Roster Projections: Final O-Line spots
by Tre9er on Aug 20, 2010 1:24 PM PDT
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PrintSo I had a twitter debate today with a few other hardcore 49ers fans on this issue. I want to get some discussion going on the final O-Line roster spots as this is one of the last true battles going on right now. We know the starters would be the following, were it not for Eric Heitmann breaking his fibula:
Joe Staley, Mike Iupati, Eric Heitmann, Chilo Rachal, Anthony Davis
Obviously now David Baas is going to play Center with Heitmann out another month or so. I think we can read the writing on the wall: Wragge becomes a lock, for now, to make the roster as he is the only viable backup at Center. He can also play Guard and has been getting reps there also this past week or so.
So that's seven O-Linemen, the same number the team dressed for games last year. Generally it's your starting five guys, then a G/C backup (Wragge) and a swing tackle backup (guy who can play RT or LT if need be). Last year that was Barry Sims when Staley was healthy. This year there is competition for that spot between Sims, Adam Snyder and Alex Boone.
After the jump, I make my case...
Barry Sims played awfully at RT in 2009. Strangely though, when called upon to fill-in for an injured Joe Staley at LT, he played exceptionally well. I think he's just one of those guys who's better suited for the speed rush on the left side of the line rather than being the mauler on the right side.
Adam Snyder played most of last season as the starting RT after Marvel Smith retired and Tony Pashos went down with injury. Snyder never seemed to get in a groove though and was arguably the worst O-Lineman on the team in 2009.
Snyder has also played some Guard and even has been getting reps there in camp this year. I'll have to re-watch the Indy game as well as pay close attention to him Sunday against Minnesota to see how effective he is at either position this year.
Alex Boone was one of the top rated Tackles in college football in 2009 before his drunken rampage brought up a lot of questions about his work ethic and character. He was fat and had slow footwork as a rookie last season and subsequently was signed to the practice squad.
This year he's gotten in great shape and has shown his greatly improved feet so far in camp and in the Indianapolis game last Sunday. He's worked on both sides but it's encouraging that he can handle the finese of the left side while being big and strong enough to play the right side. As a young player he has a lot of upside and could be a good player for many years to come.
The team wil probably roster two of these players for now, making the grand total nine players with Heitmann's injury. However once Heitmann returns to action I would expect them to trim back down to eight OL's in order to be adequately supplied at other positions.
So here we have a guy who is 35 years old in Sims, on a one year deal, who looked really bad at RT last year while playing great at LT. He's likely done after 2010, either with football or with the 49ers due to his age...at least it wouldn't be a surprise.
Then we have Snyder who knows both G and T positions but thus far hasn't really performed well at either (unless someone can point me to some tape, I'll gladly watch it). The team currently has two players who can play Guard as backups (Baas and Wragge, who both also can play Center). Snyder, though only 28, is also not a spring chicken and I would say is pretty near his ceiling as a player.
Then we have Alex Boone. Prototypical size, young, high upside, transformed body, and by all accounts thus far this off-season, performing quite well. I personally think Boone should be the backup swing Tackle this season as he likely could provide many years of service and I feel he has the potential to be a starting caliber Tackle if all goes well.
So I'm hoping for the following final OL roster spots come 53-man cut time:
Staley, Iupati, Baas, Rachal, Davis
Wragge, Snyder, Heitmann, Boone
Then cutting Snyder or Wragge, whichever is the worse Guard of the two, unless Snyder makes a quantum leap at Tackle.
Thoughts?
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of Niners Nation's writers or editors. It does reflect the views of this particular fan though, which is as important as the views of Niners Nation's writers or editors.
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said it yourself. sims was solid last year and boone is playing against backups
Um, how am i supposed to sign this thing? It's a computer?!
Sims was solid at LT only
and how much longer is he gonna be solid? If he retires or leaves in FA and Boone is cut and signed elsewhere…where does that put us? I’d rather take my lumps early on with Boone (and Snyder, who will at least be able to hang around for a few games if Boone wasn’t ready yet) and end up with a 10 year player than lose them both.
Vernon Davis, Michael Crabtree, Tedd Ginn/Delanie Walker, Frank Gore, Brian Westbrook...which one is getting the ball and where?
Let's talk on Twitter
id rather have a solid backup, and have boone on the ps for next year.
Um, how am i supposed to sign this thing? It's a computer?!
Boone wouldn't make it to the PS. A team would snap him up.
I survived the David Carr Press Conference Thread 3/06/2010
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by Hoopers Judge on Aug 20, 2010 3:13 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
oh well thats just a risk we have to take. im not hatin on boone, i think he has some potential but not as much as alot of you give him. id rather have a guy that we know is solid then a guy who we have no idea what he’s got
Um, how am i supposed to sign this thing? It's a computer?!
Completely disagree with your thinking ...
You KNOW that Sims will be gone next year; and, he is ONLY good at LT. Why would you give away a potential 10-year player of potential high quality in order to keep Sims for one year? Sims has NO upside and Boone has substantial upside. Just doesn’t make sense — not much difference in present performance level and Boone can play both sides.
by 49erFanSince1950 on Aug 20, 2010 7:54 PM PDT up reply actions
What makes you think Boone has 10 years of high quality in him?
I just don’t get this lovin’—it’s worse than the Nate Davis love. At least ND has shown something in pre-season.
Logic merely enables one to be wrong with authority
Sims/Boone
you said it yourself, sims is good at lt. actually he is solid.
we know what we have in sims, a solid backup lt.
we have no idea how boone would perform. he could be bad or good, do you really want to risk that?
just keep sims and put boone on the ps. trust me, no one will snatch him up.
Um, how am i supposed to sign this thing? It's a computer?!
"trust me, no one will snatch him up."
I have read nothing posted by you that would inspire even the smallest quantum of trust. If we try to PS Boone, he’s gone in a heartbeat. And I hope beyond hope that our “powers that be” have enough sense to not test our predictions…. that’s a chance I don’t want to take.
Granted, Sims did yeoman’s work last season at LT. However, he’s 35 years old, and there’s NO guarantee as to how much he has “left in the tank”. I don’t want to waive Boone with the intention of PSing him, just to have him snatched up, and end up needing that back-up tackle, just to find out that Sims is “washed up” and us left with no other option.
After all was said and done, a lot more got said than done.
Why does it have to be between Sims and Boone?
I think if it comes down to that choice Wragge gets dumped
Logic merely enables one to be wrong with authority
he is a lock since eric got hurt but once he returns he is likely cut
Um, how am i supposed to sign this thing? It's a computer?!
Why is Wragge a lock?
Baas is playing center now
Logic merely enables one to be wrong with authority
what if baas performs bad? what do we do then?
Um, how am i supposed to sign this thing? It's a computer?!
Or gets hurt before Heitmann comes back?
by sanfranfanmdk on Aug 20, 2010 6:07 PM PDT up reply actions
Then we figure something else out
I sure wouldn’t want Wragge starting at center for us if Heitmann and Baas were out due to injury.
Logic merely enables one to be wrong with authority
Why not Wragge?
Because …
If you keep 8 offensive linemen, after the starting 5 you want to keep guys that can play multiple positions in case of emergency:
Baas = C/LG/RG
Snyder = RT/RG/C and maybe LG
Boone = LT/RT
Wragge = G/C
Baas is better than Wragge and is therefore the primary backup at C and G
Boone can play both LT and RT so is more flexible than Sims
Snyder, although not as talented as the previous two, can play T/G/C
Wragge may be as talented as Snyder but he is not as versatile
by 49erFanSince1950 on Aug 20, 2010 8:08 PM PDT up reply actions
I disagree with the jack-of-all trades philosophy because it means you're master of none
I know for sure I would rather have Sims at LT than Boone.
Logic merely enables one to be wrong with authority
by smileyman on Aug 20, 2010 8:21 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
you dont need your backups to be a "master" at any one position.
that will just get them signed away to be starters for another team when their contract is up.
being mediocre at several positions is what you want in your backup o-linemen.
When life gives you fruit, add a bunch of sugar to it.
by these3words on Aug 20, 2010 10:38 PM PDT up reply actions
the oline
I think the nine linemen should be exactly as you listed them. I think these are the nine guys they should keep the entire season.Should keep nine incase of any other injuries. Infact I’d keep the starting oline that you listed intact even when heitmann returns and keep him as one of the backups. When heitmann returns the five starters should be starting to jell and I wouldn’t want to change that.
by bmcrae83@yahoo.com on Aug 20, 2010 2:43 PM PDT reply actions
Starters:
Staley
Iupati
Heitmann
Rachal
Davis
Backups
Baas (starting C for first few games)
Snyder (backup G and RT)
Boone (Backup LT and RT)
Wragge (backup until Heitmann returns)
A fringe player backup somewhere else will make the PS until Heitmann returns and then Wragge goes and the PS player comes back to the 53.
This allows for two good Backups for G and T and also a backup for C.
"Whether you think you can, or you think you can't, either way, YOU'RE RIGHT !"
Backup to the backup Center
Snyder took snaps at center in OTAs and could sub the position in an emergency. What are the odds of an emergency in the first 2 weeks? Wragge and Snyder have redundant skill sets otherwise, with Snyder also able to play RT. You can keep 8 including Boone, and Wragge will be a phone call away if needed.
The thing is
We usually keep between 8-10 OL per year, but most common is 9. So with that, our starting 5:
Staley, Iupati, Heitmann, Rachal, Davis
Back ups:
Sims, Snyder, Bass, Boone
Starters: Staley, Iupati, Heitmann, Rachal, Davis
Backups: Sims, Snyder, Boone, Baas
Gives us two tackles, a guard and a guard/center as backups. I haven’t really seen anything from Wragge that makes me think he’ll make the roster. Same with Wallace and de la Puente
Logic merely enables one to be wrong with authority
i agree that de la Puente won't make it
and cody wallace should be gone already.
but Wragge has to make the roster. what if Baas goes down in the first few games? we wouldnt have a healthy center on the roster.
When life gives you fruit, add a bunch of sugar to it.
by these3words on Aug 20, 2010 10:43 PM PDT up reply actions
We sign Kevin Mawae
or another free agent center that’s actually played in the league
Logic merely enables one to be wrong with authority
during the game?
or should we play without a center for the remaining two and a half quarters? just let the ball sit there until the play clock runs out…
When life gives you fruit, add a bunch of sugar to it.
by these3words on Aug 20, 2010 11:30 PM PDT up reply actions
Honestly I'd rather put Snyder in at center than Wragge
Logic merely enables one to be wrong with authority
I think its Boone or Sims, not Boone and Sims
Sims has no future after this year (age). If Boone is NFL ready, Sims is redundant. Wragge plays 3 positions, so is more versatile as a reason to prefer keeping him versus Sims. However, in that scenario, Wragge takes the extra linebacker, CB, Safety, special teams ace, or WR slot. Is he worth it?
by seafood lover on Aug 20, 2010 5:50 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
Sims makes the Roster based on the fact that he can play LT well.
If Staly gets hurt again, we need Sims at LT the most important O-line position protecting the blindside. This will come down to a hard decision on who to cut. I think that Wragge is the least attractive player and think he would clear waivers. If he didn’t clear and Baas got hurt, they could sign Wallace, you know, that guy that has been in the background doing nothing. He could play of 1 game till E Heitmann cam back.
so what if Wragge clears waivers?
it’s not like he’s PS eligible, he’s been around for a million years. and if baas goes down, you can’t just sign a guy in the middle of the game.
we need a backup center on the roster until heitmann comes back, at which point Baas becomes the backup center.
When life gives you fruit, add a bunch of sugar to it.
by these3words on Aug 20, 2010 10:46 PM PDT up reply actions
Snyder can play Center as an emergency backup in a game,
Then you sign Wragge for any future games. No one is bustin chops to get Wragge, he should be there waiting for a call.
by ericalancanty on Aug 21, 2010 10:05 AM PDT up reply actions
I think that with the emergence of Boone, they should look to trade Sims for a draft pick.
My feeling is that the roster is stacked with NFL quality players from 1-53, going into the season with Staley as the starter at LT, and Boone as his primary backup makes plenty of sense. I know stuff happens, but that seems like a reasonable chance to take.
However, at C, they have to keep Heitmann, Baas, and a backup that can play C reasonably well, I think Wragge is that guy.
You keep Snyder to backup three positions, Wragge backs up three positions, Boone backs up two spots, and when Heitmann comes back, Baas backs up three spots as well.
The other part of this equation is that maybe Baas should just be the starting C instead of Heitmann, It sure seemed like there was a much better push in the middle of the line on run plays than there used to be.
They're called RUNS for a reason.
Nobody's gonna trade a draft pick for a 35 year old...
After all was said and done, a lot more got said than done.
he can competently play as a LT in the league
think ‘league average LT’ , even if it is just for one year, that is worth a 6th round pick if you are starting the equivalent of Adam Snyder in that position.
They're called RUNS for a reason.
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