First Big Test for the 49ers

by kezarvet on Sep 24, 2009 12:27 PM PDT Comment 32 comments

photo: Michael Maloney, SF Chronicle

San Francisco 49ers (2-0) vs. Minnesota Vikings (2-0)
This Sunday, the 49ers face their first opportunity to prove to the doubters that THIS TEAM is for real. Winning five of the last seven games last season despite a 7-step crazed Offensive Coordinator was no small feat. Mike Singletary is no ordinary coach, however.

For those of us who watched him play his entire career for the Bears, and who were privileged enough to see a true master of his craft at work, this was not at all surprising. Mike Singletary worked harder and demonstrated more determination than any player I have ever seen, and I've seen a lot including Jim Brown and Jerry Rice, two others who rank with Singletary in this category. It is their incredible powers of the mind, their ability to will things to happen in their favor, much like Tiger Woods in golf, that set them apart.

The Niners are 2-0, and it has been a pleasure to watch Singletary's mental brilliance as he deals with a variety of situations. He has everyone convinced that the Niners are three runs and a cloud of dust... He is so honest that everyone, especially the media, believes him. He WANTS the 49ers to be known as a running team. He wants the rest of the league to believe that Shaun Hill is barely able to throw a ball and that passing is an afterthought at best, something the Niners do only in desperation.

Poor Shaun is the most underrated and maligned QB in the NFL -- by far. No matter how well he performs or how much he wins, people have been conned into believing he has no arm strength (Noodle Arm is the nickname of choice) but he has heart. He has heart AND plenty of arm strength. Against the Cards, Hill lofted a beautiful 50-yard pass to Isaac Bruce, right on the money. What is the truth? Is he a QB that Singletary keeps in the closet because he is inept, or is it because Singletary KNOWS he has a winner -- a guy with character and heart. Hill has a Won/Loss record of 9-3 (6-0 at home).

Last season, Hill finished 12th in the NFL with an excellent passer rating of 87.5, ahead of QBs like Eli Manning, McNabb, Cutler, Edwards, Delhomme, Campbell, Garrard, Favre, Flacco, Collins and Roethlisberger, among others. Passer rating measures efficiency.

In just over half a season, Hill threw 64.2% of his passes for over 2,000 yards, an average of 227 yards per game. He threw 13 TD passes with 8 interceptions. That would translate to over 3,600 yards for a full season. Pretty good for a Noodle Arm.

When the 49ers ran into trouble against Arizona (ran might be an exaggeration), Hill stepped right up and led the Niners on a 15 play TD drive, throwing 12 times and doing a great impersonation of a QB who knows what's up.

Someone posted this comparison on a forum that, although Hill has only started 12 games, gives some insight as to the level of his performance thus far. This will raise some eyebrows:
Accuracy 1. Steve Young 64.3 comp %
2. Shaun Hill 64.2 comp %
3. Joe Montana 63.2 comp %
4. Jeff Garcia 61.6 comp %

Highest TD ratio 1. Steve Young 1 TD every 15.1 attempts
2. Joe Montana 1 TD every 19.0 attempts
3. Shaun Hill 1 TD every 19.3 attempts
4. Jeff Garcia 1 TD every 19.7 attempts

Lowest INT ratio 1. Shaun Hill 1 INT every 47.1 attempts
2. Jeff Garcia 1 INT every 44.3 attempts
3. Joe Montana 1 INT every 38.8 attempts
4. Steve Young 1 INT every 38.8 attempts

QB Rating 1. Steve Young 96.8 QB Rating
2. Joe Montana 92.3 QB Rating
3. Shaun Hill 90.1 QB Rating
4. Jeff Garcia 87.5 QB Rating

Keep making the world believe that Hill can barely walk or think as long as you can, Mike. I know how you think. I, too, was born on October 9.

No matter how you slice it, Shaun Hill has performed at a winning level as a 49er quarterback. The first two games of this season he has a passer rating of 87.9, has passed for 353 yards with a TD and NO interceptions. Most impressive is his toughness and determination. He's a no-nonsense guy who doesn't care about the limelight -- the perfect team player. He just wants to win. Reminds me of an old Bears linebacker.

49ers vs Vikings coverage

photo: Lacy Atkins, SF Chronicle

Poll

Pick the winner of Sunday's game between the 49ers and the Vikings.

49ers

65 votes

Vikings

14 votes

79 votes | Poll has closed

This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of Niners Nation's writers or editors. It does reflect the views of this particular fan though, which is as important as the views of Niners Nation's writers or editors.

1 recs | Comment 32 comments

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Comments

Just to back what you are saying about Shaun Hill...

Steve Young is quoted as saying in a knbr interview that Hill is playing outstanding football. Many people try to say that because Hill isn’t passing for 300+ yards and multiple TD’s every game that he is not a good QB. Just have to say that I think a HOF quarterback has a little bit better idea of what contitutes a good QB.

by SanFranSoldier on Sep 24, 2009 3:11 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Cold Hard Football Facts

http://coldhardfootballfacts.com/Articles/11_2837_Week_2_first_reactions.html

See #7

“But Hill has a Brady- or Starr-esque ability to avoid the critical mistake. He’s attempted 57 passes this year without a pick, and has thrown just nine INTs in 12 NFL starts (424 attempts), a rate of 2.1%. The 49ers are now 9-3 in those 12 games. "

by niners84 on Sep 24, 2009 3:41 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I heard that intvw

Very complimentary. He said “it’s great quarterbacking, not good quarterbacking but great.” His argument was that Hill does not do what Romo does and Cutler did in week 1: lose the game for his team. He said that value of that should not be undervalued and it’s smart football.

You gotta bring ass to get ass.

by SpurredOn on Sep 25, 2009 1:14 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

The Stage is set...

…for Shaun Hill to have the best game of his career and lead the 49ers to a league startling, head turning victory.

Great post kezarvet.

The future ain't what it used to be. Go Niners!

by riderless on Sep 24, 2009 4:08 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Lights camara...

Niners.
I’m gonna step out on a limb here. Shaun Hill is a musical genious.
But seriously, last game on a few 3 and outs. My brother and friend we asking for Davis to be put in. I felt disrespected for this. Angered in fact.
I’ve had Hills back ever since the Niners starting winning games with him. So I really hope that he comes through. For his own sake and for us Niners freakshows.

by carbone on Sep 24, 2009 4:18 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Bruce

dropped a pair of passes on 2 of those 3 and outs. Not Hill’s fault

by Drew K on Sep 24, 2009 4:47 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Me Too !

I’ve a Hill Supporter since he started last year. The stats clearly shows he can run this Team. He will get his due as a Niner QB ! He fixed his finger this offseason and you’ll know that "noodle arm " can hit the big ones when the Niners open up the Passing Game !

by LASVEGASNINER on Sep 25, 2009 1:06 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Look, I'm not Mike Martz here,

but I am still not a huge Hill supporter. I like the fact that he doesn’t turn the ball over, and he has all kinds of moxie. Although the stats you cite are favorable and impressive, I am not convinced that he gets the ball down the field enough. Even when he’s got a guy open on the outside, he’ll check it down. This is probably just a limitation I’ll have to accept—since the Niners seem to be committed to this guy and because he fits the scheme and he’s winning.

Morgan breaks through in 2009!

by grantmp on Sep 24, 2009 8:04 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Some stats to back up my opinion that Hill doesn't go downfield enough:

Here are the stats on Yards/Attempt and Yards per completion (taking seasons in which the QB in question had at least 176 completions):

Yards per attempt:
Montana: 8.4 (over 10 seasons)
Young: 8.3 (over 8 seasons)
Hill: 7.1 (last season—181 attempts)
Garcia: 6.9 (over 5 seasons)

Yards per completion
Young: 12.5
Montana: 12
Garcia: 11.4
Hill: 11.3

Hill’s career numbers are even worse (6.8 y/a and 10.7 y/c).

I’m happy to post the excel file if anybody has an idea how to do that.

Morgan breaks through in 2009!

by grantmp on Sep 24, 2009 8:28 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Is going downfield truly necessary?

Game plan is: running game, solid D, win the turnover battle. The passing game is just to keep ‘em honest, and frankly, a QB willing to check it down and not make the bad play is exactly what we need. Nothing flashy, no prima donna "Crabtree"s, just guys who know their role and make the plays to get us the win. We’ll see how that holds up in the 4th quarter when we’re down a score or two, but… as of now, he’s playing his role, doesn’t have to be a starring role.

You have been DFiBrillated.

by Dubs fan in Boston on Sep 24, 2009 11:26 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Is it necessary? The 9-3 says no. Buuuut...

It is definitely beneficial. Every time you gain a big chunk of yardage you 1) put yourself that much closer to scoring (obviously) and 2) loosen up the defense for the running game. This is the thing about moving the chains; if it takes you 6 first downs to make it down the field instead of 8, you’ve given the defense 2 less opportunities to get you off the field. Isn’t that what you want?
I’m not about flash. That’s not my point. My point is that a QB with better downfield vision would see guys on the outside who are open—within the structure of the current offense.

Morgan breaks through in 2009!

by grantmp on Sep 25, 2009 6:41 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Could It Be The System

I am hoping Raye and the Niners allow Hill to open it up some. I could really care less how we win and he is 9-3 as our starting QB. 6-1 over the last 7. Now if you want to argue that it is beneficial to winning a game i am totally on board with that. But it also comes down to who is calling the play and also if they think Hill has the ability to do that.

Papa Smurf Told Me To Do It!!!!!!

by nocal81 on Sep 25, 2009 5:45 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Fair points

Hill is no Joe or Steve. Those two are HOF Qbs and had HOF coaches (Walsh, Holmgren, Shanahan). But can’t he be a Garcia or better? When looking at these numbers, we should recall that all three QBs had WRs who constantly took short passes a long distance thus upping the YPA and completion. If Hill had a WR with established TO ability his stats would look much better even with the same system.

You gotta bring ass to get ass.

by SpurredOn on Sep 25, 2009 1:18 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

So he averages

1.2 yards less per completion than Young and 0.7 yards less than two of the greatest HOF QBs of all time. That’s a negative?

Young and Montana played on teams with great OLs and receivers. Hill hasn’t yet.

Kezarvet

by kezarvet on Sep 26, 2009 9:27 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Hill

Must be the worst QB ever.

by niners84 on Sep 24, 2009 10:11 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Well written post kezarvet

I truly believe that if we are to win this weekend, it will be because of Hill’s passing. The script is ready: he returns to play his old team. He and his mates are in their third game so a rhythm should be established. Everyone knows the Vikings DL is one of the toughest to run against so throwing the ball is a requirement. You need to grab the lead and make the Minny offense about Favre’s arm not Peterson’s legs. It’s all set up. If they block for him, I think Hill has his best statistical game since playing the Jets in December.

You gotta bring ass to get ass.

by SpurredOn on Sep 25, 2009 1:24 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Thank you

Why is it that you can’t get any respect in this league without a shiny, super-stud QB?? Even if you don’t want one!

The fact is: Hill is doing exactly what Raye and Sing have asked him to do.

He might not be as sexy as Brady, and he mighty not be able to lick a cookie as fast as the Manning twins….

….he just wins games. (sigh) i guess we’ll have to live with that.

by Krowley on Sep 25, 2009 5:58 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

I would just like to see them

loosen the reins on him and let him play the position. He has demonstrated that he can manage a game without making mistakes. I’d like to see them open it up a bit which can only help the running game.

Kezarvet

by kezarvet on Sep 25, 2009 8:23 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

When you're winning, you didn't Pass.

But when Hill needs to, he can. Take the Az. game on that 15 play Drive. If you check the 4th Qtr. Stats. He’s a Winner.
Also check out the redzone TDs. Very impressive !

by LASVEGASNINER on Sep 25, 2009 1:14 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

I Take Issue With This Post

Defeating the defending NFC Champion Arizona Cardinals on the road in the season opener was our first big test. How can anyone even question that?

Papa Smurf Told Me To Do It!!!!!!

by nocal81 on Sep 25, 2009 3:34 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Easy, the Cards last year were a fluke.

They were inconsistent and had some glaring weaknesses during the 2008 regular season. SF came close to sweeping them, even with Nolan and Martz and JTO and the mid-season firing and all that stupidity and chaos. Arizona stumbled into the playoffs at 9-7 from the weakest division in the NFL. Then they had a stroke of luck. That’s about it. They didn’t get that much better this year, obviously.

by asleepinSF on Sep 26, 2009 9:08 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

But they were better than us

They swept us and won the division while going 6-0 within the division so they’re the team to beat in the West. For that matter they’re the team or one of the teams to beat in the NFC, as they are defending conf champs. I don’t fear them or view them as something to emulate but winning in their building, where last season they beat Miami, Dallas, Atlanta and Carolina, was a big test.

You gotta bring ass to get ass.

by SpurredOn on Sep 27, 2009 2:10 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I take issue with your issue.

We were 0-0 against a defending Super Bowl participant. The pressure was on them, not us. Now we are 2-0, playing a 2-0 team with legitimate Super Bowl aspirations and talent. This IS our first BIG TEST. That’s how someone could question that.

Kezarvet

by kezarvet on Sep 25, 2009 3:52 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

I Take Issue With You Taking Issue With My Issue

Wow say that 3 times fast.

Did the Cardinals win the NFC last season? Were we playing them in their home opener? That was our first big test, i am not saying this isn’t a test, it is. But to discount that win is just crazy

Papa Smurf Told Me To Do It!!!!!!

by nocal81 on Sep 25, 2009 3:55 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs