Injuries And The NFL's Not So Secret Dirty Little Secret
Heading into Sunday's game against the New York Giants, Delanie Walker was the most notable recent injury issue, but other players were a bit banged up. Kyle Williams suffered a concussion in Week 16 but seemed generally good to go. I don't think it impacted his performance, but apparently New York Giants players were prepared to figure out just how much it could impact Williams' play.
According to reports out of New York, Giants players have apparently admitted to targeting Kyle Williams with hopes of knocking him out of the game. They knew he had suffered a concussion relatively recently and they wanted to use that information to their advantage in a must-win game. Sam Lam indicated he noticed Giants players taking swipes at Delanie Walker's helmet. This follows Walker's own comments heading into the game that he expected the Giants to come after him because of his jaw injury.
My immediate reaction was one of a disgust. While winning is a great thing, feeling the need to resort to attempts at injuring a player is about as low as it gets. And yet, in spite of that, I have to admit that I am not remotely surprised about this. I am surprised somebody admitted it, but I'm not surprised the Giants were making these attempts.
The NFL has made numerous rule changes to try and decrease tramautic injuries, particularly to the head. However, this incident shows how hard this issue will always be for the NFL. While I'd like to blame the Giants for being lower than low, it'd be naive to think this is an isolated or rare incident. It is normally not something we hear about, so it is hard to assess how frequent this happens. But to think the Giants are the only team to do this would be a bit foolish.
I have no idea how the league can legislate this issue, but it remains a problem.
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I think they should declare us the winner of the game, in retrospect, and DQ the Giants from life in general
We're as good as we play each week, no better, no worse.
Follow @Tre9er
by Tre9er on Jan 24, 2012 8:06 AM PST reply actions 1 recs
couldn't have
said it better.. but i want revenge next season.. and knowing harbs, we sure will get it! remember, we play them again next regular season
Yes , this will soon ( Not ) be forgotten ...!!
I'm your " Huckelberry "...it's just my game ..( .AleX ) was asked , what do you think about all the game manager talk ... AleX i guess i just managed myself a VIctory ... Extend the Man ...!!
Coming from the fan base
Bragging about how many RBs the 9ers injured this season, including head hunting a RB unconscious against the Saints a week earlier. I guess it’s only ok for the 9ers.
FIRE Perry Fewell
by bleedblue12 on Jan 24, 2012 7:09 PM PST via Android app up reply actions
Not the same thing at all
Most of those hits on RBs were totally legal, and the Niners weren’t trying to exploit an existing injury. By your logic, the Karate Kid was no different than the dude who swept his leg because both were trying to knock each other out.
What ever makes you sleep better at night...
Have fun watching the dirty Giants win another SB next Sunday.
FIRE Perry Fewell
by bleedblue12 on Jan 25, 2012 9:33 AM PST via Android app up reply actions
Aw, looks like Jerome from Manhattan's a little defensive, lol
Never called the Giants dirty. Unlike you, your team is classy and deserving of its win. Just saying your logic makes zero sense.
No I'm not...
Elton John from San Fran.
FIRE Perry Fewell
by bleedblue12 on Jan 25, 2012 1:14 PM PST via Android app up reply actions
I guess you're not smart enough to get the reference so I'll spell it out....
San Fran=gay Capitol of the world.
Elton John=gay…….get it now?
FIRE Perry Fewell
actually...
San Francisco is reportedly not even in the top 15 list of largest gay populations. I know that won’t get in the way of your argument, but whatever.
by David Fucillo on Jan 26, 2012 6:52 PM PST up reply actions
SLam is right...
…we noticed the shots at Delanie’s helmet, too. Sparked a spirited debate about whether it was appropriate to “sweep the leg,” so to speak.
Not to start a flame war
But teams have been doing this since teams have been forced to release injury reports.
Despicable or not, to think teams won’t exploit every legal possibility to increase their odds of winning is naivety (which you said)
Teams did the same thing to Tuck when his neck was hurting
Self-praise is for losers. Be a winner. Stand for something. Always have class, and be humble.
-John Madden
The Ballard of Jake:
Stop→Slow→Truck→LEAP!
(Adapted from Raptor 22)
by Willgfass on Jan 24, 2012 8:29 AM PST reply actions 1 recs
agree...
We don’t normally hear it, but to think the Giants are the only team that do this is a bit naive.
by David Fucillo on Jan 24, 2012 8:34 AM PST up reply actions
I mean it sucks, no doubt
But it’s football, for better or worst
Self-praise is for losers. Be a winner. Stand for something. Always have class, and be humble.
-John Madden
The Ballard of Jake:
Stop→Slow→Truck→LEAP!
(Adapted from Raptor 22)
It's only dirty if you're trying to hurt a guy's knee when he's returning from injury. Going after a guy that is concussion prone is part of the game
If you can’t take a shot to the head you probably shouldn’t be on the field as they are all but inevitable. (There are obviously exceptions to this such as the type of headhunting Roy Williams used to do which are dirty as hell and even more dirty going after a guy coming off injury)
The type of shots that injure knees are generally dirty to begin with and doing that on a guy returning from a year of rehab is despicable.
Gimme 1 round!
by ItBurnzWhenIP on Jan 25, 2012 11:18 AM PST up reply actions
But teams have been doing this since teams have been forced to release injury reports.
I think there’s a difference when you talk about someone going after someone’s ankle or knee or something like that vs. when you talk about going after someone’s brain. This is a violent sport, and I thought these guys had more respect for one another. Concussions have long term affects that can’t be healed, and to intentionally try to inflict that on someone makes me cringe.
I’m not trying to start any trouble, it has nothing to do with the Giants (it has to do with the individuals), but I don’t think you can make any excuses for intentionally trying to concuss someone, imho.
by E-Train on Jan 24, 2012 8:00 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Well , IMO some Giant players are classless and not to far removed from Rex and his band of thugs ...!!
I'm your " Huckelberry "...it's just my game ..( .AleX ) was asked , what do you think about all the game manager talk ... AleX i guess i just managed myself a VIctory ... Extend the Man ...!!
Meh
A weakness will be attacked no matter the opponent, it’s wise for the opposition to do so. If Williams or Walker were that big of injury risk, they would not have played. The Giants were penalized twice on illegal hands to the face, were either of those penalties called on Williams or Walker (I can’t recall)?
Obviously when targeting a player’s head, it’s outside the rules of the NFL, so in this case it’s a bit of grey area to target injuries. If the injuries were not related to either player’s head, I doubt we’d even have this discussion. I mean, I’d target a player’s arm or leg if I knew it was susceptible to injury. You can’t really target a player’s head without going outside of the rules (unless of course that player has already established himself as a runner and isn’t defenseless).
The bottom line is, the 49ers lost this game. It wasn’t because the Giants players are cheap or dirty, it was because the 49ers converted one [site decorum]ing third down all [site decorum]ing game. There are many things that could have been different in this game, and the least affect on the outcome were Giants players targeting Walker and Williams.
But Kyle, when you call Peter on a punt, stay the [site decourm] away from it in any future scenario.
by Andrew Davidson on Jan 24, 2012 8:48 AM PST reply actions
I'm surprized you are surprized.
Football is a money making business and highly competitive, to take advantage of any injury to get a edge is going to happen by most players and coaches. If anything injury reports should be kept secret to keep the playing field more balanced. If you know a player opposite of you has a injury, your going to take advantage of that to improve your performance.
The only way around it is to punish players for illegal hits, players with recent injuries shouldn’t be playing if a recent injury inhibits their ability to play.
surprised?
I said I’m not surprised by this, but surprised somebody admitted it.
by David Fucillo on Jan 24, 2012 8:59 AM PST up reply actions
The NFL should stop making teams release injury reports.
Add an additional layer of depth to gameplanning.
---
Revenge is ice cream.
Much ado about nothing
I didn’t see any particularly dirty play by the Giants. This is pro football. Players will be hit where it hurts them most in order to take them out. It doesn’t matter if the hit is “clean” or in an injured area of the body. The point is to take the player out of the game.
Tim Ryan apparently commented well before the game that Kyle Wllliams had a “deer in a headlight” look about him. If a TV analyst can sense that a player may not going be able to handle a situation that is too big for him, rest assured that the other team will have come to the same conclusion from their scouting, whatever the reason for Williams’ inability to deal with the moment was.
“The battle is won before it is fought”: Sun Tzu
Well said
FIRE Perry Fewell
by bleedblue12 on Jan 24, 2012 7:12 PM PST via Android app up reply actions
East Coast
I’ve lived in Connecticut for the past ten years. That’s just New York sports for you. By any means necessary; and that usually involves dirty play like that. It’s also kind of a Boston thing. The Patriots play cleaner but Bruins and Celtics want you to get emotional when you play them. And if they can get you out of the game by luring you into a fight, hurting you or faking injuries, they will.
Was Delaney's broken
jaw an accident. Probably not. A guy out of the play will take a shot and legwork is a common way to not get penalized. Like a D back accidentially stepping on the receiver’s foot or kneeing him in the process of falling on him.
Also, does anyone have a link to the non-called strip that might have won the Niners a game but for the official’s error? A quick whistle in a playoff, for me, is out of bounds. Guys are getting pounded well after the play w/o penalities, but they’re “protecting a running back” where a receiver is allowed to be held up for several sections while fists & elbows pound at the ball? I call BS.
Well , just think how many yards less Marshawn Lynch would of got if they blew the whistle early on some of his runs ...!!
I'm your " Huckelberry "...it's just my game ..( .AleX ) was asked , what do you think about all the game manager talk ... AleX i guess i just managed myself a VIctory ... Extend the Man ...!!
Here's the difference between Lynch's runs and Bradshaw's "fumble"
Bradshaw, not only had his forward progress stopped, but he was being tackled and going BACKWARDS. That’s the key part that you’re missing here.
It wasn’t just the fact that Bradshaw’s positive momentum was stopped, but he was being pulled BACKWARDS.
When you watch Lynch on his patented beast mode runs, he may have had his forward momentum stopped, but at the same time, he’s not going backwards. That’s why the refs still let it play out a bit more. Then, after a couple of seconds, when the stalemate is no longer resolved, they blow the whistle.
Notice that when there’s a stalemate, refs shallow their whistle and blow the play dead later. However, when someone’s forward progress is not only stopped, but he’s going backwards (not on his own, but due to defenders either tackling, pulling, pushing, etc), the refs blow it dead.
Bradshaw’s fumble occurred AFTER he was being pulled backward.
http://fifthdown.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/01/23/why-bradshaws-fumble-wasnt-a-fumble/
Its a sad fumble call
It was more like the ball being knocked out in the process of a tackle. No business being ruled forward progress he just happened to be falling back as he was being tackled.. He was not being held up.
hit to the helmet/head
I saw a few moments when the giants players were after both williams and walker. the ref’s did not seem to see them. williams did look like he was in a fog.
by Allah Chingada on Jan 24, 2012 10:40 AM PST reply actions
Apparently Eli was in on it too....
throw a couple of jump balls to the D, and dashon’ll knock out his own guys…..
Like you said, it works both ways
Let’s not kid ourselves. The 49ers defense, especially their safeties, have dealt some hard hits, some of which had the opposing players being concussed. And you’d be naive if you thought that the defense didn’t pride themselves in this.
I’m pretty sure that the 49ers safeties would’ve put a big hit on Cruz, Nicks, or Manninham if they came across the middle and try to take them out of the game.
Rocky Bernard, after a scuffle, was bleeding from his mouth. Demarcus Dobbs, #96, put a brutal hit on Sash and gave him a concussion on a 49ers punt return. Check out this video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YqGfjCWjbWk
Dobbs is in the middle of the screen. Dobbs lays that hit after Kyle Williams steps out of bounds. And from the look of it, Dobbs looked pretty intent on laying someone out. Remember, the return is in front of him, so he can clearly see that Kyle Williams is heading out of bounds, and he decides to lay a hit on Sash.
The play was just about over and there was the intent to lay someone out.
It was a a type of block that’s been patented by Hines Ward. It was similar to the block made by Hines Ward, when he broke Keith RIvers jaw. (The NFL made a Hines Ward rule, making those blocks illegal.)
At the same time, I’m not calling the Giants saints either.
And speaking of the Saints, look at the shots they took at Brett Favre’s ankle, when they knew that area was injured.
It happens all throughout the NFL.
We can all agree that there’s a fine line between what’s legal and illegal.
That's false equivalence
A legal hit that causes an injury is not the same thing as deliberately trying to exploit someone who’s already injured with illegal contact like the Giants did by slapping Walker’s face.
Nothing dirty or unusual about this
Delanie playing was irresponsible in the first place. Going after Kyles concussion is the norm. If you’re a fighter in combat against another fighter that has a history of being knocked out you’re going to use that to your advantage and try to have him carried out again.
The only thing I consider dirty in this regard is going after a guys knees shortly after returning from a knee injury.
Gimme 1 round!

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