Manny Ramirez suspension, PEDs and sports
I realize this is not a baseball site and I realize we have many Giants fans who are elated at the Manny Ramirez suspension. Personally, I thought Manny Ramirez could be annoying, but I respected what seemed to be some seriously amazing abilities.
Earlier today, MLB announced that Manny Ramirez was being suspended 50 games for a violation of the league's drug testing policy. Although there is a lot of speculation flying around, it seems that there is general agreement that Ramirez had testosterone in his body that was not natural and came from an artificial source. Additionally, Ramirez was identified as using the female fertility drug human chorionic gonadotropin, or hCG. Apparently hCG is often used by steroid users to restart their body's natural testosterone production as they come off a steroid cycle.
Whether you believe Manny's "excuse" about a doctor's prescription, or you don't, it really doesn't matter. Manny will be forever attached with the steroid stigma through nobody's fault but his own. Even if he thought it was legit, he should have spoken with MLB to make sure it was ok. If there's even a doubt, why put it in your body?
However, for the sake of this post, we're going beyond just Manny being Manny. Just over two years ago, early in the days of Niners Nation, I posted something about a Chuck Klosterman article discussing why we look the other way on the issue of PEDs. Nowadays it seems like sports are cracking down, but as long as there is no legit HGH test, how will we ever know who's clean?
This is of central concern to me with football because of what I think is an apparent PED problem in the NFL. The Klosterman article points to the freakish size, speed and general athleticism of a guy like Shawne Merriman (who tested positive for steroids in 2006). That discussion can be applied to numerous football players. Have you ever looked at a hulking defensive end or linebacker showing amazing abilities and wonder how they're able to do that?
I'm certainly not pointing fingers at anybody. However, it does seem football gets more if a free pass than baseball when it comes to the issue of PEDs. One reason I see that is they did institute a steroid testing policy WELL before baseball could get their act together. I also think baseball has a certain pure image to American sports fans. Football is the proverbial battle of the gladiators, and do we really want our gladiators in some watered down version?
Anyways, I just thought that given the events of today, it was worth opening this discussion back up. I'm not asking anything specific, but more just your general thoughts on this topic.
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Patrick Willis doesn't use steroids
other players use his sweat as a PED
Still defending Rich Aurilia, and the Niners' classic unis
by wjackalope on May 7, 2009 3:40 PM PDT reply actions 4 recs
+1
However, if it was apparent that he was… I wouldn’t support him.
by Sultan of Seitan on May 7, 2009 3:45 PM PDT up reply actions
Here's an article I wrote on this earlier today
Essentially, neither mlb nor the NFL have any vested interest in actually catching people taking PEDs – this just makes the game look dirty. If they really wanted to clamp down on this, they’d have stronger suspensions and blood testing. But they don’t.
It’s really better for the game (and even moreso, the NFL) if players are bigger and stronger (and can hit more homers, or hit harder), but because of public opinion, they have to make a token gesture at doing something about it. It really kinda annoys me, when something like cycling, or athletics, is held up as a ‘dirty’ sport, when in reality, all that’s happening is that they are just doing a better job of actually catching people.
Gah.
It's never too soon to jump to conclusions
by alea iacta est on May 7, 2009 4:08 PM PDT reply actions
but because of public opinion, they have to make a token gesture at doing something about it. It really kinda annoys me, when something like cycling, or athletics, is held up as a ‘dirty’ sport, when in reality, all that’s happening is that they are just doing a better job of actually catching people.
first, public opinion about steroids is not what the media says it is – honestly talk to your friends and see if even 1 out of 10 of them even gives a shit – it’s sportscaster douches like Plaschke who are trying to make players taking steroids seem like it’s evil, evil, evil
second, no one cares about cycling, Lance Armstrong notwithstanding, cycling is gay
"Those boos really motivate me to make something happen." - Bonds
funny that this is posted on a NINERS WEBSITE
Chinga los gigantes
Go A’s
If you had a lineup of 9 Jack Custs who hit(Cust career average) .239 AVG, .382 OBP, and .475 SLG, then your team would score 6.12 runs per game-totalling to 991runs a season.The 08 rangers lead the majors in runs score with 901.
I still don’t get the fake, one-sided rivarly.
Go Giants. Also, Go A’s.
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on May 7, 2009 5:50 PM PDT up reply actions
funny?
I’d say more Niners fans are Giants fans than As fans – Oakland can suck it whether we’re talking football or baseball
"Those boos really motivate me to make something happen." - Bonds
maybe cause i grew up in oakland.
I would have been a Raiders fan BUT THEY WERE IN LA. So I went for the team that was closest to me. so put that in your pipe and smoke it
If you had a lineup of 9 Jack Custs who hit(Cust career average) .239 AVG, .382 OBP, and .475 SLG, then your team would score 6.12 runs per game-totalling to 991runs a season.The 08 rangers lead the majors in runs score with 901.
reply
make sure and reply to the comment directly so we can keep track of the conversation.
by David Fucillo on May 7, 2009 6:07 PM PDT up reply actions
I’m not wondering why you’re an A’s fan. Lots of people are A’s fan. I just don’t get why being an A’s fan means the Giants have to suck it. It never made sense to me. That has nothing to do with growing up in Oakland. It’s just this weirdo thing that seems somehow pervasive of the fanbase.
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on May 7, 2009 6:42 PM PDT up reply actions
Not Really
I don’t know why everyone assumes football is dirty just because baseball was dirty? Football started testing for steroids in the mid 80’s which is why the sport has been able to avoid this problem over the last decade. Baseball stuck it’s head in the sand, a problem grew than stuck it’s head in the sand even further believing no one would notice.
Are all football players clean, probably not. I bet the majority of the PED’s are taken in college when guys are trying to grow their body to an NFL size. It’s easier to maintain the size than to get it. Plus, I don’t see football players enormously bulking up in the pros.
Still I’m leary to assume that many football players are dirty just because they are bigger and more athletic than most of the population. In my area, the guys who became pros were freakishly big and athletic back in junior high and high school.
Finally, football is a man’s sport. You can take all the junk you want to make yourself bigger and faster. None of that is going to help you deal with the collisions, brutality and pain nor give you the motivation to push through it all. In fact, PED’s make you much more prone to injury via contact and exertion which will wash you out of football faster than anything. In baseball, you take a couple swings and lightly jog around the field. Your body isn’t being punished for carrying around all that extra, abnormal weight, than you cash in on the long ball.
oh
my bad.
If you had a lineup of 9 Jack Custs who hit(Cust career average) .239 AVG, .382 OBP, and .475 SLG, then your team would score 6.12 runs per game-totalling to 991runs a season.The 08 rangers lead the majors in runs score with 901.
Tried to post the LA-me shirt
but failed, heres the linkhttp://rumplo.com/tees/tee/5428-lame-t+shirt-by-no-star
by passionforPERPS on May 7, 2009 11:47 PM PDT up reply actions
Vernon Davis is a walking steroid,
How many teammates has he fought?
by passionforPERPS on May 7, 2009 11:41 PM PDT reply actions

- from his book I Am America And So Can You
“The big story in sports right now is athletes taking drugs, making themselves better with steroids and human growth hormone. Some people have a problem with this, but not me. News Flash: Athletes perform for our enjoyment. So ‘performance-enhancing drugs’ are really ‘enjoyment-enhancing drugs.’ Bravo, Mr. Bonds.
The fact is, Americans want the best of everything. That’s why Americans won’t watch women’s basketball. Every time I see a lady make a shot I think, ‘I bet a guy could’ve made that better.’ ‘Enhanced’ athletics are the same way. Back in the day when sports consisted of little slow guys hitting set shots, bunting, and staging Statue of Liberty plays, the public was satisfied because they didn’t know any better. But now that we’ve seen huge behemoths with 2% body fat and misshapen foreheads leap over piles of bodies to crush each other’s larynx, we can’t go back.
That’s why I’m proposing the end of all regulations on what athletes do to themselves. If a guy wants to shoot himself up with hormones or chimp sperm, that’s his business. The only thing that matters is performance on the field. Now a lot of people ask, ‘What kind of message would this send to our young people?’ To which I reply, ’Don’t suck. Go the extra mile to actually be good or you’ll be selling insurance.’ With those forces at work in the marketplace of modern scientific body modification, our sports will continue to be the most entertaining in the world."
"Those boos really motivate me to make something happen." - Bonds
I write for the Dodger blog True Blue LA at SBN
And obviously, as a Dodger fan, this news sucks. I will still support Manny though.
I think the steroid stuff does get wiped under the rug in football. I’m not sure why, but for some reason baseball has a reputation as a “dirty sport”, whereas football really doesn’t. I think the steroid problems are just as rampant in football, we just don’t hear about them as much. The freak athletes are even more obvious in football, but it doesn’t seem to matter too much to a lot of people.
but it doesn’t seem to matter too much to a lot of people.
so true, and yet you say that like it’s a bad thing
"Those boos really motivate me to make something happen." - Bonds
I don't know
I thought that the idea was to bring to light steroid users.
by Brendan Scolari on May 10, 2009 1:44 AM PDT up reply actions
Completely Disagree
Baseball is as dirty of sport as it is perceived to be. Really, the sport needs to look in the mirror. Pointing the finger at football further avoids the issue, not to mention the complete lack of evidence to back the statement. The NFL and NFLPA have always embraced PED testing. Saying they’ve swept the issue the under the rug is complete farce.
You know why athletes in football look freakish? Because football attracts real athletes. Baseball hasn’t been attractive to the American athlete in 15 years. It’s too dull for a percentage of kids. Than by baseball’s own bigoted creation removed its little league program from several pockets of the population. Only suburban, mostly white populations have little league programs and baseball’s been just fine with that development. Kids from all cross sections of the US play football and basketball. Is it any wonder why those sports have a bigger pool of athletes?
I agree baseball has tons of steroid problems.
No doubt about that. That doesn’t mean football doesn’t though, and if you believe that the NFL is mostly steroid free then I don’t even know what to say.
As for your second point, I think the idea that baseball is by nature racist is ridiculous. There are more athletes in other sports because athleticism is a more important component in them. For example, a guy like Vernon Davis gets a HUGE advantage in football, wheras in baseball his athleticism helps but is not nearly as important. Similiarly, someone like Josh Hamilton, who’s a great baseball player, doesn’t have the athleticism to play high level football or basketball. And you could say this about tons of players. Could David Ortiz play professionally at any other sport? Manny? Adam Dunn? No, but they can definitely hit better than anyone in the NFL.
by Brendan Scolari on May 10, 2009 1:54 AM PDT up reply actions
and if you believe that the NFL is mostly steroid free then I don’t even know what to say.
that’s because no one cares
"Those boos really motivate me to make something happen." - Bonds
Sorry what?
I thought the point of having comments on a blog was so that we could give our opinion. Obviously, you (or anybody else for that matter) can choose not to care but when Fooch says he’s asking for “our general thoughts on the topic” I really don’t understand what your beef is.
by Brendan Scolari on May 11, 2009 1:12 AM PDT up reply actions
no one cares about steroids in football, and they’re not going to
the sports media wants us all to care about PEDS in baseball, but except for our favorite players getting suspended, dragged through the mud for years in court and Congressional committees, we don’t really care about that either
I’d say Colbert’s above quote is half-joking, but it also probably represents the general attitude towards the issue of most Americans. It’s funny Manny getting suspended because he’s a Dodger, but getting suspended that long for what he actually did is pretty crazy.
"Those boos really motivate me to make something happen." - Bonds
Alright I can understand that somewhat.
Sorry I misunderstood your earlier comment.
by Brendan Scolari on May 11, 2009 9:39 PM PDT up reply actions
goddamn, you’re really anti-baseball, aren’t you?
(baseball is dirty, not attracting “real” athletes, too dull, and racist where only mostly suburban white kids play it)– geeze, man
I honestly have zero interest in looking into how well the NFL checks for steroids. And I honestly don’t give a shit if a player in baseball takes steroids. Trying to argue that one is more dirty than the other is pointless. I LOVE both games, and always will. There’s no reason lambast a sport like baseball, especially when it has had such a history of great and amazing players from every race, culture, and part of the country (I will always love Willie Mays, and I’m a Barry Bonds defender as well).
don’t talk down baseball man, not cool
of course if you want to rag on something like soccer, be my guest
"Those boos really motivate me to make something happen." - Bonds
After...
years of taking PED’s, Manny is now known as Mannygotnomorewood.
"The voice of the intellect is a soft one, but it does not rest until it has gained a hearing"
by Jeff_Fuller_49 on May 10, 2009 12:57 PM PDT reply actions

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