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Corner Or Pass Rush? The 49ers Greatest Need!

SAN FRANCISCO - OCTOBER 17:  Nnamdi Asomugha  #21 of the Oakland Raiders breaks up a pass intended for Michael Crabtree #15 of the San Francisco 49ers at Candlestick Park on October 17 2010 in San Francisco California.  (Photo by Ezra Shaw/Getty Images)

 

The 49ers defense allowed a 90.5 rating for opposing QBs in 2010 and had a total of 36 sacks, down from the 44 they had in 2009. However, pure statistics do not tell the entire story. A lack of pass rush can lead to blown coverage in the secondary. If you give any QB a multitude of time to throw the ball, he is going to shred up the defense. Accordingly, a lack of decent coverage can counteract a solid pass rush.

So what is the 49ers weakest area on defense? We can pretty much assume that the ILB core with Patrick Willis and Takeo Spikes is solid. As is 2/3 of the defensive line with Aubrayo Franklin and Justin Smith.

After the jump I will focus on the players the 49ers have at each of these concern positions, who could be available in free agency and the draft, and how these specific situations during the off-season may dictate where the 49ers go.....

Star-divide

As much as some may question the experience and/or ability of 49er safeties, one thing is for sure; this position cannot be considered a primary are of need for San Francisco. Taylor Mays, Reggie Smith and even Dashon Goldson have major upside. They all have the athletic ability to be standout safeties in the NFL. Additionally, I would have to suspect that at least one of them will have  a break out 2011 season. Accordingly, Curtis Taylor and CJ Spillman remain in the mix. If I was Trent Baalke, and running the 49er front office, the earliest I would look at a safety in the draft would be the 6th round.

The cornerback position is a completely different situation. Nate Clements has been pretty darn good over the last couple of seasons. He has received a lot of criticism because of his contract numbers, but that aside he has been pretty good. Clements will never be a shutdown corner in the NFL, those days ended when he left the Bills for San Francisco. That said, he still has the ability to contribute for an NFL team moving forward. However, I doubt that he would be willing to take  a pay cut, and I am not sure  if the 49ers even want him to remain on the team in 2011. At some point it just becomes evident that you need to turn the page, and that may be the case with Nate Clements. Spencer was great in 2009, but took a huge step back last season. At this point I am not sure that Spencer is anything more than a nickel back in the NFL, but I wouldn't mind having him play that position for the 49ers next season. I really don't want to see Spencer in one of the two starting corner positions next season. Tarell Brown has the talent and ability to succeed in the NFL, he has just not been able to put it together as of yet. Brown is still relatively young, but if the last two seasons are signs, he really may be nothing better than a 4th corner, if that. I would really like to see Brown take that next step, I just don't see it happening. Phillip Adams looked pretty darn good in his limited action last season, well before his injury. That injury may affect how much he contributes next season, but I see him as a nice 3rd corner in the NFL. At this point the 49ers are left with a bunch of #3 and #4 corners, and Nate Clements, who is a tweener #1 and #2. They do need to upgrade this position

You cannot look at a pass rushers effectiveness  with pure sacks alone, there are a lot of different variables that come into it. One reputable site had Ray McDonald and Justin Smith as 1-2 on QB pressures for 3-4 defensive ends. Although QB pressures are an extremely subjective state, it does mean that they are solid contributors. At this point, not a single person should question Justin Smith and his ability. In my opinion he is one of the best 3-4 defensive ends in the NFL, and I see no sign of him slowing down. Ray McDonald is a little more of a wildcard at this point, but I think his upside is great. Other than that we don't have much in terms of depth or talent at the DE positions. Demetric Evans will never be more than a solid back up player and ICE isn't a threat to get to the QB at all. In fact, I believe the 49ers should gauge the market for ICE this off-season. If we can pick up a mid-late round pick for him I would consider it a steal.

On the surface the 49ers have a great amount of talent at the OLB position, but this talent has not correlated with contribution. Parys Haralson regressed a great deal after leading the team in sacks the prior year, Ahmad Brooks has been pretty darn good but I am looking for him to take that next step; something that may never happen. There is no question that Manny Lawson is one heck of a football player, he is. Lawson isn't a situational pass rusher, and he never will be. Instead, Lawson can contribute in all aspects of the defense for the 49ers. However, it is important that the 49ers get a dominating pass rusher opposite Lawson, otherwise, his talent are going to be wasted in their 3-4 system. Travis LaBoy was awesome, he was that situational pass rusher we were looking for. That said, the injury bug hit him once again and I don't think he can be relied on.

Draft Options

 

Corner Backs

1st Round: Patrick Peterson, Prince Amukamara, Jimmy Smith, Brandon Harris, Aaron Willams

2nd Round: Brandon Burton, Curtis Brown,

3rd Round: Rashad Carmichael, Kendric Burney, Chris Culliver, Richard Sherman, Johnny Patrick,

Defensive End

1st Round:  Ryan Kerrigan, Cameron Jordan, Adrian Clayborn, J.J. Watt, Cameron Heyward

2nd Round:  Drake Nevis, Allen Bailey

3rd Round:  None

Outside Linebackers

1st Round:  Von Miller, Aldon Smith, Robert Quinn, Akeem Ayers, Justin Houston

2nd Round: Jabaal Sheard, Dontay Moch, Sam Acho, Jeremy Beal,

3rd Round: K.J Wright, Lawrence Wilson, Bruce Carter

This is a little bit tricky. There is a nice drop-off from Patrick Peterson and Prince Amukamara to Jimmy Smith etc. in the CB position. However, it appears to be much deeper than the DE or OLB positions in the 2011 draft. 3-4 Defensive Ends are not the cream of the 2011 NFL Draft crop. After Cameron Heyward I really don't see anyone that will contribute a great deal moving forward. Drake Nevis and Allen Bailey will be major reaches in the 2nd round, and there are no 3-4 DE options in the 3rd round. The best pass rushing situation for San Francisco in the draft is via the OLB position. If the 49ers are unable to get Von Miller or Robert Quiin, I see I nice amount of options in the 2nd round with the likes of Sheard, Moch and Beal.

Free Agent Options

 

Cornerback: Nnamdi Asomugha, Brent Grimes, Carlos Rogers, Jonathan Joseph, Antonio Cromartie, Ike Taylor, Richard Marshall, Fabian Washington and Eric Wright

 

Defensive End: Cullen Jenkins, Shaun Ellis, Marcus Spears, Shaun Smith and Greg White

Outside Linebackers: Tamba Hali

Not a lot here beyond the CB position. One could argue that the OLB and DE position in the 2011 free agent class are the weakest in the pool. This could change the 49ers perception of what to do. However, the CB position is absolutely stunning in this class. By my count there are six viable #1 CB options in the free agent class. Hopefully the 49ers are able to lock up one of them.

Conclusion

This is why the likes of Trent Baalke get paid six figures, it must be a high stress situation. It has been noted that if Patrick Peterson or Prince Amukamara fall to the 49ers at 7, they have to jump on that. However, you have to look at different factors such as the strength of the free agent CB class, and weakness of pass rushers there. My conclusion is that the 49ers pass rush isn't nearly as bad as their coverage. San Francisco could actually get away with having Smith, McDonald, Haralson and Brooks returning at the primary four pass rushes. Accordingly, they CANNOT get away with Clements, Spencer and Brown as their top 3 corners. Depending on the CBA situation, and whether or not it is agreed to before April, the 49ers may have to pick their poison. By this I mean, going for the immediate upgrade in Peterson or Amukamara rather than picking up an additional 2nd and getting Jordan in the mid- 1st round. Circumstances aside, the 49ers need to draft Peterson is he is available at #7, no matter the CBA situation. I can pretty much assume that most of you agree with that. I think drafting Peterson in the 1st, Dontay Moch in the 2nd and signing Asomugha, Rogers, Joseph, Cromartie or Wright in free agency would be the perfect scenario. In my humble opinion CB is the larger need!!!

Poll
What is the 49ers largest off-season need?
Pass Rusher
250 votes
Corner
670 votes
Safety
8 votes
Other (Explain)
38 votes

966 votes | Poll has closed

Comment 152 comments  |  0 recs  | 

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You forgot Brooks Reed

Kellen Moore is awesome
Katie Mcgrath is our savior
my dog <3

by manraj7 on Mar 4, 2011 9:14 PM PST reply actions  

I was going by

NFL Draft Site and NFL Draft Tek. I used their mocks to gauge where players are going. I have to keep some continuity, and i trust those two sites.

Mila "Sweet Lips" Kunis, as stated by Scarlett Johansson. I couldn't agree more. Reverse would be true too!!!!

by nocal81(Vincent) on Mar 4, 2011 9:16 PM PST up reply actions  

Reed is better than most of those players.

Would be stupid passing up on Reed in the 2nd

Kellen Moore is awesome
Katie Mcgrath is our savior
my dog <3

by manraj7 on Mar 4, 2011 9:21 PM PST up reply actions  

I completely disagree

I just don’t see him having the impact in the pass rush situations. Obviously that is left up for interpretation, nothing more.

Mila "Sweet Lips" Kunis, as stated by Scarlett Johansson. I couldn't agree more. Reverse would be true too!!!!

by nocal81(Vincent) on Mar 4, 2011 9:23 PM PST up reply actions  

he gets to the QB more often than not

Kellen Moore is awesome
Katie Mcgrath is our savior
my dog <3

by manraj7 on Mar 4, 2011 9:35 PM PST up reply actions  

nfl draft site has him ranked the first player in the second at the olb position

http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/players.php?genpos=OLB&draftyear=2011&sortorder=tsxpos&order=ASC

nfl draftek has him drafted in the second round at #38

http://www.drafttek.com/CMDRound2_33-48.asp

"You know whats funny? I always thought uhm dogs lay eggs and I learned something new today" Peter Griffin

by HUNGRY HUNTER on Mar 4, 2011 10:02 PM PST up reply actions  

Errror

This was meant to be posted tomorrow around noon, i jumped the gun. As it is, i believe i did an awesome breakdown of the situation.

Mila "Sweet Lips" Kunis, as stated by Scarlett Johansson. I couldn't agree more. Reverse would be true too!!!!

by nocal81(Vincent) on Mar 4, 2011 9:16 PM PST reply actions  

my ideal scenario

1.- Von Miller and Rahim Moore/Curtis Brown… i think both are needs but lets see what happens.

by Xan101 on Mar 4, 2011 9:20 PM PST reply actions  

Moore in the 2nd round?

Isn’t that too soon for a safety? Also my sources from within UCLA believe that Moore isn’t going to be a great NFL player, and should be taken in the mid-rounds.

Mila "Sweet Lips" Kunis, as stated by Scarlett Johansson. I couldn't agree more. Reverse would be true too!!!!

by nocal81(Vincent) on Mar 4, 2011 9:21 PM PST reply actions  

i'd take him if he's still around

With the exception of Eric Berry he is the best ballhawk to come out in a few years. He had ten picks his sophomore year and having watched most of his games this year he didn’t have many because teams just threw away from him. He also played up closer to the line a little more this year. He ran faster than i expected at the combine and he turns well, so i would trust him against most slots. According to nfldraftscout "No player in the Football Bowl Subdivision had made 10 interceptions in a season since 2003 " until moore. You don’t get 10 picks by accident in the pac-10. He has good hands and is a very intelligent player. Apparently has high character (and from people i know who know him personally this is definitely the case) and was a team captain this year, something i think is underrated as it means both coaches and fellow players respect him. Biggest knock is his size, but i think he can put on a little more muscle and i don’t think that is too much of a concern. We had Merton hanks for years and he was skinnier than moore is.

by smiliege on Mar 4, 2011 11:11 PM PST up reply actions  

Corner!

Hope we can get Peterson, then everything else will be a lot easier.

by wellnesscoach on Mar 4, 2011 9:22 PM PST reply actions  

If Asomugha

do you still take Prince? Assuming Peterson is gone.

by oldfoggy on Mar 4, 2011 9:25 PM PST reply actions  

I do

We really need to upgrade the corner positions. If Asomugha and Amukamara are our two starting safeties with Spencer at the nicke, i would be stoked!! Better yet, Peterson and Asomugha :) that makes me drool!!!

Mila "Sweet Lips" Kunis, as stated by Scarlett Johansson. I couldn't agree more. Reverse would be true too!!!!

by nocal81(Vincent) on Mar 4, 2011 9:27 PM PST up reply actions  

Corners Error!!!

Mila "Sweet Lips" Kunis, as stated by Scarlett Johansson. I couldn't agree more. Reverse would be true too!!!!

by nocal81(Vincent) on Mar 4, 2011 9:28 PM PST up reply actions  

JJ>Asomugha

Kellen Moore is awesome
Katie Mcgrath is our savior
my dog <3

by manraj7 on Mar 4, 2011 9:41 PM PST up reply actions  

Really Bro? Why

Mila "Sweet Lips" Kunis, as stated by Scarlett Johansson. I couldn't agree more. Reverse would be true too!!!!

by nocal81(Vincent) on Mar 4, 2011 9:42 PM PST up reply actions  

I gave it

Kellen Moore is awesome
Katie Mcgrath is our savior
my dog <3

by manraj7 on Mar 4, 2011 9:49 PM PST up reply actions  

JJ is younger and probably won't cost as much as Asomugha

hence better

Kellen Moore is awesome
Katie Mcgrath is our savior
my dog <3

by manraj7 on Mar 4, 2011 9:42 PM PST up reply actions  

You are looking at

11MM per for JJ over 6 seasons, and 15MM per for Asomugha for 5 seasons. Not much of a difference if you ask me

Mila "Sweet Lips" Kunis, as stated by Scarlett Johansson. I couldn't agree more. Reverse would be true too!!!!

by nocal81(Vincent) on Mar 4, 2011 9:43 PM PST up reply actions  

4m per season is a lot

It may be similar over the long run but 4mil per season is pretty big. 4 mil could give us the ability to sign other players. How much do you expect Lawson to cost? Four to Five mil is my expectation considering his stat line and what other people of his caliber got. So you would get JJ for an extra year and Lawson instead of Asomugha.

Kellen Moore is awesome
Katie Mcgrath is our savior
my dog <3

by manraj7 on Mar 4, 2011 9:49 PM PST up reply actions  

The question

Is Asomugha worth 4MM per season more than JJ? I would say yes, espcially considering the terms would most likely be for 1 less year

Mila "Sweet Lips" Kunis, as stated by Scarlett Johansson. I couldn't agree more. Reverse would be true too!!!!

by nocal81(Vincent) on Mar 4, 2011 9:54 PM PST up reply actions  

when Asomugha gets old will it be worth it?

Kellen Moore is awesome
Katie Mcgrath is our savior
my dog <3

by manraj7 on Mar 4, 2011 9:59 PM PST up reply actions  

One year less than JJ

Mila "Sweet Lips" Kunis, as stated by Scarlett Johansson. I couldn't agree more. Reverse would be true too!!!!

by nocal81(Vincent) on Mar 4, 2011 10:03 PM PST up reply actions  

will still be late thirties

Kellen Moore is awesome
Katie Mcgrath is our savior
my dog <3

by manraj7 on Mar 4, 2011 10:06 PM PST up reply actions  

Actually 35

Joseph would be 34

Mila "Sweet Lips" Kunis, as stated by Scarlett Johansson. I couldn't agree more. Reverse would be true too!!!!

by nocal81(Vincent) on Mar 4, 2011 10:30 PM PST up reply actions  

34 after 6 years or after 5?

Kellen Moore is awesome
Katie Mcgrath is our savior
my dog <3

by manraj7 on Mar 4, 2011 10:35 PM PST up reply actions  

Where did you get 34

He is 27 next month. 6+27 = 33 and Asomugha is 31 right now 31+5 = 36.

Kellen Moore is awesome
Katie Mcgrath is our savior
my dog <3

by manraj7 on Mar 4, 2011 10:51 PM PST up reply actions  

my bad 35

2011-1981 = 30

Kellen Moore is awesome
Katie Mcgrath is our savior
my dog <3

by manraj7 on Mar 4, 2011 10:51 PM PST up reply actions  

woodson is 34

"You know whats funny? I always thought uhm dogs lay eggs and I learned something new today" Peter Griffin

by HUNGRY HUNTER on Mar 4, 2011 10:54 PM PST up reply actions  

Does Fooch PFF press access allow him to see all players?

Kellen Moore is awesome
Katie Mcgrath is our savior
my dog <3

by manraj7 on Mar 4, 2011 10:18 PM PST up reply actions  

It does

Mila "Sweet Lips" Kunis, as stated by Scarlett Johansson. I couldn't agree more. Reverse would be true too!!!!

by nocal81(Vincent) on Mar 4, 2011 10:29 PM PST up reply actions  

ask him to compare the two

Kellen Moore is awesome
Katie Mcgrath is our savior
my dog <3

by manraj7 on Mar 4, 2011 10:32 PM PST up reply actions  

Hopefully

we can take care of that!!! It would be a nice comparison

Mila "Sweet Lips" Kunis, as stated by Scarlett Johansson. I couldn't agree more. Reverse would be true too!!!!

by nocal81(Vincent) on Mar 4, 2011 10:33 PM PST up reply actions  

I know good fooch keeps close detail on every post on NN.

Good fooch usually pulls through

Kellen Moore is awesome
Katie Mcgrath is our savior
my dog <3

by manraj7 on Mar 4, 2011 10:37 PM PST up reply actions  

LOL i am a writer for NN, i can be good too

Just messing Manraj, you are one of my favorite posters on this site bro

Mila "Sweet Lips" Kunis, as stated by Scarlett Johansson. I couldn't agree more. Reverse would be true too!!!!

by nocal81(Vincent) on Mar 4, 2011 10:39 PM PST up reply actions  

:D thank you, thank you I'm here all the time.

Well I only call him good Fooch because there is an evil fooch lurking.

Kellen Moore is awesome
Katie Mcgrath is our savior
my dog <3

by manraj7 on Mar 4, 2011 10:43 PM PST up reply actions  

Was just busting your nut bro

Straight smooches all the way around!!!

Mila "Sweet Lips" Kunis, as stated by Scarlett Johansson. I couldn't agree more. Reverse would be true too!!!!

by nocal81(Vincent) on Mar 4, 2011 10:45 PM PST up reply actions  

He is evil too

i see that all the time!!!

Mila "Sweet Lips" Kunis, as stated by Scarlett Johansson. I couldn't agree more. Reverse would be true too!!!!

by nocal81(Vincent) on Mar 4, 2011 10:45 PM PST up reply actions  

what good fooch is never evil

Kellen Moore is awesome
Katie Mcgrath is our savior
my dog <3

by manraj7 on Mar 4, 2011 10:47 PM PST up reply actions  

He makes all of this run

David is actually the glue that keeps all of us odd-balls together. I appreciate this devotion he has, as you should.

I am just better than him HA HA HA!!

Mila "Sweet Lips" Kunis, as stated by Scarlett Johansson. I couldn't agree more. Reverse would be true too!!!!

by nocal81(Vincent) on Mar 4, 2011 10:49 PM PST up reply actions  

I love good fooch

Kellen Moore is awesome
Katie Mcgrath is our savior
my dog <3

by manraj7 on Mar 4, 2011 10:56 PM PST up reply actions  

As do i

just put a “C” before the “F” and i am golden

Mila "Sweet Lips" Kunis, as stated by Scarlett Johansson. I couldn't agree more. Reverse would be true too!!!!

by nocal81(Vincent) on Mar 4, 2011 11:03 PM PST up reply actions  

cfooch?

Kellen Moore is awesome
Katie Mcgrath is our savior
my dog <3

by manraj7 on Mar 4, 2011 11:19 PM PST up reply actions  

Delete the F and replace the C

We don’t have free pass here!! Site Dec BS is still on

Mila "Sweet Lips" Kunis, as stated by Scarlett Johansson. I couldn't agree more. Reverse would be true too!!!!

by nocal81(Vincent) on Mar 5, 2011 12:38 AM PST up reply actions  

jj tendered

I know under new cba might noy mean anything but under current cba Cinci gets out first and third rounders of I’m not mistaken.

by wtlichens on Mar 4, 2011 10:44 PM PST via mobile up reply actions  

oh

shucks. Hopefully that disappears.

Kellen Moore is awesome
Katie Mcgrath is our savior
my dog <3

by manraj7 on Mar 4, 2011 10:47 PM PST up reply actions  

5 years since drafted, he should be ufa

"You know whats funny? I always thought uhm dogs lay eggs and I learned something new today" Peter Griffin

by HUNGRY HUNTER on Mar 4, 2011 10:52 PM PST up reply actions  

who is JJ?

"You know whats funny? I always thought uhm dogs lay eggs and I learned something new today" Peter Griffin

by HUNGRY HUNTER on Mar 4, 2011 10:36 PM PST up reply actions  

who is JJ?

QUESTION: When is our QB going to answer questions like "You only threw 4 TD's today. What's wrong with the offense?"
ANSWER: When Andrew Luck ditches the draft and we sign him as an undrafted free agent!!!

by crumpedup15 on Mar 5, 2011 10:57 AM PST up reply actions  

Other

Has to be scheme. I didn’t see Lawson and Willis side by side in the Nickel, nor was Smith used at DE in the same set. The lack of creativity reared its ugly head,Willis barely blitzed and managed a couple of sacks, why not more pressure from him? Manny off the field on 3rd down is lunacy.

It’s hard to assess our defensive unit considering our cover 2 nature and predictability. Of rather add a corner than an olb, easy.

RLOTT#42

by rlott#42 on Mar 4, 2011 9:28 PM PST reply actions  

I say pass rusher

The 49ers have a guy who can be considered a #1 corner, the rest of cast was awful. At OLB they have the rest of the cast but no #1 go to guy.

No I don’t buy the scheming logic for a second. Can only scheme so long before the league catches to the scheme (usually 1 regular season). Ya ya the Steelers lost to the Packers … secondary. But Jets lost to the Steelers … pass rush.

The bottom line is to have a good pass defense a team needs both a pass rush and secondary, talent trumps scheme every time … see the Packers (hint: have both). The goal should be to find both a pass rusher, starting corner and hopefully sign a nickel corner back. Dropping all eggs into one won’t get it done. No, Nnamdi ain’t signing the with the 49ers. Hate to point it out the Raiders are currently better than the 49ers. The top free agent in the league isn’t going to make a move backwards.

by bignerd on Mar 4, 2011 9:33 PM PST reply actions  

How could it be olb, when we need two starting cb's?

Clements is a great Nickel cb, and he’s our best cb. Our front 7 didn’t perform worse than the back 4 in comparisons around the league, and I don’t need to look it up.

RLOTT#42

by rlott#42 on Mar 4, 2011 9:48 PM PST up reply actions  

Manny isn't coming back

The 49ers aren’t switching to the 4-3 defense. Nate Clements is not a nickel CB either.

by bignerd on Mar 4, 2011 10:03 PM PST up reply actions  

Again i agree

I believe that Manny fits into the 4-3 better than the 3-4. I think that it would do him a service to switch to a team that runs a 4-3, however, he could work fine in a 3-4 if he get a Von Miller or Tamba Hali opposite him. Also, Nate Clements is done in San Francisco; i was just not ready to attack him as much as others are

Mila "Sweet Lips" Kunis, as stated by Scarlett Johansson. I couldn't agree more. Reverse would be true too!!!!

by nocal81(Vincent) on Mar 4, 2011 10:05 PM PST up reply actions  

If Nate Clements was done in SF I think the 49ers would have cut him and his contract prior to the CBA expiring.

Manny would be an excellent #2 OLB but he’ll probably command more 4-3 defense money in free agency. I hope not but it’s likely.

by bignerd on Mar 4, 2011 10:10 PM PST up reply actions  

Those are not the rules

They can cut him up until the 2nd of April, and not have to worry about the cap implications (if there are any). The CBA expiring doesn’t affect his contract because it was signed 4 years ago or more. I could be wrong, but that is what i am reading into it; especially from those i have received emails.

Mila "Sweet Lips" Kunis, as stated by Scarlett Johansson. I couldn't agree more. Reverse would be true too!!!!

by nocal81(Vincent) on Mar 4, 2011 10:13 PM PST up reply actions  

They can cut him the day before the regular season starts and be fine

No hurry to cut Clements. Let’s see what kind of shape he shows up in, and who we are able to get via the draft and free agency first.

by hudd07 on Mar 5, 2011 9:55 AM PST up reply actions  

That’s why I specified nickel defense, I know what we run. When Clements lined up at the nickel fb spot he was more productive. The infamous pick n fumble was him playing nickel fb. As poor as our defensive scheme was, you can’t ignore scheming being a huge part of the defense. Mannys not coming back? You gonna sign him McBOOFOO?

RLOTT#42

by rlott#42 on Mar 4, 2011 11:49 PM PST up reply actions  

I say pass rush

but id take BPA as corner is seriously lacking and will aid the pass rush. Peterson destroyed at the combine, so most likely Peterson > Von Miller > Prince.

Honorary parent of Duane Kuiper, beloved solar powered broadcaster and power hitting coach for the Giants.

by Giant Voodoo on Mar 4, 2011 9:38 PM PST reply actions  

I would say cornerback

When we do get pressure, the qb still throws up “prayers” that are routinely answered because either Clements has bit on a pump fake or Spenser got burned past.

by wtlichens on Mar 4, 2011 9:47 PM PST via mobile reply actions  

Bro why is QB not on your list? You’re a David Carr fan??

by PartyStarter on Mar 4, 2011 9:48 PM PST reply actions  

Really Good Question

I don’t have a way to answer that in a clear form. That said, i would have to say that re-signing Alex Smith or trading for a Kyle Orton/Carson Palmer etc… wouldn’t take as much of a commitment. Therefore, it isn’t in the realm of this conversation. Get what i am saying?

Mila "Sweet Lips" Kunis, as stated by Scarlett Johansson. I couldn't agree more. Reverse would be true too!!!!

by nocal81(Vincent) on Mar 4, 2011 9:51 PM PST up reply actions  

nate davis was released

i wonder why…..

" oh crap its Jim "- Pete Carroll

by DontForget on Mar 4, 2011 11:28 PM PST up reply actions  

Orton's not going anywhere

They aren’t going to trade their starting QB to replace him with a guy that Elway thinks is RAW.

by hudd07 on Mar 5, 2011 9:56 AM PST up reply actions  

Corner for sure

Peterson or Prince A. will be fine with me..matter of fact I think we should get another CB too add on in the later rounds..Culliver from SC maybe a good look also

Beat Em To The Punch - Bill Walsh

by Desi on Mar 4, 2011 9:58 PM PST reply actions  

Every year
One could argue that the OLB and DE position in the 2011 free agent class are the weakest in the pool.
By my count there are six viable #1 CB options in the free agent class.

Why I say teams draft pass rushers and can always sign a CB.

by bignerd on Mar 4, 2011 10:00 PM PST reply actions  

Completely Agree

I am not sure if that point really came across strong on my post. If not, i am sorry

Mila "Sweet Lips" Kunis, as stated by Scarlett Johansson. I couldn't agree more. Reverse would be true too!!!!

by nocal81(Vincent) on Mar 4, 2011 10:03 PM PST up reply actions  

I've been saying it for months

Based on the poll the message isn’t getting through.

Another point I’ve been trying to make is a team can find #1 CB with the 20th thru 32nd draft pick in almost any draft. To find a #1 pass rusher usually takes a Top 15 pick and some years the pool isn’t even that deep. And as pointed out above free agency is always a great place to find CB. Only available pass rushers are usually working on there 3rd contract before retirement.

by bignerd on Mar 4, 2011 10:08 PM PST up reply actions  

unless you draft clay matthews at #26

peterson and nnamdi with clements and reggie smith at safety sounds really nice.

who are the best olb in free agency?

but I do think olb will have the most impact on the team.

quinn looks good.

"You know whats funny? I always thought uhm dogs lay eggs and I learned something new today" Peter Griffin

by HUNGRY HUNTER on Mar 4, 2011 10:13 PM PST up reply actions  

Dumervil, Harrison, Woodley, and there are plenty others, not taken round 1. And there are plenty more.

RLOTT#42

by rlott#42 on Mar 4, 2011 11:52 PM PST up reply actions  

Plenty plenty more

The best pass rushers don’t come out of the first round as often as not.

John Randle was undrafted and Jared Allen was taken in the 4th.

Gimme 1 round!

by ItBurnzWhenIP on Mar 5, 2011 10:57 AM PST up reply actions  

You can't count Steelers

they are a factory of LBs. Instead of being called Steelers they should be called LB R’Us

Kellen Moore is awesome
Katie Mcgrath is our savior
my dog <3

by manraj7 on Mar 5, 2011 11:28 AM PST up reply actions  

High pick pass rushers

Are usually all defensive ends.

In the past 10 years, only 1 pass rushing OLB has been taken in the top 10.

The problem is we don’t have the 20th through 32nd pick in the draft, we have the #7 pick in the draft.

A #1 CB won’t be available when we pick at #45.

by Ougadas on Mar 5, 2011 12:15 AM PST up reply actions  

That's because only 4-5 teams ran a 3-4 five years ago

10 years ago only 2 teams ran the defense. In the last two years the NFL has gone from 6 teams running the 3-4 to 15 teams in 2011. I don’t trust any of those draft trends you cite going forward.

I should also point out the 49ers haven’t proven they can develop a later round OLB yet either. I’d rather not draft an OLB so high but it may have to work out that way.

by bignerd on Mar 5, 2011 1:13 AM PST up reply actions  

It’s a new staff, so wed have to throw what has happened previously, right?

RLOTT#42

by rlott#42 on Mar 5, 2011 8:31 AM PST up reply actions  

I thought the 2 best DE prospects weren't mentioned

maybe because they are listed as DT’s? I think Marcell Dareus and Marvin Austin are the two best DE’s for a 3-4 scheme.

by Derek R. on Mar 5, 2011 7:59 PM PST up reply actions  

Jordan is better

IMO

Kellen Moore is awesome
Katie Mcgrath is our savior
my dog <3

by manraj7 on Mar 5, 2011 8:40 PM PST up reply actions  

and if I'm an opposing qb I'm using double moves

All day long against Clements. He bites every time. The only reason teams don’t is because he is actually still better than spenser.

by wtlichens on Mar 4, 2011 10:08 PM PST via mobile reply actions  

Again all the fans saying corner are ignorant!

It doesn’t matter how great of a corner the 49ers get in the first round if they cannot improve the pass rush teams are going to gauge the defense still. Could have Darelle Revis and Asomugha the 49ers still would have been burnt last year!

In order for the cornerbacks to be successful the 49ers need to have a pass rush, therefore to improve the team the pass rush is the biggest need.

by Rocky63215 on Mar 4, 2011 11:30 PM PST reply actions  

Good question

The problem is if a quarterback has all day to throw it can go to the dumpoff, so it means the corner actually comes up for a tackle, it also means that a corner is left out on an island and if a receiver makes a move and gets free of the corner they’re going to make a catch whether it’s coming back to the quarterback or along the sideline.

by Rocky63215 on Mar 4, 2011 11:33 PM PST up reply actions  

check out the pass Ds.

http://footballoutsiders.com/stats/teamdef

not the TE and RB killing us.

Kellen Moore is awesome
Katie Mcgrath is our savior
my dog <3

by manraj7 on Mar 4, 2011 11:41 PM PST up reply actions  

true

and they talk about our DL as if it gets complety shut out every game.

" oh crap its Jim "- Pete Carroll

by DontForget on Mar 4, 2011 11:34 PM PST up reply actions  

Not even close to having a good pass rush

It’s not the corners that are giving up that high of a completion percentage, the reason why passes are completed so high is because there was no pressure on the quarterback.

by Rocky63215 on Mar 4, 2011 11:44 PM PST up reply actions  

The guys whose primary responsibility not to rush the QB are the 49ers best pass rushers

Justin Smith was the 49ers best and I think Patrick Willis was 2nd in sacks.

The OLB position is suppose to the be the primary position to get pressure but none of the guys had more than 5 sacks. I’ve seen some stats citing pressures but I think they are misleading. Technically the OLBs did cause the QB to move from the pocket but more often than not easily escaped and threw down field. Kevin Kolb was running away from these guys and making plays down field.

by bignerd on Mar 5, 2011 1:17 AM PST up reply actions  

They are supposed to be the primary position

But they weren’t.

You’re missing the rate stats. Our guys are getting to the QB when they rush, we just weren’t rushing. Aggregates are worthless when you don’t consider attempts.

by Ougadas on Mar 5, 2011 1:30 AM PST up reply actions  

I've interpreted the rate stats a different way

The coaching staff was using them to their best ability. I wouldn’t be so worried if the best two rate guys weren’t the potential free agents.

Haralson wasn’t good in coverage or against the run. He gets pressure but a lot of QBs tend to easily run away from him when he does.

Brooks, I’m ready to let that ship sail. I think he lead the league in defensive offside penalties which is impressive considering he played a part time role.

by bignerd on Mar 5, 2011 1:36 AM PST up reply actions  

So

Having a guy that is in the top of the league at getting to the QB when you do rush him and then deciding to rarely send him is using him to the best of his ability?

That doesn’t follow.

by Ougadas on Mar 5, 2011 2:11 AM PST up reply actions  

DL and OLB in a 3-4

They do a fine job. But when a CB gives up 70+% completion rate not much a pass rush can do.

Kellen Moore is awesome
Katie Mcgrath is our savior
my dog <3

by manraj7 on Mar 4, 2011 11:39 PM PST up reply actions  

The agreement i have with you couldn't be less than 100 percent

Pass rush doesn’t matter if the QB can find a receiver on the 1st read

Mila "Sweet Lips" Kunis, as stated by Scarlett Johansson. I couldn't agree more. Reverse would be true too!!!!

by nocal81(Vincent) on Mar 4, 2011 11:42 PM PST up reply actions  

I get extracredit?

WOOOHOO.

In case anyone is wondering where I get my info.
http://footballoutsiders.com/stats/teamdef
and
http://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2011/01/14/fantasy-idp-nfc-west-cornerback-breakdown/

Kellen Moore is awesome
Katie Mcgrath is our savior
my dog <3

by manraj7 on Mar 4, 2011 11:52 PM PST up reply actions  

I don't give over an A

Mila "Sweet Lips" Kunis, as stated by Scarlett Johansson. I couldn't agree more. Reverse would be true too!!!!

by nocal81(Vincent) on Mar 4, 2011 11:59 PM PST up reply actions  

:(

sigh

Kellen Moore is awesome
Katie Mcgrath is our savior
my dog <3

by manraj7 on Mar 5, 2011 12:00 AM PST up reply actions  

You are an A though

I give fooch a B… and myself a C…

Never mind, just trying to be nice

Mila "Sweet Lips" Kunis, as stated by Scarlett Johansson. I couldn't agree more. Reverse would be true too!!!!

by nocal81(Vincent) on Mar 5, 2011 12:06 AM PST up reply actions  

I am the B and fooch is the C

Just playing, i LOVE that guy; he is awesome

Mila "Sweet Lips" Kunis, as stated by Scarlett Johansson. I couldn't agree more. Reverse would be true too!!!!

by nocal81(Vincent) on Mar 5, 2011 12:08 AM PST up reply actions  

I love him too

I give you an A+

Kellen Moore is awesome
Katie Mcgrath is our savior
my dog <3

by manraj7 on Mar 5, 2011 10:36 AM PST up reply actions  

but when our pass rush was there, our corners did fine

see Arizona the past two years. Part of our secondary problems I think could be solved with better coaching which they should have this year. They got burned a lot biting on double moves. If they could learn to be more disciplined, it would help them a lot, as would a real pass rush.

by Andrew9erfan on Mar 5, 2011 7:12 AM PST up reply actions  

I'm not saying cornerback is not a concern

but the class is deep. Davon House would be an excellent choice in the second round. Von Miller was the Butkus Award winner as best linebacker. I think that a linebacking core that had Willis, Miller, Spikes, and Lawson would be much better for the 49ers than last year.

The only way I’d draft a corner is if Peterson falls to the 7th pick.

by Rocky63215 on Mar 4, 2011 11:47 PM PST up reply actions  

Von Miller is 240

Won’t hold up against NFL tackles and guards especially in the run. You say that CB is deep there are a lot of prospects for the 3-4 OLB

Kellen Moore is awesome
Katie Mcgrath is our savior
my dog <3

by manraj7 on Mar 4, 2011 11:55 PM PST up reply actions  

I get that

Actually think Von Miller’s size constraint could be hidden on the 49ers defensive roster. Willis and Spikes pick up a lot of slack for everyone else in the run game. You could stick Von Miller on Soap’s side and the offense would have enough trouble with Soap it might not matter Von Miller isn’t the best run defender. Justin Smith can cover him up somewhat too.

I disagree about the amount 3-4 OLB prospects. Most are serious projects whereas even the CBs’ in the 2nd and 3rd round probably log nickel coverage immediately.

by bignerd on Mar 5, 2011 1:21 AM PST up reply actions  

Davon House looked awful in the combine, and is now a third round pick at the earliest imo

I agree OLB is much more important in a 3-4 than corner, but our pass rush wasn’t the reason we gave up so many completions last season – it was the fact that our CBs were getting beat by double or even single moves all season. Regardless of how good the pass rush is, if the first read for a QB is wide open, the pass will kept completed within 3.5 seconds. No pass rush is going to get to the QB in less than 3.5 seconds against a decent o-line, even if you have a Ware.

by TeeKay89 on Mar 4, 2011 11:57 PM PST up reply actions  

How'd Curtis Marsh do?

Kellen Moore is awesome
Katie Mcgrath is our savior
my dog <3

by manraj7 on Mar 5, 2011 12:00 AM PST up reply actions  

Curtis Marsh was okay, Harris looked very impressive but was only 5"9, rather than the 5"10 or even 5"11 reported

He looked fluid in transition, the most fluid imo of all the DBs, but at 5"9 showed why I don’t think he’s a first round talent. For every Brandon Flowers, there are plenty of CBs that don’t cut it in the NFL at that height, especially with so many tall WRs in the league now. Amukamara had some stiffness, as did Peterson. I thought Prince did better in his workouts than his position drills. I thought he’d look polished in his drills, but he didn’t look outstanding. Neither did Peterson, though Peterson showed soft hands. I was amazed at how many DBs were so high to start their motion, you would think they would have been taught to stay low – especially before the combine which is what coaches look at in the drills (with fluidity in transition). Both Prince and Peterson were too high in their staring positions. Ideally, a CB wants to be touching the grass when he starts off, while safeties stand heigher up so they can see the field. Both Prince and Peterson, and almost all the CBs stood upright, like they were safeties.

by TeeKay89 on Mar 5, 2011 12:10 AM PST up reply actions  

They are so big it’s difficult to get them down that low.

by bignerd on Mar 5, 2011 1:23 AM PST up reply actions  

Ware was pretty crappy for 70% of the season

He wasn’t even alive while Wade was coach than took him a few games to get going under Garrett.

by bignerd on Mar 5, 2011 1:23 AM PST up reply actions  

lol, as if that couldnt happen to any pass rushers.

Superbowl camps have 3 solid corners and one solid pass rusher. Superbowl loser has two pass rusher and no corners, do the math.

RLOTT#42

by rlott#42 on Mar 5, 2011 8:36 AM PST up reply actions  

The math you are referring to is incorrect

It’s not the fact that the SB Champs had more good corners, it’s the fact that they were actually balanced. Steelers had ZERO CBs. Whereas the Packers had CBs AND and elite pass rusher.

It’s balance.

by hudd07 on Mar 5, 2011 10:03 AM PST up reply actions  

Really?

The Steelers would like to have a word with you.

Some of us will do our jobs well and some will not, but we will be judged by only one thing -- the result. -Lombardi

by Drew Kerr on Mar 5, 2011 4:48 PM PST up reply actions  

Importance in 3-4

1) NT
2) OLB
3) Strong ILB

IMO, how we should pursue the draft: Get Peterson in the first – trade up to fourth overall if we have to. Get a CB in the second, a NT in the third, and an OLB and a centre in the fourth.

by TeeKay89 on Mar 4, 2011 11:53 PM PST reply actions  

There is a limit to how bad your coverage can be...

And below that limit no pass rush is going to improve your pass defense.

When the talent and speed in the secondary sucks the best way to improve the pass defense is to surprise actually add top talent to the secondary.

No addition at any other position is going to improve the pass coverage as much as adding talent to the secondary until you have at least a decent starting tandem.

by Ougadas on Mar 5, 2011 12:19 AM PST reply actions  

Or adding a pass rusher

There are actually two ways to improve the pass defense. As I said the 49ers need both.

by bignerd on Mar 5, 2011 1:27 AM PST up reply actions  

Yes

Adding a pass rusher does improve the pass defense.

But what you don’t seem capable of understanding is that the amount of improvement you get by adding a pass rusher to a defense with a horrible secondary is marginal compared to the amount of improvement you get by actually putting some talent in your secondary.

by Ougadas on Mar 5, 2011 1:33 AM PST up reply actions  

I doubt you claim that it's marginal

You can play a lot of shell coverage with a good pass rush or rusher.

by bignerd on Mar 5, 2011 1:42 AM PST up reply actions  

um…when did we have a good pass rush last year?

by Andrew9erfan on Mar 5, 2011 7:01 AM PST up reply actions  

On the rare occasions we actually rushed.

A guy like Tamba Hali gets 3x as many rushes as Manny, and gets to the QB less per attempt.

by Ougadas on Mar 5, 2011 8:21 AM PST up reply actions  

was nate clements once really considered a shut down corner?

Niners, Lakers and the Warriors... when Lakers have the night off.

Lebron James has one thing that Kobe Bryant will never have... a bronze medal.

by afrikabamboodle on Mar 5, 2011 1:47 AM PST reply actions  

No

People keep saying that. Clements was a good corner and GREAT in run defense but he was never considered a Revis or Nnamdi type of DB.

The people that keep saying he was a shut down corner with Buffalo are mistaken.

by hudd07 on Mar 5, 2011 10:06 AM PST up reply actions  

I feel that our most important need is 2 things..

Cornerback and Quarterback..

cuz if we get a lock down corner we will stop the other team from scoring the amounts of points they have been lately but we will still not be scoring enough and vise versa..

Get a decent qb and a lock down corner and you can say the 49ers just made it to the playoffs although that was the motto during last off-season throughout the NFL haha.. plz no more hype up jynxs lol

by StevenC on Mar 5, 2011 3:32 AM PST reply actions  

how many lock down corners are there in the league

seriously, can people stop expecting the next CB to start for the 49ers to be “lock-down” they don’t be. Just assume that.

by whistlingmountain on Mar 5, 2011 5:18 AM PST up reply actions  

no corner can lock a good receiver down forever. We need a pass rush.

by Andrew9erfan on Mar 5, 2011 7:00 AM PST up reply actions  

Yes they can.

And they do it to the point that QB’s don’t even bother looking to their side.

by Ougadas on Mar 5, 2011 8:22 AM PST up reply actions  

they're both important obviously

I’d take the better prospect in a given situation, but all things being equal, would take the pass rusher.

corners have less general value because they “lose it” faster, they can be played away from, and against teams that go 5 wide, they can only cover 1 of 5 receivers on the field.

At OLB the 49ers have no 3 down players, that is pretty horrific. Lawson is gone, Haralson shrunk into his extension rather than grew into it. They need two starters.

At CB Clements is an average 2nd CB, particularly when sliding him into the slot on passing downs. Spencer is a below average 1. If you can replace him with a 1 and move him to nickel ( if they resign Clements ) or to 2nd ( if they don’t ) that’s a pretty nice upgrade.

I don’t think the CB position is as grim long-term as many people are making it out to be though. Plenty of teams around the league have paired up some young no-name guys and produced decent pairs. The 49ers additional problem is that on top of the CBs, their safeties are quite often in the wrong place.

by whistlingmountain on Mar 5, 2011 5:25 AM PST reply actions  

And when the offense goes 5 wide...

Your OLB pass rusher has no impact whatsoever because he’s not in your dime package.

In fact.. he’s not even in your nickel package because you want your best 2 run support and cover guys to stop the screens, draws, and short RB dumps that teams love to use when a team goes with a DB heavy look.

by Ougadas on Mar 5, 2011 8:25 AM PST up reply actions  

But the reason you are in a DB heavy look is because the Offense is in a PASSING situation

So you would still have your 3rd down pass rusher but they would be coming from the DE position or on a blitz.

So to say you don’t want to rush the passer in dime or nickel is absolutely wrong.

by hudd07 on Mar 5, 2011 10:09 AM PST up reply actions  

I think we have to go with Von Miller if he's available

It’s a lot harder to find a stud OLB pass rusher than a starting corner, and if we don’t find that pass rusher, opposing QBs will still have all day to throw and pick apart our secondary, even if we have Peterson back there. There’s also more talent for CB after the 1st than there is for 3-4 OLB. That being said, if we can find an OLB through trade or FA, bring on PP.

by Andrew9erfan on Mar 5, 2011 6:53 AM PST reply actions  

Also, just look at how much better our secondary looked the last two years when we actually got a pass rush going.

by Andrew9erfan on Mar 5, 2011 6:55 AM PST up reply actions  

CB

First thing lets get some fact out here. #1 CB’s and Pass-Rushers can be found in any round. Some teams do it better than others but it does happen. #2 The Niners defense allowed every QB outside of J.Campell to pretty much handle them passing the football even Matt Moore……yes Matt Moore. #3 To think that schemes don’t heavily come into play on either side of the football is silly at best as football in itself is a scheme driven game. Yes you must have talent but great talent and poor scheming with get you a job on T.V. not as a coach. Dom Capers went to G.B. a 4-3 team and turned them into a 3-4 that was a top 5 defense in one season……one! If Fangio is anything close to Capers in terms of coaching I would have to believe that he could get more out of Brooks and Lawson. Schematically, the Niners played far more conservative as a 3-4 defense than most. Part of that was because the secondary was so bad. I think if Fangio had the same talent from last season this team would have played far better and faired better in the sacks dept. All that said, the Niners have to upgrade the talent at CB, there just isn’t any other way to do it.The bottom line is the Zone Blitz in itself will create more sacks it’s just a fact. The better value to the defense is adding more guys that can cover. That was the difference between G.B. and Pitt, same scheme but one team had guys that could cover. Matter of fact the Pack didn’t even have two of their best guys in the second half and still performed better. Get guys that can cover and the front seven will be even more dangerous because now the DC can be flexible in his attack. It doesn’t work the other way around as well.

by darkhorse_2000 on Mar 5, 2011 10:25 AM PST reply actions  

How is quarterback not even an option up there?

I put “other”

Some of us will do our jobs well and some will not, but we will be judged by only one thing -- the result. -Lombardi

by Drew Kerr on Mar 5, 2011 4:47 PM PST reply actions  

We need...

A QB far more than we need a CB or pass rusher. No contest !
But I think we get 3 new QB’s on the roster but with the 7th pick I want Miller or Peterson.

by TIM___ on Mar 5, 2011 7:18 PM PST reply actions  

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