau, who’s single season sack record (22 in 1984) was only recently (2001) eclipsed on a controversial play by Michael Strahan).
Big deal!
Was Gastineau’s ‘sack dance’ stupid? Absolutely.
That said, if a guy on my teaam can sack the QB 22 times in one season he can do whatever he wants after each sack. I could not care less.
Keep sacking. Keep dancing.
Same with VD. Keep leading the league in TD catches. Keep celebrating. Who f’ing cares?
Yes VD still sometimes incurs a penalty.
Again, big f’ing deal.
Why, oh why ,can’t he be more like Jerry Rice, who NEVER dropped a ball or was guilty of making a penalty.
Why oh why??
Wayyyyyy too funny!
what's your problem?
People are happy with his production, but would be happier if he could cut down the penalties and you make it out like we’re trashing the guy. I think Davis is great and am ecstatic with his production. But what’s wrong with wanting someone to maximize their talents in every way possible? Why settle for great when he could become legendary? Maybe he’ll always have the little issues, but I don’t see how it’s a problem to want him to be even better.
Davis had bigger problems with his hands earlier in his career. What did he do? He caught hundreds of passes from the Jugs machine every day after practice. His hands may not be the best in the league at this point but they’ve improved immensely since his rookie year. Why not hope that he can improve on the stupid false start penalties? It’s not necessary to make him a great player, but that doesn’t mean he shouldn’t still want to improve that.
To analogize somewhat, if you’re doing really well in your career, but you still get tripped up on a little thing here or there, are you happy to settle? Me, personally, I want to be the absolute best at everything, and I’d like to think Vernon wants to as well. I hope he wants to be the greatest player to ever play the game. Maybe he won’t end up at that level, but I’d still be happy with the desire for it.
by David Fucillo on Dec 18, 2009 7:00 PM PST up reply actions
We've gone through this before
You write:
People are happy with his production . . .
Not really.
Your posts aren’t written about how HAPPY you are with the great play of VD in 2009, your posts are about how, in spite of his improved play, if ONLY he was PERFECT, how much better he would be. (If only he made NO penalties and dropped NO passes, and if only he walked on water and so on and so forth . . .
Get it?
posts
Here’s a post about how he’s the ultimate red zone weapon
Here’s a follow up on his awesomeness and the fact that we had <a href=“http:// ”http://www.ninersnation.com/2009/11/26/1173333/the-49ers-in-the-vernon-zone" target="_blank">http://www.ninersnation.com/2009/11/26/1173333/the-49ers-in-the-vernon-zone" target="new">renamed the 30 yard line and in “The Vernon Zone.”
Two examples I found after a quick search for specific posts (thanks to the incredibly useful SB Nation search function). We’re entitled to discuss the negatives along with the positives.
Get it?
by David Fucillo on Dec 18, 2009 7:32 PM PST up reply actions
I stand corrected
Everytime I peruse the sight you guys are always ‘bitch & moaning.’
You know, the old ‘Yeah but syndrome.’
Seriously Fooch. Yes, this is America. You are entitled to discuss the ‘negatives’ along with the positives.
And therin lies YOUR problem. No matter how well this guys does, you guys will ALWAYS say (yeah but).
That’s why most NFL players have total disdain for the press and the fans.
Most (not all) are always looking to find some way to criticize a guy.
And most aren’t intelligent enoug to understand that the grass ’isn’t always greener on the other side.’
I’m sure Gates and Gonzalez themselves have dropped a few passes and even incurred a few penalties this season.
Ya think?
Too funny.
Yes you are entitled to discuss the negatives. Unfortunately, that’s always uppermost in your minds.
You guys are like the Mike Aggassi’s (and other dominering fathers of the world).
Your kid hits three homeruns but strikes out in the 9th inning?
It’s not “Way to go son. Way to belt three HR’s”
No, it’s “How in the Hell could you whiff on that breaking ball in the 9th inning.”
NEVER SATISFIED!
fine
If you’ve read most of my other posts you’d know that the negative is not foremost in my mind when it comes to the 49ers. Comparing me to Mike Agassi is quite the broad assumption. But at this point I know I’m not going to be able to convince you. I’m out.
by David Fucillo on Dec 18, 2009 7:59 PM PST up reply actions
I'm not personally comparing you to Mike Agassi
That said, MOST bloggers in 49er land focus on the NEGATIVE (glass half empty) rather than the positive (glass half full).
Take my word for it.
Now, is that a by-product of having been spolied by the Walsh regime?
Or of the past decade or so debacle?
Probably one or both.
But the fact remains that THESE players (and coaches) cannot (in fairness) be held to the standard left by Bill Walsh, or to be resposible for the clusterf++k of the past decade.
It’s too bad that many of you can’t seem to understand this.
standards vs potential
what 9ers fans want is to live up to potential. Walsh got all of the potential out of his players.
2 superbowls in the next 2 years are more than likely beyond our potential, but VD making catches he is fully capable of is not. Its not about standards, its about potential.
You kill me goatfather
When you say this:
Walsh got all of the potential out of his players.
I say this: How the Hell would YOU know?
Where you there? Did Bill Walsh personally tell you what he believed the potential of each player was?
Very, very doubtful.
Oh, no doubt. AFTER the 49ers started winning, it sure looked like everyone was playing to their maximun potential, right?
Maybe they were. Maybe they ALL weren’t.
Too funny.
This line kills me:
VD making catches he is fully capable of is not
Got it. So despite the fact that VD leads the entire NFL in TD passes, the fact that he drops some balls is a concern to you.
Hey. Listen up. Who is one of the best and most talked about WR’s in the game today?
Brandon Marshall. Right?
Do you know that he had MORE drops than any other WR in the NFL last season?
Did you know that?
Too funny
He leads the entire NFL in TD passes
simply because we treat him like a #1 WR. He’s not an elite receiver until he can develop his hands to the point where he can hang on more.
You don’t see Dallas Clark dropping those balls, nor Antonio Gates. If he wants to be an elite TE he needs to play like one.
Yes Drew K, Tim Tebow will get picked in the first round.
Right smileyman
Brnadon Marshall LED the NFL in dropped paases last season.
You don’t really hear Bronco fans WHINING about that now, do you?
Hysterical!
One more thing
saying that he needs to improve is simply being honest. Imagine how much more of a threat he would be if he could hang on to 90% of the balls thrown his way instead of to 60%.
Saying he can improve also doesn’t mean that I think he’s a bad TE. Not by any stretch of the imagination. He’s clearly one of the better ones in the league—top 5 certainly. He’s got to work on his hands if he wants to be a #1 though.
Yes Drew K, Tim Tebow will get picked in the first round.
Who doesn't need to improve?
Really?
If yopu talked to Peyton Manning himself he’d be the first to tell you even he could improve.
Saying a player needs to/could improve is a MEANINGLESS statement.
Bingo
His dropped catches also cost us in crucial games. All but one of our losses this year have been by one TD or less. Many of VD’s drops kill drives, or happen close to, or at, the endzone.
If he hangs on to those it might be the difference between winning and losing.
Also if he hung onto everything that hit his hands he could easily be at 15 TDs, 1000 yards receiving right now with three games left to play.
Yes Drew K, Tim Tebow will get picked in the first round.
No, you make no sense
you’re saying that because he had a great year he doesn’t need to do better and we shouldn’t point out obvious flaws.
I disagree.
He’s got obvious flaws in his catching skills. Just about everyone can see that. His flaws impact his whole team. They impact games. If he wants to be considered an elite TE he has to fix those.
That’s not taking away one bit from what he’s done this year.
According to DVOA he’ s only the 7th best TE in the league (yeah I know, you think statistics and DVOA is a bunch of garbage).
Guess who’s #1? Antonio Gates. #2 is Dallas Clark. Clark catches 77% of the passes thrown his way and is at 900 yards on the season and may catch VD in TD passes.
Gates catches 73% of the pases thrown his way and is over 1000 yards on the season. He isn’t used as much in goal line situations so he doesn’t have the TD stats that Clark and Gates do.
If VD wants to be considered a top TE like those two, he needs to catch 70% or better of the balls thrown his way instead of his pretty bad 61% (which puts him in the bottom third of TE in the league).
There are more important stats than touchdowns.
Yes Drew K, Tim Tebow will get picked in the first round.
Dude
For the FINAL time!!!!!!!
Nobody said he ’couldn’t improve.’
ALL players could ‘improve.’
Get IT?????
I never said he was perfect or couldn’t improve.
DON’T put WORDS in my MOUTH.
I DID say that most of you focus on the NEGATIVE (rather than the positive).
So, smileyman, who would you trade VD
‘staright-up’ for?
BTW; You DO understand that, unlike many ‘pass catching TE’s’ VD can also block.
Actually, he’s a great blocker.
Perspective, my friend.
Again. Please. The name of the TE you would immediately swap for VD?
I don’t care who yo9u want. I just want the name!
For all you (ahem) geniuses here
I’d like to know: What TE would you trade VD straight-up for tomorrow (or after the close of this season)?
Who?
I thought we were talking about Vernon Davis
"The Football The 49ers Team has The excitement of the bear, the velocity of the deer and strenght of the buffalo.
matchup
True, although humility is certainly not something in Vernon Davis’ wheelhouse. If this game gets ugly I could see him totally blowing this matchup. I’d like to think it won’t happen, but Vernon Davis has enough screw-ups that it wouldn’t surprise me at all.
by David Fucillo on Dec 18, 2009 3:57 PM PST up reply actions
Truth be told
The reason we are seeing improvements in VD and AS has to do with the coach. Have faith my friends, Iron Mike will say the right things to keep VD focused.
T. Zachary Moradian
VD needs to take lessons from Gore
On keeping his “game bearing.” I’d say a good 95% of the time Frank makes his play, gets up and goes back into the huddle. No showboating, no trash talking right after the play. His head always appears to be in the game.
I think Frank took lessons from
Barry Sanders. Obviously his numbers don’t come anywhere near Barry’s, but as far as his game character, the two are very similar.
Yes But...
Gore has been guilty of trying to overdo it on a play which has resulted in fumbles. He may not showboat or trash talk but he is guilty of harming the team when being overly aggressive (like showboaters and trash-talkers).
T. Zachary Moradian
The only LB that can keep up with Davis
is the one he faces in practice 5 times a week
I guess he was talking about Willis
But Manny can probably cover VD too.
What we've got here is a failure to communicate.
by SportsChicken on Dec 18, 2009 9:01 PM PST up reply actions
I think, in general,VD and Crabtree together present a match-up problem because the person you need to cover VD (basically a Woodson-type strong, physical, excellent cover corner) is also the person you need for Crabtree.
Reading the Eagles blog, Fokou is a smallish (230lbs) but fast linebacker. He also played on Vernon’s college team for a year so he’s familiar with his tendencies and skill set. Eagles fans are more worried about Fokou going Richie Incognito with the penalties other than VD beating him in coverage.
Familiar?
The VD that was present last year or even this spring is not the one playing now. He’s more confident, running routes better, being played to his strengths and has a staff/team that supports him. This dude, Fokou, will be sweating after the first offensive series. It’ll be fun to watch!
T. Zachary Moradian
VD is a freak LOL
49ers Al Grito De Guerra!!! hahaha
by 49erSalvatrucha on Dec 18, 2009 7:11 PM PST up reply actions
I hear weather is going to be a bigger factor in the match up
I keep hearing about snow.
by bignerd on Dec 18, 2009 5:20 PM PST reply actions 1 recs
its snowing balls here in VA
about 6 inches in 6 hours with at least 8 more inches on the way tonight and tomorrow. From what I hear it’s supposed to head north and impact the Philly area as well. That will make for a very interesting game.
"The Football The 49ers Team has The excitement of the bear, the velocity of the deer and strenght of the buffalo.
just saw some video from Philly
it’s definitely going to be a snowy mess for us on Sunday
"The Football The 49ers Team has The excitement of the bear, the velocity of the deer and strenght of the buffalo.
I don't get this matchup at all
VD is both taller, bigger and faster than Fokou. He should have a field day.
Moise Fokou—6’1", 233 lbs
Vernon Davis—6’3", 250 lbs.
It doesn’t make sense at all to me. Who’s going to be covering Crabtree and Walker?
Yes Drew K, Tim Tebow will get picked in the first round.
Crabtree
I’m guessing Asante Samuel will cover Crabtree and Sheldon Brown covers Morgan. Not sure who covers Walker. I guess it depends on whether they go base or nickel when Walker is on the field.
by David Fucillo on Dec 18, 2009 7:17 PM PST up reply actions
Is Walker even playing?
He’s injured
What we've got here is a failure to communicate.
by SportsChicken on Dec 18, 2009 9:02 PM PST up reply actions
Not neccesarily
The Eagles don’t play matchups with their corners. Asante Samuel plays the left side and Sheldon Brown has the right. They rarely move. So you can line up whichever WR you want on either side and it won’t matter, the Eagles won’t move their starting corners. It was always a philosophy of Jim Johnson and and they pretty much still adhere to that.
Defender
It seems like every game an opposing team has some answer for VD, as can be gleamed from how other posters talk on their blogs. Then of course VD blows them up for 80yds recieving and a TD.
well...
Two guys have done a good job on VD:
Adrian Wilson and Charles Woodson.
Woodson had to stop covering VD after Harris got hurt in the GB game though, so VD still had a good game.
What we've got here is a failure to communicate.
by SportsChicken on Dec 18, 2009 9:03 PM PST up reply actions
So it sounds like you guys are saying that this is up to Smith
If we do have an advantage with Davis and the Crabman, it will only be so because of Smith getting the ball there.
Alex needs to get back to what he has done best, over the top. Smith excels throwing over the LB’s shoulder. I would like to see Crabtree targeted early on the go routes. Keep the safteys on the line, and sideline.
Aaannnndddddd...
Let’s not forget the emergence of D. Walker. We may have the baddest TE tandom next year by how well these two are improving this season! All we need is some solid play from Morgan (or hell, even Hill) to give opposing D’s a headache!
T. Zachary Moradian
This is a pointless comparison
Whatever Fokou may think, this is not Madden and he will not be covering the TE on every play. I’ve watched every Eagles game played during the Reid era and not once have I ever seen them give the strong side linebacker the sole job of covering the TE. If a LB draws the TE in coverage, he’s usually passed off to a safety in zone.
So really trying to analyze this specific matchup is pointless. If the Eagles nickel linebacker draws the TE in single coverage even 15% of the plays I’d be surprised.
And of course
This isn’t to say that the TE won’t have a good game, I’m sure he will because the Eagles are always terrible against TEs… but it won’t be because of their nickel strongside LB.
vernon
for his age and upside along with his current production vd is the best in the game. he also a great inline blocker as well.
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