49ers Personnel: Is the training camp roster set?
by David Fucillo on May 9, 2010 8:00 AM PDT
in San Francisco 49ers News
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PrintAs we approach the 2010 NFL season, we'll be working to figure out the 49ers 53-man roster. I'll be posting position-by-position projections that will help us narrow down the list of bubble candidates and figure out who really has a shot at making the roster. These projections will take place over the next two months as we prepare for training camp.
One issue that we do have to keep in mind is the potential for late free agent signings. The last couple seasons have seen the 49ers adding players late in the offseason, and these acquisitions turned out to be incredibly important. Two years ago the 49ers signed Takeo Spikes at the beginning of training camp. The team needed a Ted linebacker, so they brought him in to compete for that position, and also to provide a bit of veteran leadership for what was a fairly young defense. In the course of the next two seasons, Spikes has become a key leader on the defense, a mentor for Patrick Willis, and a popular 49er.
Last year, the 49ers saw Walt Harris blow out his knee during OTAs, leaving the team potentially short a key cog in the secondary. The team went out and added Dre Bly. Bly certainly had his ups and downs in 2009, but nonetheless he showed he still had a few tricks up his sleeve. After initially coming in battling for the nickel and dime roles, Bly eventually found himself starting opposite Shawntae Spencer. While he was a solid contributor in 2009, it does not look like he'll be back in 2010.
The question now is whether the 49ers will be adding a potential impact veteran over the next two months. If everybody stays healthy, I'm not sure I see that happening. The team entered the offseason with several specific areas of concern, and they appear to have added sufficient talent to fill the holes for now. Obviously some of these guys might not work out, but that's a story for a different day. For now, the team added potential starters for the offensive line, a variety of kick/punt return options, another backup running back, a backup QB, and some cornerback help. The team could potentially add another veteran out there, but I'm thinking Will James is the last of the veteran additions at this point.
The circumstances surrounding the addition of Dre Bly last season are what make this still potentially an issue. Walt Harris blew out his knee during a voluntary workout in May. So, injuries could certainly open up the roster for some additions. However, assuming people stay healthy, I'm not sure I can see anywhere the team will make additions. Any contrary thoughts?
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I think we still need. . . . .
A great DE opposite Justin Smith. Greg Ellis is still out there, I think. I don’t know why we haven’t grabbed him. He loves the Bay Area and had a very good year in Oakland last year.
I’m still not sold that we have a RG. Thinking Pitts could compete there and help Davis too.
Not sold that we have the right FB. Norris blocks. But what about finding a true blocker / outlet guy who knows when to sneak into the open behind the line to grab a short pass from Alex when he’s in big trouble, almost like an improvised screen play (may not be many blockers around!) but if we find a kid who can run like a running back that would be nice.
I still think if we could pick up a veteran CB who could potentially start that would be critical. Clemens and Spencer aren’t a bad combination if they’re both healthy. But if one goes down I don’t don’t think we’ve got what we need there. I wish Tarrell Brown would step up but he didn’t last year.
Those are my 4 positions to put on a wish list.
And oh yeah, a really good starting QB would be nice. (Okay, kidding.) I think. :) . . \
I will admit, the Jason Campbell comparison post scared me. He didn’t have an O-line or a steady OC either. Looks a good deal better than Alex on paper, and does on tape as well. Better decisions. But that’s water under the bridge for 2010, and I like the present question Fooch posed. So please let’s not get into this again.
Happy Mother’s Day! It’s 3 hours earlier here in Hawaii so I still have time before the family wakes up. Nice to have a little Niner meditation before I start burning pancakes for everybody.
I agree with 50% of your still-needed wish list
I look at the issue in terms of “where are we weakest given the current rostter?”
On offense, I believe that our biggest weakness now is at FB. Norris’s performance dropped significantly in the 2009 season; he has never had much speed, but he’s lost whatever speed he had. As a result he no longer is any running threat and is almost useless as a receiver. That leaves blocking. He can still block but seems to miss many more blocking opportunities that in the past. In short, even though Frank loves him, I think his career is over. It would appear that Brit Miller has potential, but, as a conversion project, I’m not sure that he is ready yet. Don’t know enough about Caulcrick to know if he is a real candidate. Although not possible in the short term, could someone like Byham be converted to FB?
With Baas and Snyder as backups I think that we are OK at OG.
On defense, our biggest weakness is LDE. Issac is OK but nothing to write home about; he is not close to Smith’s competence level. The good news is that there appear to be a good number of very good to outstanding DE candidates in next year’s draft. Meanwhile, picking up someone like Greg Ellis could be a good temporary enhancement.
I certainly wish that we could have added a young CB in the third or fourth round of this year’s draft, but it didn’t happen. Hopefully, Adams will show potential, but he is a practice squad candidate at best. The addition of Will James together with Paymah gives us enough veteran experience at CB. Hopefully CB and DE will be a high priorities in the 2011 draft.
Speaking of the 2011 draft, and in light of Joe Nedney’s advancing age, I think that we should target drafting Kai Forbath of UCLA next year. He is the most accurate kicker to come along in at least the last ten years. And, he gets good distance on his kickoffs.
by 49erFanSince1950 on May 9, 2010 11:04 AM PDT up reply actions
Two thoughts or a few thoughts :-)
I think that Britt and Byham are both looked on to be a kind of H-Back or some other FB/TE mix. Byham from what I hear has fabulous blocking ability.
I liked the idea some have broached here of seeing if Baas can’t do some Center and maybe end up as our heir to Heitmann.
BTW I love the targetting Kai Forbath idea next year and I’m all for that.
by ChesapeakeBay9er on May 9, 2010 11:14 AM PDT up reply actions
Greg Ellis played outside in the 3-4
He’s a good DE but can’t play 3-4 DE.
It will be interesting to see how much they use the FB position this year. I would love for Brit Miller to step up and take over the position because I agree that Norris just doesn’t seem to cut it. As of right now, I’d rather have an H-back or Slot on the field to get the best 11 on the field.
Rachal has a lot of potential. So with Iupati on the other side and Baas providing depth, I don’t see any need to bring someone in. Rachal made a lot of mental mistakes early last year but really improved as the season progressed. Having the same coordinator 2 years straight should help the OL too.
FB is the only position I see can see a late signing coming in without an injury on offense.
Defensively, I love to see people writing about upgrading guys like Soap. He’s solid yet unspectacular. This is a huge upgrade from a few years ago where we wanted to replace a bunch of crap players. Looks like they’ll give Balmer one more year to prove himself or we’ll be looking for a young player to come in next year through the draft. A sleeper could be Ray Mcdonald returning to that role 2 years removed from his knee injury.
There just doesn’t seem like there’s any big holes on D that could really be upgraded with a late signing vet.
by abasketballfan on May 9, 2010 7:44 PM PDT up reply actions
That redskins team
Is farrrrr better than the Niners were in 05 and 06. The last 2 years Alex was the official starter before this year… I mean we really really sucked those years. We were Lions level bad.
The comparison isn’t really there to be made.
Gimme 1 round!
by ItBurnzWhenIP on May 9, 2010 2:41 PM PDT up reply actions
Not even going to find a defensive linemen the quality of Soap on the market this season.
The team kept RJF on the active roster because he would have been picked up immediately if exposed. Defensive linemen with any kind of quality are in such high demand.
BTW, solid but unspectacular isn’t bad at all for that position. A lot of teams are playing guys who flat out get blown off the line almost every single play.
I would add Greg Ellis and Fred Smoot/Dre Bly
Then we can make some noise IN THE PLAYOFFS.
"Singletary Football". To me, Singletary Football isn’t whether it’s on the ground or in the air. It’s about execution, discipline, and the mental toughness that will help predicate success.
Agree with you on Smoot
pull him in on a one year evaluation deal and be willing to sign him long term at the End of year or such and have him kinda be a cheaper Clements if he turns out. a CB roster of Spencer, Smoot, Clements, Brown, Stoudamire would be rather nice. Along with Goldson and Mays handling the safety duties. Greg Ellis is a maybe, I’m kinda sold on him but not sure how much he would want. As we’ve all said we want to be able to sign VD and we will need to sign our rooks.
I think Pitts is not needed at this time. I think with the addition of Davis and “Mountain Mike” Iupati along with our new OL Coaching staff we can have a darn good line and I’d like to work on some continuity. Plus let’s remember that we will have Nate Byham and Tony Curtis adding to our TE blocking capabilities.
As far as FB we have Britt Miller and I’d really like to try him out and see how he does. Plus we can also get some help there from Byham and Dixon.
Our front line should be much improved and not only for run blocking but pass blocking as well. Alex might even get a chance to take a complete breath back there. And then we can see if given that time he can get the ball to Crabs, VD, Ginn, Morgan and maybe even Hill and the new guys. (Speaking of new guys, Hodge is gone right?)
Anyway just my half cent’s worth.
by ChesapeakeBay9er on May 9, 2010 11:05 AM PDT up reply actions
What else do we need?
If we look at the current roster and develop some patience as fans to let the kiddie corps have 2-3 years to develop and do not worry about injuries to key players, the roster looks pretty good for now. It can always get better. How about we look at age of the players and start thinking about where we need to look for the next generation to be learning to step in. Have we figured out who eventually replaces Norris at FB, Heitman at C, Nedney at PK yet? Those are the obvious older players I could think of. There will be a lot of potentially good players being waived at the end of training camps—-are we making a list of who could be worth a roster or PS slot if they become available to us? Do you want to volunteer to think about this?
Greg Ellis is 34 years old.
Not knockin the guy cause I’m a few years older, but his is not on his way up. Balmer was drafted as a DT and has switched to De cause of the 3-4. Although it has taken him some extra time to adjust, he was starting to get better last year before getting injured. At 313lbs, he is the right size as a 3-4 DE and is 23 years old. I’ll stick with a guy that’s 11 years younger than his alternative. Balmer BTW, is not even the starter.
I figure Ellis would play OLB in the 3-4 like he did in Dallas and would also give us a Pass rusher out of the Nickel
"Singletary Football". To me, Singletary Football isn’t whether it’s on the ground or in the air. It’s about execution, discipline, and the mental toughness that will help predicate success.
How many linebackers will make the 53?
If you say that DEs like Ellis could be targeted to play OLB in a 3-4, I just wonder how many OLBs and ILBs, or even DEs if they are going to effectively be OLBs, we will end up with? I ask because it seems to me Singletary collects linebackers like other people collect cobwebs in their attic.
LondonNiner - member of the legendary David Carr thread, 6 March 2010.
Pitts is a risk
He only played 2 games last year before suffering a microfracture injury. He is 30 years old and is no longer needed as we drafted Iupati and have Rachal and Baas battling it out for the RG position.
Matbe they should keep Dre Bly for one more season to allow the younger guys to develope.
We don't need Pitts at all
"Singletary Football". To me, Singletary Football isn’t whether it’s on the ground or in the air. It’s about execution, discipline, and the mental toughness that will help predicate success.
+1
had we not drafted Iupati I’d be screaming for Pitts, but I’m happy with what our offensive line is projected to be.
I was right, you were wrong.
Yeah get the continuity going
Just imagine it…
25 yr old Staley playing Left
20 yr old Davis playing right
22 yr old Iupati taking the left guard position
24 yr old Rachal taking up the right guard position
then a second or third round center next year to round it up
a good young line to envy for years to come.
by ChesapeakeBay9er on May 9, 2010 7:35 PM PDT up reply actions
question marks
RG is a ? mark but I hope between Rachl and Baas (Rachal) it will become a stength.
I still think Balmer and McDonald can rotate in at LDE and one or both eventually replace Soap.
CB depth is a bit of an unknown and you can never have too many CB’s but the problem can be if you keep rostering a lot of 30+ CB’s you end up without many young protege’s learning. Brown and a rookie should make roster. My wish woulda been to have someone a little better than Smith, Paymah in camp but they might surprise us.
I think the pass rush will be better in 2010 too.
Basically I think we’re OK for 2010 but will have some needs in the 2011 draft.
"I will speak at times, when it's necessary, but I don't believe in talking just because you can." - P-52
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by Tre9er on May 9, 2010 1:16 PM PDT via mobile reply actions
What 2011 needs are you seeing?
I’d say the top 3 are CB, NT, OC, COP RB, rushing DE and rushing OLB and WR (from COP RB on are really more wants than actually needs)
by ChesapeakeBay9er on May 9, 2010 7:38 PM PDT up reply actions
I think it's time for a stud CB
Unless Brown steps up and just blows us all away, or one of the rookies. That’s why I say we’ll know for 2011, but likely it’s CB first, as in, “first round”.
NT will reveal itself as a need or not this year too. Behind Franklin it’s Soap, who is losing traction on the team in general and is not great at NT. Establishing a better backup to Franklin and then gauging what player has for potential at the position would be great. If no clear backup emerges (we really dont have a lot of guys who are the size/strength combo for NT) then it will become a need in 2011 even if Franklin get’s re-signed. I’d go 3rd round maybe here?
Center, can one of our many Guards play center at a high enough level that they could start a few games for Heitmann and not be a big weakness? Remains to be seen. I’d love for Baas to replace Wragge as the G/C backup but that’s an unknown. If Wallace isn’t getting a ringing endorsement as the heir to Heitmann (and will we know that?) then a 3rd thru 5th round pick should be warranted.
COP RB, I don’t know. We’ll have to see how the run game does in 2010. If it succeeds with the guys we have, I couldn’t call it a priority. If a guy comes along like Spiller who has even better return skills than what we have on the roster (which seems like a tall order based on our level of hope with Vann, Williams, Ginn) then maybe but then you got three tailbacks you drafted in the last 3 years, plus Gore, a FB and Robinson (special teams reservation). I’d say if they find a way to use Dixon as a FB when needed and/or if someone overtakes Robinson as MVP of special teams…it’d become more likely. Just too many backs to roster.
We have LaBoy and Brooks who are both known as rushing OLB’s. I really look for a strong pass rush this year from the OLB’s, a rotation, competition, contract extensions looming…
Rushing DE, you mean a Justin Smith (every down) or a Nickel/Dime only DE? I think the team is going to use OLB’s on both sides in 2010 and beyond in 4-man fronts so unless it’s a Smith-like 3-4 DE who can rotate in on passing downs as well…I don’t see it.
What about ILB? I know we expect Bowman to be the backup to both Willis/Spikes and likely take over for TKO but do we really know if Scotty McK or Wilhelm have a long-term future? Briggs is someone they really like so perhaps he’s slated to play next to Bowman in a backup role…still unknown. But I don’t think we can say we’re totally out of the ILB market in 2011.
WR is intriguing. I hate how the team has a ton of question marks at WR. Hill, Jones, etc, etc??? Is Morgan the best we can do at #2 WR? Is Williams gonna be Wes Welker West (WWW)? I hope we use the WR’s enough in 2010 to answer these questions.
What about Safety? What if DG can’t get an extension done and walks? Don’t we expect Lewis to get cut as early as Pre-Season? Those two things would put us down 2 safeties, even if just for depth. Maybe not a high-ranking need but it could be a mid-round discussion depending on how 2010 plays out.
"I will speak at times, when it's necessary, but I don't believe in talking just because you can." - P-52
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RG
If Bass and Rachel sucked last year, along with Snyder, then why are you thinking one of them or both of them would be a strength this year.
I know Bass was injured last year and Rachel was getting better, but how much better? One weakness in the line screws up the whole line. We can’t have a weakness at any OL position. So if not Pitts, then some other veteran should be brought in to see if they can wrestle away the starting position. If Rachel wins it then great. We can let the veteran and Bass fight it out for the back up spot. That’s the way to create a strong Oline. Having Snyder on the team even as a back up makes no sense. He has failed everywhere he’s played, I think. Let Bass be a back up guard and back up center. Would love to see Boone make the team too. Let Wallace go. Staley, Simms / Iupati, Bass / Heitman, Bass / Rachal or Bass or Puentes or ? / Davis, Boone, Simms. That’s probably as good as we’re gonna get right now. I don’t think that’s AMAZiING. That’s a line with potential, 2 rookies, and a maybe at RG. So I just think bringing in as veteran who can maybe start at RG and move to RT in a pinch would make a lot of sense.
Rachal didn't suck last year
Baas didn’t suck either. He was average and Rachal turned it on big time by the end of the year when he figured things out.
Iupati is an upgrade over Baas and will be a perennial Pro-Bowl guard. We’ve got Davis coming in to be an upgrade over Snyder. We don’t need to bring in another veteran lineman.
My starting lineup
Staley, Iupati, Heitmann, Rachal, Davis
Backups. Sims, Baas, Snyder. Wallace and Patrick will be on the PS and we’ll cut Wragge.
I was right, you were wrong.
Do you think Davis will start immediately?
by ZeroOneInfinity on May 9, 2010 2:00 PM PDT up reply actions
If he doesn't start
They wasted the pick. Because I guarantee Bulaga could beat out Snyder at RT
Gimme 1 round!
by ItBurnzWhenIP on May 9, 2010 2:46 PM PDT up reply actions
Well Bulaga does seem to be a better starter now
but I think Davis has better potential. Plus, if the coaching staff is thinking about possibly making Davis into a LT, Davis is going to be a better LT than Bulaga.
by ZeroOneInfinity on May 9, 2010 2:57 PM PDT up reply actions
With Solari and Brown as the OL coaches I think everyone gets better.
I feel comfortable with Staley – Iupati – Heitmann – Rachal – Davis. Also add Sims, Baas and Boone as backups and you have a young powerful OL.
"Whether you think you can, or you think you can't, either way, YOU'RE RIGHT !"
LOL good point..
he’s gotta beat out “The Doorman” Snyder. That’s not much to do.
by ChesapeakeBay9er on May 9, 2010 7:41 PM PDT up reply actions
I noticed...
no mention of Boone at all. You thinking he gets cut?
by ChesapeakeBay9er on May 9, 2010 7:42 PM PDT up reply actions
AND I BUY IN COMPLETELY SMILEYMAN
When you get a moment, please forward your remarks on to Niner management. It makes sense – and fortunately here lately, our team is really starting to actually DO things that make a lot of sense – OK so all except that ‘not getting a corner early’ – but otherwise they are nothing like a recent regime I will leave nameless. I mean we are actually playing guys that were made to sit before and everything. Wow.
I'd like to see Boone make the active roster
but I’m not sure he will. Even though Snyder sucks as a RT I think he’s probably better right now than Boone is.
I was right, you were wrong.
I've noticed
Where I see a lot of hope the rookies work out well, and cause an intense camp this year, ( I do hope the coaching staff pulls there hair out because all are good) colledeg is not the nfl, I think out roster looks pretty good, and all I can say is may the best man win.
R.L.
Could Alex Boone be a starting Center in a couple years?
It seems like he made some great strides, maybe he should take up long snapping and start working as the backup center.
I don’t know much about the line, but as a 2 or 3 year project, maybe it would be viable.
What are your thoughts, Smiley?
They're called RUNS for a reason.
blurb on Boone pre-draft last year
Alex Boone is one of the top tackle prospects for the 2009 NFL Draft. Boone is a huge, mountain of a man who practically lives in the film room according to his coaches. Boone is the leader of an offensive line that is averaging 192.5 yards rushing per game in 2008, even without the services of Chris “Beanie” Wells for part of the season. The Buckeye offensive line (which allowed only 19 sacks in 13 games last year), struggled in pass protection during the 2008 season, allowing 29 sacks in just 13 games. Alex Boone, however, deserves little of the blame for the line’s struggles. Boone is very experienced, having played in 45 games in his career at Ohio State, and starting in 36 of those contests. Playing in the notoriously smash mouth Big Ten, Boone has become an excellent run blocker. He likes to get downfield in the run game and run over people in the secondary. Boone also happens to be a very, very intelligent offensive lineman, which helps him while pass blocking. He is always careful to slide pass protection to pick up blitzing linebackers or defensive backs. He uses excellent leverage and technique while blocking, and possesses adequate speed for such a huge lineman. Boone will have to move from left tackle in college to the right side in the NFL, because he doesn’t possess the quickness to block the leagues elite speed rushers. Depending how the run on tackles starts, Boone could be drafted anywhere from the mid third round to the early fourth round.
"I will speak at times, when it's necessary, but I don't believe in talking just because you can." - P-52
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sounds like just Tackle
http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/players/563618
"I will speak at times, when it's necessary, but I don't believe in talking just because you can." - P-52
Follow me on Twitter
No QB?
I don’t believe anyone has addressed the QB replacement. Maybe because everyone (including me) are putting their eggs in the Alex Smith basket. Unless he has a COMPLETELY different season from all the other seasons, we need to look at a QB that can win a championship. Without a QB who has the potential to do this, I think we will continue to play in mediocrity.
by notalexsmith on May 10, 2010 7:16 AM PDT via mobile reply actions
Umm
Teams can win championships with a mediocre QB and a great defense. The Ravens did it with Trent Dilfer. The ’85 Bears did it with Jim McMahon. I think it is a good move to give Smith the season to see if he can improve off of last season. If he cannot, then the team will draft/trade/sign a QB replacement next season.
by ZeroOneInfinity on May 10, 2010 9:40 AM PDT up reply actions
+1
The effectiveness of the QB does certainly play a big role in the team’s success, but he is also only as good as what is built around him, including the defense. I don’t think The Jets would have gotten anywhere near the AFC Championship last season without having a very good OL and the best defense statistically in the league.
97 days to go. . .And contrary to popular belief, sadly I do not have ESP.
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