Revis as a niner (pure speculation)
by zacksf on Sep 4, 2010 5:50 PM PDT
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Maybe this is an over-reach, i.e., more than we need. I know Andrew Davidson is happy with our secondary and probably I should be too. But I can't help feeling that man coverage skills enable blitz packages, and with Lawson, Brooks, LaBoy and Haralson on the outside, along with Willis and Spikes (and his neck) on the inside, we have a lot of potent blitz potential that i would like to see enabled. (Not to mention J. Smith and McDonald or RJF on the DL inside on passing downs.) Additionally there are, of course, safety blitz possibilities, etc. The bottome line is: when we bring 5 or 6 from unexpected places, that is hard to stop.
The keys to doing that and not getting burned, I believe, are sound schemes (we have that with Manusky!) and some man coverage ability (enough to hold for a few seconds).
So I will get to the point and my question, which is possibly irrelevant and impossible. What would you think of paying Revis 15.2 M per year* (say, 9 M guaranteed) for one or 3 years or so in the niner backfield? Would that upset team chemistry? Is it even necessary? Are there better options? Should we stand pat?
(* Is that an irrational salary, i.e., did the Raiders pay Nnamdi too much??)
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of Niners Nation's writers or editors. It does reflect the views of this particular fan though, which is as important as the views of Niners Nation's writers or editors.
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Last year it was Dunta Robinson
$9.957 million
Asante Samuel made $9.9 million last year
Revis made $7.4 million
Corey Webster made $7.3
Highest paid CB in the league last year was Champ Bailey at $13.188 million
Logic merely enables one to be wrong with authority
Asomugha not among the highest?
Can you explain that?
by ZeroOneInfinity on Sep 5, 2010 1:26 PM PDT up reply actions
Highest paid CB in the league last year was Champ Bailey at $13.188 million
When life gives you fruit, add a bunch of sugar to it.
This is the NFL's list of salary/franchise money for 2009
Asomugha’s $15 million was paid out in March of this year in two separate roster bonuses
Logic merely enables one to be wrong with authority
Revis reportedly wants $16 million per year
You won’t get him for $9. You might get him for $13 million per year.
I’m conflicted about the costs. On the one hand with the league turning to the passing game so much the guys who stop that need to be paid like the guys who are doing the passing. $13 million per year barely cracks the top 10 QBs.
On the other hand $13 million per year for a CB seems excessive—but maybe that’s just a mind set of mine that needs to change.
Logic merely enables one to be wrong with authority
Naa a QB is basically controls the offence
You can survive without a good CB but its a lot harder to survive without a good QB.
Think of it this way
How many QB’s do you have on a team versus how many CB’s you need. We hear the “Water covers 9X% of the earth and XXXX covers the rest.” but one CB can’t do it whereas a QB can. it’s an economic model.
by ChesapeakeBay9er on Sep 5, 2010 11:51 AM PDT up reply actions
having the same thoughts
Makes since but shorter deals. Nhamdi got a 3 year deal but looking at now makes since. You can’t sign a corner even like revis to 10yr 162mil like wants. But maybe 6yr 90mill 39 guaranteed
Can u c coach sing's vision? I do!......We all know PATRICK WILLIS is our future!
May 12 2010 comment of the day award winner on the nuggets!
by DreZ on Sep 5, 2010 6:40 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
Would I like to have Revis as one of our Corners?
Absolutely … based on talent alone. However, he isn’t worth that kind of money (Yes, Al Davis went crazier with Nnamdi’s contract! What a surprise!). We have to think about extending our guys as the first priority. The best way for us to get a “shut-down corner” is (1) to draft and develop one, or (2) trade for someone with potential who can be satisfied with a "reasonable
by 49erFanSince1950 on Sep 4, 2010 10:43 PM PDT reply actions
that was an excellent post
I was sort of leaning towards liking a Revis deal, but that is the best answer out there. we just continue to build through the draft. we have great evaluators.
by WiltonDeportes on Sep 4, 2010 10:55 PM PDT up reply actions
I'm beginning to wonder
if there’s a paradigm shift in the league. Once upon a time it was unthinkable to pay big bucks to offensive linemen. Then Lawrence Taylor came along and free agency happened and now offensive linemen are the second-highest paid position in the NFL.
Right now the average pay of the top 10 RBs in the league is $7 milliion. Average pay for the top 10 CBs is $8 million.
Last year average top 10 QB pay was $14.54 million. I could see the top 10 CB pay ending up averaging about 2/3 of that (so about $10 million per year).
Logic merely enables one to be wrong with authority
Yes that's a good point
and yes there has been said for quite a few years “you can get a good RB in the second or third of the draft” and that the “wear on their tires” makes them not worth a long term contract. As you have noted above, it’s a passing league. You pay the tackle to give the QB some time, you pay the CB to stop the pass. You pay the WR to catch the pass. You pay the QB to make the pass. You get some guards and RBs and such to help with that and to do some running to keep the D honest. But their value is not what it was.
by ChesapeakeBay9er on Sep 5, 2010 11:57 AM PDT up reply actions
You can add to that list the average pay for a high level NT is $7 mil
It’s another one we should be thinking about because of Franklin. Honestly, I think $7 mil is not bad and he would only be signed to a 3-4 year extension. NTs are the centerpieces to the 3-4, so do you risk losing that just because of the price tag?
When it comes to CBs, it looks like that is where CBs are going in price just because of importance and inflation. There is always going to be that guy who comes along who becomes the new best in the league at his position and asks to be paid like it. I wonder how Peyton Manning’s new deal is going to look. I’m kind of worried about that one.
by ZeroOneInfinity on Sep 5, 2010 1:33 PM PDT up reply actions
You and every NFL team would like Revis
VD is a good thing and nobody wants to catch Crabs this year
I dunno...
On the other hand, with Revis we would have the number 1 defense in the league. Let Goldson walk, take Revis!
I know Goldson wants to get paid
but he might be willing to stick with the 49ers for less money than he would get in FA if Revis is part of the secondary. Revis helps the rest of the secondary look better. Just a thought.
by ZeroOneInfinity on Sep 5, 2010 1:25 PM PDT up reply actions
Ain't going to happen
I have the feeling that Goldson plays for the money. Smith and Mays can should be able to start by the beginning of 2011 leaving Goldson expendable. I say give the money to another person such as VD or another person who loves coach Sing.
Oh definitely
VD is much more worthy for an extension. However, I think you are underestimating the importance of the talent on the team that the player is signing with. I know Goldson wants money, but if staying with a 49ers team with Revis would mean that he looks better on the 49ers than he would with say the Lions.
I’m fine with letting Goldson walk if he wants money. He can go find it somewhere else. However, if he’s willing to stick around for less than he would get in FA, then I would be alright with keeping him.
by ZeroOneInfinity on Sep 5, 2010 1:38 PM PDT up reply actions
What player that play..
with Champ Bailey do you think he makes better? The #2 CB is gonna get hit due to not wanting to throw a the #1.
by ChesapeakeBay9er on Sep 5, 2010 1:36 PM PDT up reply actions
Look at it a different way
Did the Jets have a good secondary last season? Can you name their safeties from last season without looking it up? What I am trying to say is that Revis makes the rest of the defense look better and allows the defense to do different things. With some teams, as long as you shut down that #1 WR, the rest of the offense is out of sync. I was surprised to see Revis handle Andre Johnson as well as he did and Andre is about 50% of their offense, so it makes sense that they struggled.
Honestly, I don’t know enough about the Broncos to know Champ’s career. But I would say that Champ probably made John Lynch look better than he may have been as Lynch was coming to the end of his career and starting to decline.
by ZeroOneInfinity on Sep 5, 2010 1:48 PM PDT up reply actions
it would be nice to have a shut down corner but...
it’s just not gonna happen… to much $$$, and it’s not the right time for us with all the signings we need to complete in the future. It will be priority #1 in the draft next year depending on how our QB’s perform this year. Lets just hope Nate stays healthy and Spencer continues to improve
I'm happy with the secondary
but I’d be even happier if Revis were a part of it! Although the cost right now might be a bit steep, I think it would allow the team would go blitz happy more often. Revis can pretty much take away one side of the field, something that would be very nice. Nnamdi doesn’t even get thrown at often, so I don’t think he’s over paid. Revis should be making the same amount.
When I said I was happy with the secondary, I meant the choices the team made during cuts. Do I think it’s the team’s weakness on D? Yes I do, but I think the guys the 49ers have can and will perform admirably. That doesn’t mean the team shouldn’t look into adding Revis though, I hear that!
You can actually move around to make this work
Or at least I think you can. I’m going to see if this is a possibilty.
"Along with Spikes (and his neck)"
Hah! TKO doesn’t even have a neck, so that’s classic. If you want to figure out whether a dude has potential as a LB, a lack of a neck (TKO, Urlacher, Merriman) is usually a good indicator.
As to Revis: I’ve mentioned several times that I would love to have him, although I acknowledge that it’s unrealistic. I think Smileyman is correct in the essentials about the rise in the value of the position over coming seasons though.
You, author, are also correct that having someone who excels in man coverage can make a lot of blitz packages possible.
So, even if we don’t draft someone in free agency, I think the last piece our defense needs to draft at a premium next year is an elite cover corner. You get that, it instantly makes our pass rush better too…that extra half second your coverage holds is all a blitzer should need.
"Football combines the two worst things about America: It is violence punctuated by committee meetings" -George Will
I would give up my draft picks to get this guy
With him on the team you can expect an extra 10-15 sacks
if it were possible
then i would support it 100%.
getting burned deep is our achilles heel. safeties are important, but these days it seems that a shut-down corner all over the opposing number 1 receiver is the most effective strategy.
plus it’s an uncapped year isn’t it? the return is worth that money, since it could radically improve our chances especially in the playoffs.
too bad it’s just not realistic.
"Winners, I am convinced, imagine their dreams first. They want it with all their heart and expect it to come true. There is, I believe, no other way to live."
- Joe Montana
If you do not resign Goldson
and you cut Clements you actually would have more then enough money to sign Revis. Also you would have to add to the fact that if you want Revis you would have to give up a first rounder. Which would basically give us even more money to sign Revis.
The Jets will not just give up Revis they would want something for him.
So Clements and a 1st would be ample consolidation. I didn’t work the numbers yet, due to homework and the such, but it seems like a plan that could work.
I think the Jets would have to settle for just draft compensation. New York isn’t going to want to add a salary like Clements’, otherwise they’d pay Revis (at least I think). The only problem with the 49ers bringing in a guy like Revis, is that it would likely upset Spencer (I think he’s looking for new money). Unfortunately, that’s the only CB that has any trade value on the 49ers, and the contract of Clements and Revis would be far too pricey to have on one team.
by Andrew Davidson on Sep 5, 2010 12:19 PM PDT up reply actions
Spencer = only CB with trade value on the 49ers (in my opinion, he’s got a reasonable contract and he’s good).
by Andrew Davidson on Sep 5, 2010 12:20 PM PDT up reply actions
Very true
and that sucks because I would feel more confident with Spencer and Revis because of the contracts. Maybe they could get Clements to restructure. Or trade him too. Hmm, choices…
by ZeroOneInfinity on Sep 5, 2010 1:51 PM PDT up reply actions
I didn't state that properly
which first rounder next year are you gonna give up to get Revis? I agree with you that launching Clements’ salary would have to be done. But doing wha you speak of we are talking about losing a first rounder next year. That just seems like a heavy weight to bear.
by ChesapeakeBay9er on Sep 5, 2010 12:26 PM PDT up reply actions
Hmm 2011 1st rounder..ponders
what about a 2011 2nd and 3rd? :-)
by ChesapeakeBay9er on Sep 5, 2010 1:38 PM PDT up reply actions
The math on that works...
And I would easily swap Clements and a first rounder for Revis Island. He’s almost certainly better than the guy we would draft to be our new shutdown corner.
I still want an established dominant pass rusher on our defense, but add in Revis, and even average pass rushers can probably get there.
With him, we’re automatically top-3.
Dammit!
"Football combines the two worst things about America: It is violence punctuated by committee meetings" -George Will
by lottwasgangsta on Sep 5, 2010 12:20 PM PDT up reply actions
Agreed, however...
if we had better corners, we’d have a more constant pass-rush.
"Football combines the two worst things about America: It is violence punctuated by committee meetings" -George Will
by lottwasgangsta on Sep 5, 2010 12:21 PM PDT up reply actions
This
is a key question and not easy to answer, but I think that with:
Lawson (9)
J. Smith (7)
Brooks (7)
Haralson (5)
MacDonald (3)
RJF (1)
LaBoy (5)
we already have the horses we need regarding pass rush.
Oh, and I forgot the inside blitzes:
Willis (5)
Spikes (3).
(The number in parentheses is a guess for total sacks this year, if healthy. Lawson is a bit high because it is a contract year for him and i think he will step up.)
While Manusky schemes do not include any one prolific “sacker”, the non-ego approach where everyone brings pressure or ties people up is effective and I think that as a team we could expect to be in the top 5 in sacks this year.
You forgot 4 or 5 for Mays...
Nice write up, and I agree with you on Manusky’s scheme, but also, I think having one dude who just gets there a bit frequently would also be pretty great.
If w can notch 50, I don’t care how it’s distributed, I’ll just be happy.
"Football combines the two worst things about America: It is violence punctuated by committee meetings" -George Will
by lottwasgangsta on Sep 5, 2010 6:05 PM PDT up reply actions
Not gonna happen
Revis and Jets reached a deal. He’s flying to NY and will sign the deal tomorrow.
Logic merely enables one to be wrong with authority
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