Quarterback: Long look back, brief look forward
Now that we're fully into the 49ers offseason, I thought I'd bring back a feature from last year: the long look back, brief look forward. We're at a point where the season is complete and there is plenty to review, but we also want to take a brief look at what free agency and the draft might hold for the 49ers. We'll have plenty of posts related to both, but this gives us an initial all-encompassing look. We'll post the stats for the players before the jump, with all the juicy details after the jump.
For each one of these I thought it'd be fun to link to last year's post on the given position. It gives us a chance to go in the way-back machine and see what changes the 49ers made. Here's last year's look at the quarterbacks. I love the fact that 3 people actually voted that Just Turnovers would be the QB week 1 of the 2009 season.
I decided to go with the position that will likely raise the most debate: quarterback. I'd actually argue there is a bit less uncertainty at the position this year, as compared to last year. The position is by no means settled, but I think Shaun Hill has more or less been eliminated from the equation (more on that below) and Alex Smith has shown improvement, although not enough to satisfy many people (a reasonable argument for some).
I included a poll asking who you think will be starting the final week of the regular season. In voting, don't assume the team will be resting their starters for a playoff bid or anything like that. Assume they've got something to play for so whomever is the #1 QB will be playing. I think most folks can acknowledge that Alex Smith will probably be starting week 1 (even if the team drafted another QB). The end of the season is a different story.
Shaun Hill
Alex Smith
Shaun Hill: We might as well go in order with the QB position. Hill won the job in training camp, although it wasn't exactly a dominating performance by Hill. Preseason doesn't mean a whole lot, but maybe we should have been a bit skeptical when neither quarterback was able to really wow the folks at home. In six regular season starts, Hill started out decent enough before struggling against the Falcons and appearing to run into a wall against the Texans. At that point he was benched and Alex Smith began his quasi-revival.
Is Shaun Hill a poor man's Trent Dilfer? If you place Shaun Hill on that Ravens Super Bowl team, could he have done what Trent Dilfer did? At this point, I don't see Hill starting for the 49ers again, barring injury. Hill is signed for one more year and would seem likely to spend that year wandering the sideline. I just wonder if anybody thinks he could end up as a starter somewhere? I suppose there's always the Raiders. In the end, I'm just curious what kind of future Shaun Hill has in the NFL. He showed he can play in the NFL, but just not at a particularly high level on a consistent basis. That's gotta be better than some of the trash back-ups in this league.
Alex Smith: The wild ride that has been Alex Smith's career does not appear to be slowing down anytime soon. If you look back at last year's QB review, check out the second paragraph of the Shaun Hill section. Coach Singletary gave Alex Smith a vote of confidence and said he was "the quarterback going forward." Of course, he also said the team was always trying to get better at the position and constantly evaluating. So while it was more of an affirmation than Hill got at the end of 2008, it is once again a time where the season-ending QB didn't dominate enough to be the guy with no need to find another guy.
Prior to 2009, Alex Smith had not seen game action since November 12, 2007. Almost two full seasons later, Smith came on in relief of Shaun Hill to start the second half of the 49ers week 7 loss at Houston. In one half of play, Smith put together the best performance of his career: 15/22, 206 yards, 3 touchdowns, 1 interception. While he's had better numbers, he's never quite had a half like that. That half certainly had 49ers fans a bit more fired up. The naysayers would point to the fact that he had nothing to lose and no pressure.
Over the course of the next 10 weeks, both sides would have reason to crow as Smith provided up and down performances, showing a general lack of consistency. Although Smith finished with the best numbers of his career, there was not a great sense of confidence in him as a long term option. At this point I don't think anybody would say Alex Smith is clearly the 49ers long term answer at QB. He would seem to be the answer for week 1 of the 2010 season, but beyond that is anybody's guess.
I'll close with my usual refrain. If you give Alex Smith a better offensive line (meaning add a tackle and a guard this offseason), I think you'll see improvement. If you give him the offseason working with Jimmy Raye, Mike Johnson, Michael Crabtree, Josh Morgan, Vernon Davis, and so forth, I think you'll see improvement. If we get both of these things happening? I think you see some solid improvement from Smith. He won't be joining the Peyton Manning's of the world, but I do think he could legitimately be a middle of the pack QB. And with the potential defense the 49ers could be rolling out, that would likely be more than enough to do some damage.
Looking Forward
I think it's safe to say we have a whole range of opinions as to what the 49ers should do going forward. There is the crowd arguing strictly some combination of letting Smith continue for another year and/or getting Nate Davis playing time. I combine them together because generally they are not looking to add a quarterback in the draft or through free agency. Another group is similar to the above, but they're looking for a cheap veteran or late round QB draft pick. Another group doesn't think much of Davis and doesn't like Smith so they want someone high in the draft. There are also the holdovers of the Shaun Hill Fan Club, but they've quieted down a bit.
For these looking forward segments, I thought I'd just throw out some potential names in free agency and the draft for consideration. We'll have plenty of time to discuss them in the coming months, but this is one way to consider the various options. For free agency I'm checking out Football's Future for now. It's free and a decent enough option, as opposed to the Insider options at ESPN. For the draft, I'm using our friends at Draft Tek who compile some of the more prominent sites and provide some of their own insight as well.
Free Agency
I won't say the well is dry, but the options are rather limited:
Kyle Orton - Appears likely to be a restricted free agent returning to Denver
Jason Campbell - He's frustrated a lot of Redskins fans but I think he's a fairly talented QB. I don't see the 49ers making a play for him, but he's a guy to keep an eye on (in my opinion)
Chad Pennington - Time's running out for Pennington after ending his season early with a shoulder injury. I've been a fan of his since his days at Marshall with Randy Moss, but he's not an answer for the 49ers.
There are other bodies there, but I just see a lot of useless options.
2010 NFL Draft
The rankings below are from Draft Tek. The players are listed in order of their positional ranking, with their overall Big Board ranking to the left of the name. Whether you agree or disagree with these rankings, this is more just to get names out there.
4. Sam Bradford, Oklahoma
9. Jimmy Clausen, Notre Dame
18. Colt McCoy, Texas
25. Tim Tebow, Florida
73. Tony Pike, Cincinnati
107. Jevan Snead, Mississippi
125. Dan Lefevour, Central Michigan
134. Sean Canfield, Oregon State
140. Christian Ponder, Florida State
177. Case Keenum, Houston
204. Jonathan Crompton, Tennessee
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Comments
the poll question
the answers just about have to be Davis or Smith. I think we’ve learned our lesson in starting a rookie QB so even if we draft one I doubt he sees the field as a starter in his first year. I also just don’t see any FA acquisitions beyond Campbell and there would be teams in a moderate competition for him (yes, there are teams that bad to want to compete for Jason Campbell). The reason I voted Davis is because the team showed this year that if things aren’t going well for a few games in a row and there is a guy they think can step in, they will make the switch. I think they are high enough on Davis that if Smith struggles for a few games, they would make the move to get Davis in there. Especially if the team were in a similar position to where we were last year when Smith came on in relief of Hill, ie. alive in the playoff hunt and trying to stop a losing streak.
"Vernon is going to be a great tight end one day, but he's got to put the whole package together." - Thanks Sing for echoing this.
point of personal bother
I hate that kneel downs get counted in a QBs running statistics, it just pisses me off
No one agrees but...
I think a “kneel down” should count as a sack. At least then there would be more interest at the end of games no matter what the score and anything could happen.
Nobody would be credited with the sack. That's a pretty bad idea.
You don’t really need to do anything to make football more interesting these days, except for maybe fire Joe Buck.
You can never resist the game... nor could I... we're the same, so don't even try.
First person to touch the QB gets a sack,
EVERY offense would be forced to keep playing and not just “kneel” out the game. It would be great in a close game when all that happens is 2 or 3 kneel downs. As I said no one agrees but I like it :)
I think teams would care more
about ending the game then having their QB get a couple extra sacks. I don’t see how this forces teams to play it out? It’s just a stat, and in the grand scheme of things quite meaningless. The risk of injury or a turnover will always outweigh stats.
Yep
They’d rather get a “fake sack” than a real sack.
by ChesapeakeBay9er on Jan 12, 2010 9:28 AM PST up reply actions
A kneel down doesn’t have to count as anything. Like a plate appearance that doesn’t get counted as an at bat.
I don't know about that, to the groin.
by howtheyscored on Jan 12, 2010 8:25 AM PST up reply actions
How about a new stat,
Called “Kneel Down.”
Kneel down
I think the about-to-win team at least deserves the kneel down if anything instead of counting it as a sack, which is nice for stat padding but makes zero sense whatsoever.
Win the inning.
by Scooter Ellis on Jan 12, 2010 10:44 AM PST up reply actions
Dan Lefevour intrigues me
Obviously there are some impressive names at the top but I’d rather use those high draft picks on other areas. But if we could grab Lefevour in the 4th round or later I wouldn’t be opposed (of course that might be a longshot too)
this
i too like the later round guys. hopefully we have a list and it’s casual…if we look up and, hey, so and so is still around! we take him. Otherwise there will also be some UDFA’s we could bring in and let there commence a battle royale for #2 and #3 QB spots!
"Vernon is going to be a great tight end one day, but he's got to put the whole package together." - Thanks Sing for echoing this.
nate davis had a better rating than lefevour. I know its a pretty meaningless statistic, but I just don’t see the point of muddying the QB waters with another late round MAC prospect. I don’t really think he gives us anything davis doesn’t. Just another project.
by hellaninersfan on Jan 12, 2010 11:44 AM PST up reply actions
How about Kory Sheets?
He was our future, after all. Could have been a good QB.
You can never resist the game... nor could I... we're the same, so don't even try.
you're supposed to be sick.
go back to bed LOL. you’re delusional
by srill waiting on Jan 12, 2010 8:42 AM PST up reply actions
Hey you shutup I'll tell you when I've had enough
Now pour me another one.
This is not the bar what the hell is going on
You can never resist the game... nor could I... we're the same, so don't even try.
by James Brady on Jan 12, 2010 10:07 AM PST up reply actions
On a serious note...
I voted Alex Smith. I know, I come off as a Smith hater but if we make improvements and have continuity, I think Smith can be good. The only QB I wanted in this draft was Jimmy Clausen and he won’t be around when the 49ers picked. Colt McCoy has bust written all over him but he seems to have that fire and passion and could surprise a lot of people, but I will not condone him at this point. Lefevour is a great prospect as well but I see him going in the second, and I don’t think the 49ers should spend that on him.
As far as free agency goes, I like what you say about keeping an eye on Jason Campbell, I honestly would love for the 49ers to scoop him up in free agency and see if they can’t get a good preseason from the guy. We’ll just have to see, I suppose.
It should be interesting, at least.
You can never resist the game... nor could I... we're the same, so don't even try.
What would happen..
If Smith got hurt for an extended period of time, and the 49ers were in the middle of a OCT/NOV run? Who would be good enough to back him up? Would Davis be ready? Is Hill still viable? Would the offense be good enough for a game manager?
Well, we're waiting....
Yeah, I was thinking about this, too
My instinct is that they’ll want to put Hill in – Singletary seems to like known quantities. I’d imagine that at the very least, Hill will be the ‘game time’ backup.
Of course, if Nate Davis really shows something, perhaps this will change. But can’t see him being thrown into a playoff race.
I suspect that you think tilting at windmills means something other than what it does.
Singletary likes known quantities
So I also see Hill as being the #2 option. But Crabtree came straight in and played. If Davis “works his tail off” and shows that he has the ability, then I don’t see why Singletary wouldn’t put him in there… buuuut probably only if Hill were to cause the team to regress.
hill
it would have to be. they gave him an extension last year for how much? and how long? the only way he doesn’t go is if he’s not even around.(waived)
by srill waiting on Jan 12, 2010 9:57 AM PST up reply actions
he's in the final year of his deal in 2010 season
I believe it was a 2 year extension.
The only qualm I have with keeping Hill around is that he’s taking snaps from the youngster(s) who “ARE OUR FUTURE”. I think they should being in someone in FA or later in the draft and battle it out for the 2 and 3 spots.
"Vernon is going to be a great tight end one day, but he's got to put the whole package together." - Thanks Sing for echoing this.
He's taking snaps
from ONE youngster, who WILL get snaps in minicamp and training camp and preseason, and doesn’t need to be rushed into anything.
Improvement
I think that word from Fooch says it all. I expect Smith to improve for all the above mentioned reasons. I do not expect that he’ll ever improve to the level of a top 5 NFL QB and likely not even top 10. But improved play from him and his mates on offense allows this team to take the next step.
For me that means drafting a QB after the 1st round if one looks good in draft workouts, plus keep developing Davis. Under that scenario, I certainy hope Smith is starting in week 17. Otherwise injuires have been a problem or he sucked so bad the team was better off with a second year player. Neither scenario is appealing.
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
You're being optimistic
And I’m not one to place a ceiling over the career of a young player. But I’d be thrilled if he were the twelfth best QB in the game. Right now, all six NFC playoff QBs are clearly better (though two may retire). Then there are the better QBs in the AFC. At this point I’ll take a QB who is in the top half of the league and improve what is around him, starting as you said with the o-line
You gotta bring ass to get ass.
I think its certainly possible
Did you see the way Brady played the other day. If Alex had a first quarter like that we’d all be calling for his head.
This is apropos of absolutely nothing, but I wanted any excuse at all to post it after I noticed it the other night.
In case anybody really needed any proof that QB rating is a lousy stat, here’s the top 15 CAREER QB Ratings of ALL TIME:
1. Aaron Rodgers
2. Steve Young
3. Philip Rivers
4. Tony Romo
5. Peyton Manning
6. Kurt Warner
7. Tom Brady
8. Joe Montana
9. Drew Brees
10. Ben Roethlisberger
11. Matt Schaub
12. Chad Pennington
13. Carson Palmer
14. Daunte Culpepper
15. Jeff Garcia
QB Rating is a lousy stat that roughly ranks efficiency based on an extremely current model of so-called efficiency. The fact that 13 of the top 15 ALL-TIME performers in a stat that is SUPPOSED to offer an objective measure of relative efficiency are ACTIVE players is truly the most damning thing about it. And the fact that Daunte Culpepper is on that list makes it even worse.
I don't know about that, to the groin.
In fact, “Daunte Culpepper has the 14th highest career passer rating in the history of the NFL” is going to be the first thing I say to anybody who brings up the “stat” from now on. I’m tempted to make it my signature.
I don't know about that, to the groin.
by howtheyscored on Jan 12, 2010 9:57 AM PST up reply actions
All stats are subjective in one way or another and comparing QBs by rating across eras doesn’t work. The QB ratings are higher now than ever because defenses aren’t allowed to touch receivers or QBs anymore. QB rating is as good as any other statistic for comparing QBs that are playing in the same season, but beyond that, yeah it’s pretty useless.
by Johnnysixnut on Jan 12, 2010 9:58 AM PST up reply actions
I’m not even convinced that it’s good for comparing QBs within a given season, though. It seems to rank quarterbacks roughly in order today, but I don’t know if it was really all that good at doing that even just 20 years ago. I think I’ll look back through the years a little bit sometime when I get the time.
I don't know about that, to the groin.
by howtheyscored on Jan 12, 2010 10:14 AM PST up reply actions
i was watching nfl live yesterday
they were saying that the qb rating is a better stat for defenses than individual players. interesting thought
by srill waiting on Jan 12, 2010 9:59 AM PST up reply actions
is there a DVOA-like stat for QB efficiency?
you know, that corrects for situation?
"Vernon is going to be a great tight end one day, but he's got to put the whole package together." - Thanks Sing for echoing this.
I believe that’s the whole idea behind DVOA. To provide a better measure of true passing efficiency than QB Rating.
Pro-Football-Reference is starting to show “+” versions for stats, which isn’t situational, but is pretty cool for looking at era-relativity (though it still gives a pretty incomplete bigger-picture).
I don't know about that, to the groin.
by howtheyscored on Jan 12, 2010 10:28 AM PST up reply actions
based on an extremely current model of so-called efficiency.
(By the way, this isn’t actually true, since QB Rating has been around since the 70’s. It is a fairly arbitrary model, though. Sometimes I need to talk out of my butt less. But at least I’m accountable!)
I don't know about that, to the groin.
by howtheyscored on Jan 12, 2010 10:35 AM PST up reply actions
But it's a great way to measure how well your defense is playing
since QB rating measures passing efficiency (completions, yards, TDs, INTs), if your defense can hold QBs to a lousy passer rating it indicates that you’ve done a good job.
Yes Drew K, Tim Tebow will get picked in the first round.
Well, the problem isn’t specifically that it’s measuring the wrong things. It’s that it’s measuring them wrongly. It functions on an arbitrary scale that overvalues certain things and undervalues certain things. Yes, it will always rate a good performance well and it will never rate a bad performance well, but it doesn’t really give you any sort of idea of the actual value of similar – or even somewhat similar – performances.
I don't know about that, to the groin.
by howtheyscored on Jan 12, 2010 12:49 PM PST up reply actions
culpepper
I wonder if he was auditioning for us when he came in the detroit game late.
Smith has exceeded expectations on a team
with no offensive line
with an average at best coordinator
with no comprehensible strategy or identity
with a rookie #1 WR (Crabtree is the man, but far from a relief)
on the positive side
he helped get VD a share of the TE TD record
he helped Crabtree achieve rookie performances at WR comparable to Rice
he helped Gore to a great all around season despite missing several games
he opened up the debate over the teams offensive identity
The last point cannot be stressed enough, especially considering the man in charge, and the mediocrity of the offenses inventiveness.
Every one of these points can be supported readily even by consensus amongst fans, reporters, and analysts.
Smith has the job until he is dead or Sing finds someone better
Sorry, had to throw in a horrendous film paraphrase.
But on a more serious note, I think Smith should and will be given every chance to succeed/fail next season. It will be interesting to see what he’ll do with that opportunity. And I think Hill is as solid a #2 option as we can ask for. He has done well off the bench in the past and he knows the team well. Heck, I think he might actually do better off the bench…maybe they should just throw him in randomly throughout the season.
What I think is important for the 49ers to do is find a viable #3 with some real potential that might provide a bit of a surprise. I’m reminded of how Kurt Warner made his unlikely NFL debut. Or how Steve Young reclaimed his career. I always think the #3 spot is where you should have such a potential gem. That way, if we lose #1, we just might find a shocking surprise waiting in the wings (even if it is more realistically a crushing disappointment there, it at least adds a little bit of something interesting.)
Finding that guy is not easy, but I think there are a few out there that could be a fun #3 option. Byron Leftwich has had some challenges, and he is almost certainly done in TB. Carr is a former #1 like Smith, and might be fun to give a chance at redemption to. There are a select few others out there that I think would be intriguing.
As a side note, I think Nate Davis is certainly not that guy. The only 2 college games of any import in 2008 he got massacred in. Basically, an undersized spread QB from the MAC who got trounced in big games (against unranked Tulsa and pretty much unknown Buffalo,) has a really bad grip, a learning disability, and who no other NFL team had any interest in…that does not inspire confidence. I am thoroughly confused as to why the 49ers drafted him at all, let alone so early. I’d much rather see a relatively young QB that had some real potential once and maybe floundered a bit for whatever reason (and not named Grossman) get a chance at redemption in our 3 spot.
A magically cured Pennington would be pretty cool too, but I’m pretty sure his career is over.
unless the O-line improves
Leftwich would be awful. He wouldn’t be a good fit even if the line improves. Low mobility, slow to release… no thanks.
Not sure any QB will succeed here
A) We aren’t getting a stud to come here. Not going to happen. If you’ve noticed, top tier coaches and players don’t want to work under singletary
B) We have the worst offensive coordinator in the last 30 years of the NFL. Jimmy is just terrible. And Singletary simply just doesn’t have a clue on what the right things to do offensively are. So the offense is in teh hands of a guy who is, by historical standards, GUARANTEED to give us one of the worst offenses in the NFL.
This is where the Niners are. Solution-less. Alex is not the guy, but even if he were, I don’t think it would get us to the playoffs.
The 49ers will not make the playoffs next year. Everyone else tries to get better. The Niners have ticker tape parades on going 8-8.
Have the standards for football here ever been this low>?
If Sing misses the playoffs...
He is gone. As is Alex. As is McClueless.
8 years of almost unrivaled incompetence simply doesn’t buy patience.

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