49ers Wide Receivers: A Good Corps Heading Into 2012 Season?
by Tre9er on Jan 5, 2012 3:00 PM PST
in 2012 NFL Draft
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Granted we haven't even played our first playoff game, and wont for over a week...it IS NFL draft season with college bowl games winding down. If you're like me you look forward to this time of year and can't wait to get started discussing the possibilities.
One of the first things we usually do is identify "positions of need", that is, positions on the roster that are in need of new blood whether it be a stud or depth. Generally draftniks like to start looking at the first few rounds to begin-with and go from there. This means you start with positions of greatest need (or those that warrant an early pick at least).
For much of the season Wide Receiver (WR) has been one of the top listed positions of need for the 49ers. Earlier in the season, after Braylon Edwards got nicked-up and Michael Crabtree was just starting to get back to full strength, it seemed like WR was a HUGE position of need.
With what I would call the emergance of Kyle Williams, in terms of his playing-time increasing and in-turn his numbers, coupled with Crabtree's recent breakout (of consistency, at least)...I wonder if this is still the case?
Personally I feel like Crabtree and Williams make a formidable duo, especially after another off-season is under their belt in the new system, with Alex Smith, etc. I also hope that Joshua Morgan returns to prior form after most expect him to re-sign with the team this off-season.
Granted none of these guys are established superstars...they're not Andre Johnson or Calvin Johnson (or Big Johnson from those t-shirts)...I think they will only get better, which minimizes the need for a big-time WR in my eyes.
Now, sure, if someone falls to us at draft-slot #32 (see what I did there?!?) a-la-Crabtree...then yeah, it's a no-brainer. Heck, I'm even ok with spending a second round pick on a guy...just not sure I see the need as the top position anymore.
What are your thoughts? Can Crab, Morgan and K-Dub be a good group going forward or do we need to put all our eggs into a first-round pick's basket?
Or what about Free Agency? Guys like Marques Colston and Vincent Jackson look primed to hit the market. Will they help the team enough to warrant their price-tag? The 49ers aren't known for entering into bidding-wars, which seems like what would happen with these premium FA WR's. That's mostly why I reference the draft in terms of building this team with elite talent.
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After we get Matt Flynn we can talk about the WRs
"And thank you to God for making me an Atheist." - Ricky Gervais
by MichaelClutchtree on Jan 5, 2012 3:03 PM PST reply actions 1 recs
What’s the point of throwing a ton of money at and getting a big play WR like VJax or Colston when harbaugh is content with having Alex throw the ball for less than 200 yards a game?
"And thank you to God for making me an Atheist." - Ricky Gervais
by MichaelClutchtree on Jan 5, 2012 3:05 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
maybe with a full offseason with a decent group of WR they'd throw it more
But either way, it’s still important to be able to pass, even if it’s a more balanced offense and not pass heavy.
We are 13-3 throwing that little.
Why would getting Flynn change it? I saw Flynn in college numerous times. Okay, but nothing to get that excited over. There’s a reason he was a 7th round pick.
And I know he had a Madden-esque day last week. Good for him. Kolb did too, and we all see how amazingly awesome he is right now.
Go for a big name receiver. I’d love to snag Bowe or Jackson myself.
"The Harbaughcolypse is upon us. No one in the NFL is safe"
Even if we got "the big QB"
he’d still have to have receivers to throw to
I've said this before
and though I’d rather pay for a weapon at QB, getting established talent at WR can’t hurt. But yes, since WR’s are very dependent on the QB, the QB comes first.
Goes both ways...
And it’s no secret that you want nothing more than Smith gone for good.
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Unfortunately I don't as evidence of every single Alex Smith comment that you type.
If evidence conflicts, it’s safe to take your words at face value.
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Or Kaepernick as well
…..or ANY 49er for that matter
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alex is good
We need to get more talented at wideout, especially speed wise. We have size, and at least two with decent hands but no burners. Ginn, and Davis are fast at their position but they drop too many passes for my tastes. The reason we struggle to pass is because our recievers can’t get any separation. I know some of you guys aren’t too high on Smith but how can we really access how good he is or can be if he doesn’t have any real weapons to work with. Rodgers has a ton of weapons literally. They made him and Flynn look like Superman. If Alex gets half of those dropped passes completed his numbers become even more amazing. Morgan and crabtree are serviceable, but we need another one trust me
by texasniner31 on Jan 5, 2012 6:06 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
Rodgers makes those WR's except for Jennings.
They go to another team and their production drops off significantly.
Jordy Nelson anyone?
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NBA’s All-Time Leading Scorer
by afrikabamboodle on Jan 5, 2012 6:13 PM PST up reply actions
Jones and Driver are not horrible either… I remember a ton of people saying they wanted Jones… Can’t forget about Finely the TE as well.
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Sorry I meant Jordy's production would greatly drop
He’s what, the 3rd or 4th option on that team? If he’s facing #1 CBs his production would nowhere be as good.
Affectionately,
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar,
NBA’s All-Time Leading Scorer
by afrikabamboodle on Jan 5, 2012 6:20 PM PST up reply actions
He's the second option next to Jennings...
And he’s been the first option since Jennings has been injured.
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I haven't looked at the stats but has his production dropped off?
Affectionately,
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar,
NBA’s All-Time Leading Scorer
by afrikabamboodle on Jan 5, 2012 6:23 PM PST up reply actions
Nelson.
To be honest I’ve only seen his highlight reels, and yes while he is crazy wide open on plays, I contribute it more to busted coverage than anything else. Which is what I mean when I say “It seems like he gets lost in the shuffle.” But if I’m wrong then I’m wrong and he really is a great potential #1 WR.
Affectionately,
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar,
NBA’s All-Time Leading Scorer
by afrikabamboodle on Jan 5, 2012 6:29 PM PST up reply actions
Busted coverage?
Clearly you have not paid enough attention to his route running.
He has 1,263 yards (packers leader), 18.6 yard avg (packers leader) and 15 TD’s (packers leader)… that’s not luck on busted coverages brotha.
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Interesting, I'll try to find more video of him then.
Affectionately,
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar,
NBA’s All-Time Leading Scorer
by afrikabamboodle on Jan 5, 2012 6:34 PM PST up reply actions
Hes just the guy not being doubled.
He is the 3rd option. Teams have unwisely taken chances with him one on one. He could start on any team.
"What the hell are you mixing in that look-aid"
my thing is
Rodgers has several weapons, not just one. He is deep with wr’s 1-4 and a solid te. Alex doesn’t have near the talent on the outside that green bay has
by texasniner31 on Jan 5, 2012 9:23 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
3rd option with that much production?
C’mon lott, I know you aren’t that naive… he is no less than the 2nd option… at the LEAST.
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He’s #3, imo, but anyone but a packer is guessing. Production does not dictate that number, that offense attacks mismatches, point blank, period. In the redzone he’s #1 at times, but when your QB reads the d, than goes to his first based on that read, there is no 1,2,3. But, teams double Jennings and Finley and not Jordy. Proof is in the highlights. I’ve never seen a WR as productive as he, with 0 safety help on his side of field on the deep ball.
"What the hell are you mixing in that look-aid"
Ah hem...
Jennings has been out for a grip… and Nelson has been fine in a No. 1 role… he is their leading WR for the year…. in ALL categories… that didn’t happen because teams were doubling up on James Jones or Donald Driver.
Nelson was drawing doubles quite frequently toward the end of the year.
But you are entitled to an “opinion” even if it’s off.
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And chill out with that indirect name callin shit, that aint cool.
"What the hell are you mixing in that look-aid"
Nope… I said you are naive if you think that… and I stick by it.
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That's not name-calling...
It’s insinuating that you are wrong if you think that…
“name calling” would be like “idiot” or “clown” or something of that nature… which I didn’t call you because I don’t think those things of you…
There are some of them on this board but you are not one of ’em.
But I do think you are being a bit naive if you think Nelson is a No. 3 on their roster. There’s not one other player on that roster that is better than him outside of Jennings… A true number one draws doubles and still puts up mad numbers. Jennings is clearly the number two.
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- option is not #3 WR. Jennings, Finley, then Nelson. It’s not based on production.
"What the hell are you mixing in that look-aid"
Yeah… it’s based on production. What in the hell did Finley do this year? Not much.
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i disagree.
Jordy is not flying under the radar with opposing defenses, especially with Jennings being out he still beasted.
jordy nelson and wes welker are in the same position
i highly doubt there would be a white WR as productive as them without all-time greats throwing to them
and yes im white
"And thank you to God for making me an Atheist." - Ricky Gervais
by MichaelClutchtree on Jan 5, 2012 6:20 PM PST up reply actions
Maybe you haven't seen how open Jordy Nelson gets.
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He benefits from being the 3rd option though.
He’s facing lesser CB’s and is able to get lost in the shuffle.
Affectionately,
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar,
NBA’s All-Time Leading Scorer
by afrikabamboodle on Jan 5, 2012 6:22 PM PST up reply actions
I disagree
He breaks tackles and tacks on YACs, you can’t put that on Rogers.
Too bad he is NOT the 3rd option.
Or what I am assuming you meant, is 3rd on the depth chart. He’s been starting for a min now… even when Jennings was healthy.
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Drops...
You bring up a very good and valid point.
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stop making so much sense, you will make people go crazy!
"You know whats funny? I always thought uhm dogs lay eggs and I learned something new today" Peter Griffin
by HUNGRY HUNTER on Jan 5, 2012 6:49 PM PST up reply actions
Some people don't care...
Some people would be happy with most teams practice squad QB’s…. just as long as it WASN’T Alex Smith…. which is tottttttaaaalllllyyyyy rational.
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Of course you would.
I’m sure you would take 99% of them thereafter too just because you are THAT biased against him.
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you should also know by now
that I have nothing against Smith. I’ve just watched him for a long time and want to do better. I knew he was better than he’s been the first six, but we still should aim to get better.
I'd say Flynn is going to be the next
Matt Cassell/ Kevin Kolb. Backups who got to play in an established system and light things up but struggle when taken out of their element and made into a franchise QB.
Affectionately,
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar,
NBA’s All-Time Leading Scorer
by afrikabamboodle on Jan 5, 2012 6:04 PM PST up reply actions
Jealousy
We can’t let Arizona be the only team that massively overpays for a backup in our division.
"The Harbaughcolypse is upon us. No one in the NFL is safe"
by Blank x2 on Jan 5, 2012 7:27 PM PST up reply actions 3 recs
Nice one haha.
Maybe Seattle will over pay for Flynn :P
Affectionately,
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar,
NBA’s All-Time Leading Scorer
by afrikabamboodle on Jan 5, 2012 7:30 PM PST up reply actions
why not?!?!?
"You know whats funny? I always thought uhm dogs lay eggs and I learned something new today" Peter Griffin
by HUNGRY HUNTER on Jan 5, 2012 6:48 PM PST up reply actions
Because he is not going to be worth the paper that the money is printed out on.
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that can be said about many players including some on the niners!
"You know whats funny? I always thought uhm dogs lay eggs and I learned something new today" Peter Griffin
by HUNGRY HUNTER on Jan 5, 2012 6:51 PM PST up reply actions
you brought it up?
"You know whats funny? I always thought uhm dogs lay eggs and I learned something new today" Peter Griffin
by HUNGRY HUNTER on Jan 5, 2012 7:07 PM PST up reply actions
60 Million Dollars is too much for an unproven which is what he'll prob get.
No thanks…. that was the point and illustration of the analogy.
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60million dollars?
wow, where did you get that number from? lol
why not $150,000,000 or $250,000,000,000?
"You know whats funny? I always thought uhm dogs lay eggs and I learned something new today" Peter Griffin
by HUNGRY HUNTER on Jan 5, 2012 7:37 PM PST up reply actions
Kolb got 63 Million...
So 60 is not as ridiculous as you are acting there smarty pants.
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http://blogs.nfl.com/2011/07/28/kolb-contract-includes-21-million-guaranteed/
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rec'ed lol
"You know whats funny? I always thought uhm dogs lay eggs and I learned something new today" Peter Griffin
by HUNGRY HUNTER on Jan 5, 2012 6:46 PM PST up reply actions
What's the position that we need the most help in?
We need a WR and depth in the oline, maybe another defensive back and a backup fullback
by Leoniner on Jan 5, 2012 3:08 PM PST via mobile reply actions
Another TE that can flex into FB
would be better than a backup FB.
I think Byham can fill that role.
Affectionately,
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar,
NBA’s All-Time Leading Scorer
by afrikabamboodle on Jan 5, 2012 4:36 PM PST up reply actions
Joe Staley did not make the probowl, Kilgore was not drafted, and Alex Boone was not extended. Oh, but Chilo Rachel rocks!
"You know whats funny? I always thought uhm dogs lay eggs and I learned something new today" Peter Griffin
by HUNGRY HUNTER on Jan 5, 2012 6:47 PM PST up reply actions
We need a......................
Cornerback. We give up too many passing yards. Then go d line. Worry about offense in the 3rd or 4th round.
we give up so many passing yards because teams give up on the run!
"You know whats funny? I always thought uhm dogs lay eggs and I learned something new today" Peter Griffin
by HUNGRY HUNTER on Jan 6, 2012 12:33 AM PST up reply actions
Aside from Crabtree and Williams, I’d like to see a completely different roster at WR than this season. Yes, I made this statement with Morgan in mind.
"What the hell are you mixing in that look-aid"
I do think we overvalue Morgan and what he brings to the team...
I’d be happy w/ him as a #3, but we need better wideouts.
"The principle is competing against yourself. It's about self improvement, about being better than you were the day before." ~Steve Young #8
by Young_To_Rice on Jan 5, 2012 3:38 PM PST up reply actions
depends on the price
Morgan was on the way to a breakout season before he got injured. For the right price, he would be a great addition to the offense.
Define 'breakout,' though, because breaking out by his previous standards isn't that impressive...
"The principle is competing against yourself. It's about self improvement, about being better than you were the day before." ~Steve Young #8
by Young_To_Rice on Jan 5, 2012 3:41 PM PST up reply actions
fair enough
He was turning into a solid possession receiver, with potential to become a great one. Before tampa, he was catching 75% of passes thrown his way, averaging almost 15 yards a catch, and on pace to finish with 800-1000 yards. It was a small sample size, sure, but those are pretty good numbers for a #2 WR.
since hes been here
He’s been our most consistent reciever over the years although he wasn’t the starter
by texasniner31 on Jan 5, 2012 6:14 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
In his career, he's had a 14.7+ ypc in all but one season. He also had 700 yards last season.
He is not overrated. I remember people saying the same thing when he was injured vs Tampa.
Don't think Morgan is overvalued
he’s a solid #2 receiver who will have to fight off Kyle Williams
Crabtree is a solid #2 receiver who has been threatening to break out to #1 production for a while now.
We should draft the receiver we though Braylon was, and may have been before he was injured.
Not sure if Morgan would go into next year as the #2.
I believe Morgan would get the job by default, but Kyle’s production speaks for itself. It would probably be one of our biggest off season battles between the 2 of them for the second WR spot.
Affectionately,
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar,
NBA’s All-Time Leading Scorer
by afrikabamboodle on Jan 5, 2012 4:34 PM PST up reply actions
different types of players
we may build it up as a position battle, but really Morgan and Williams bring different skill sets to the table. I’d expect Morgan to be the number two by default, but in reality the two would end up with the equivilant # of snaps.
exactly
If anything, Morgan would probably boost Williams’ production. Given his speed and shiftiness, Williams would be a beast in the slot. The problem is, the 49ers play him outside because they have no one else to line up wide opposite crabtree.
Next year, Harbaugh can split out Morgan and Crabtree, and Williams will be able to mess up safeties and linebackers out of the slot. Replace one of those flankers with a true number one receiver from free agency who can demands double coverage, and williams will go bananas next year.
speed
Need some speed on the edge
by texasniner31 on Jan 5, 2012 6:27 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
Exactly, Crabtree is a #2, Williams a #3, we need a WR better than both.
Think Packer type weapons instead of 2000 Ravens.
"What the hell are you mixing in that look-aid"
Crabtree will have 90 catches for 1,000+ yards next year.
If he had those three games back, he would have come close to that this year.
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I guess its not registering.
With this group of wrs no one respects us deep, especially with Alex. Our run game and short passing game will continue to suffer. A true 1 will take that pressure off of the offense. Crabtree cannot be a #1 with this QB.
"What the hell are you mixing in that look-aid"
Can Alex throw the deep ball consistently??
He’s looked pretty spotty either under or overthrowing receivers downfield.
by Mapletreemarty on Jan 6, 2012 7:31 AM PST up reply actions
speed at wr
Helps on deep throws. The pass doesn’t have to be perfect if you can just launch it and let him run under it. When your recievers are slower passes have to be more precise
by texasniner31 on Jan 6, 2012 5:18 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
As it was
He was ranked 16th (73) in receptions with missing time.
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Another FA WR........Dwayne Bowe!!
just food for thought
Niners,Nets,Reds & USC!!!
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Bowe is a Beast!!!!
Big and athletic…i likey
by Frisco_Kid on Jan 5, 2012 3:37 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
I think Stevie Johnson
is a FA, and also is a SF native. But I wouldn’t break the bank for him.
"A foghorn blowing out wild and cold." -Dire Straits
He's my favorite WR FA for sure.
But I believe he would also be the most expensive as well.
Affectionately,
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar,
NBA’s All-Time Leading Scorer
by afrikabamboodle on Jan 5, 2012 4:13 PM PST up reply actions
As for expensive WR thinking expensive to least...
1.VJax
2. Dwayne
3. Marques
4. Stevie
5. DeSean
I know last two can become a problem but hey who knows.
Honestly think FO can draft one like Floyd or Sanu
Niners,Nets,Reds & USC!!!
The Most Interesting Man In The World---->Mikhail Prokhorov!!!
by Kidd2Petrovic on Jan 5, 2012 4:17 PM PST up reply actions
Reggie Wayne
might be available as well. Older, but quality and can bring veteran qualities. He had 960 yds and 4 tds with a 10 years old throwing to him.
Honestly I believe our coaching staff
values blocking more than the ability to catch. If you can’t block on this 49er team, you’re on the bench until you learn how to.
Affectionately,
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar,
NBA’s All-Time Leading Scorer
by afrikabamboodle on Jan 5, 2012 4:28 PM PST up reply actions
Our WR's are pretty good at both...
And with how conservative this offense is, we sort of need to have decent blocking WR’s.
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I like this idea a lot
I doubt NO lets Colston leave but they might with Meachem
What tool are we missing?
The tall big body who moves the chains and is a threat to score in the red-zone even if you cover him. That’s what I keep hearing and I agree.
But I don’t think we are looking for a wide receiver. I think we are looking for a true tight end. Vernon isn’t. Vernon is more like a big wide receiver and a matchup nightmare but his game isn’t power, it’s speed and finesse. Walker is a hybrid that doesn’t fill that role either and Peele is a blocking specialist.
I’d be content with a core group of Crabs / Morgan / Williams if we brought in that true tight end.
Every time Jamie Dukes says something enlightening and informative about football Jerry Rice and I mount up on our flying grizzly bears and claim pirate treasure from the moon. That's how often it happens.
I wouldn't mind another Tight End.
Could really get into the 3 TE sets Harbuagh loves lol.
extrabaggs
"Just your typical Giants scoring rally: A faceburger on the basepaths, two errors from the second baseman and a bases-loaded balk."
by Badly Browned on Jan 5, 2012 3:20 PM PST up reply actions
still have Nate Byham on roster.....
that looked good in ‘10 before getting hurt in preseason. Then I wouldn’t mind them drafting one late of course.
Some prospects:
Coby Fleener- Stanford (doubt would be in the late rounds though)
Zack Eifert – ND
Jake Stoneburner – Ohio State
David Paulson – Oregon
Niners,Nets,Reds & USC!!!
The Most Interesting Man In The World---->Mikhail Prokhorov!!!
by Kidd2Petrovic on Jan 5, 2012 3:30 PM PST up reply actions
Celek's little brother
I’ve been looking at Brent Celek’s little brother. Good hands. Played LT in high school, so I assume he can block ok. Had some injuries. Might be a steal in the 7th round.
Check out his scouting report at Fanaticalfootballfiend It is a great site. You can lost in there for hours.
Add to your list....
Bryan – NC State 6’5" 265
Allen – Clemson 6’4" 255
Allen will prob go Rds 1 – 2, and Bryan will be around for a late round pickup. Good size, blocking and really soft hands for such a big guy
Was also looking at Charles Orson but
wanted to get a late round guy and I think Orson will go in rd 2-3 also. He seems like he’d be super WR, but not sure about his blocking.
Well, you know the 9ers worked out Cody Slate
6-4 and 229 pounds, 23 career receiving touchdowns @ Marshall. Had a torn ACL though, so may be damaged goods.
Get that TE you mentioned
And move VD to WR. Matchup nightmare more than he is now.
"The Harbaughcolypse is upon us. No one in the NFL is safe"
Walker would be moved to WR, not VD.
Draft: 1. Kendall Wright 2. Trumaine Johnson
FA: Smith, Morgan, Brooks, Rogers, Snyder
by whistlingmountain on Jan 5, 2012 3:55 PM PST up reply actions
yea I've been saying it for a while, the 49ers pieces don't fit consistent roles
so it’s not out of the question to bring in WR and TE for playing time, not just depth. I keep mentioning Fleener, I don’t know how high he’ll go, but I think he’s in play.
Draft: 1. Kendall Wright 2. Trumaine Johnson
FA: Smith, Morgan, Brooks, Rogers, Snyder
by whistlingmountain on Jan 5, 2012 3:58 PM PST up reply actions
Thats the sad thing about Vernon
as big and strong as he is he should be running thru cats and draggin fools but he decides to try and juke them instead… smh
we need speed
We have every type of reciever except one that is fast who can take the top off a defense…ginn can’t catch so he doesn’t count
by texasniner31 on Jan 5, 2012 7:02 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
We need height.
With sure hands and good discipline.
morgan
I thought Morgan fit that role. He’s big with good hands
by texasniner31 on Jan 5, 2012 9:29 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
You want speed you're looking at a 5'10" guy
Kyle Williams is blazing fast. If you want speed and hands in a 6’3" guy you’re going to have to wait until the next Calvin Johnson that comes out in a year where we have a bad enough record.
Every time Jamie Dukes says something enlightening and informative about football Jerry Rice and I mount up on our flying grizzly bears and claim pirate treasure from the moon. That's how often it happens.
I don't think a lot of fans actually know that Williams ran a 4.30 at his pro day.
That’s lightning quick… and his game speed makes him look even faster than that.
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sadly
I totally agree with you. I know tall fast recievers don’t grow on trees. It would be nice if Williams can do it, but we could use one.
by texasniner31 on Jan 5, 2012 10:34 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
I wouldn't mind having Crabtree, Williams, and Morgan back.
Ginn can be back for Special Teams purposes, otherwise we do have Kyle and Hunter who can handle the punts/kick returns.
Would still rather bring in another WR to start beside Crabtree.
extrabaggs
"Just your typical Giants scoring rally: A faceburger on the basepaths, two errors from the second baseman and a bases-loaded balk."
Ginn for sure
Amazing in ST and has improved to ne a nice treat for a 4th WR
by mcwagner on Jan 5, 2012 3:31 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
I guess
depth is important … but I think this incarnation of the 49ers offense would be best suited to an excellent deep threat classic Raiders WR. Ginn is fast, but just isn’t that good at the little things. Kyle Williams… if he is THAT GUY he hasn’t shown it. Crabtree is simply not fast enough. They need a guy who is, you know, faster than Vernon Davis (but is a better route runner than Ginn). They need a player who demands safety help over the top on every play. That will prevent safeties from cheating against the run, and allow the possession receivers to work underneath.
That said – I like our guys. I even liked Zigler and I would like to see Kyle Williams become a star, and hope that Morgan can return from his injury.
Mike Wallace and De Sean Jackson are both Free Agents.
[Poorly Wrought THING] is what Brian Sabean would have made if he were a [THING-maker] instead of a MLB GM
+1
Exactly….couldn’t have said it better
by texasniner31 on Jan 5, 2012 7:48 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
Not just lately.
He’s been a good blocker all year, and we’re finally throwing passes to him in which he can use his jukems and get YAC.
Yeh but i hate that we throw 5 screens a game to him..
id rather limit it to 2 or maybe at least try it at different parts of the field like in the red zone like Green Bay does wit Jordy Nelson
We don't throw them that much.
Greg Roman didn’t even know what a screen pass was until a few weeks ago.
I actually think we need to throw more of them, specifically to Crab.
View from Acroos the POND !!!
Definitely we need to upgrade the WR Corps, like someone once said you can never get enough of them. Braylon Edwards was a waste of spunk (nothing personal strictly business). l believe we need to UPGRADE through FREE AGENCY , and not the draft. We need to get LUCK at any cost, and there’s a huge possibility since colts have Manning already. WCO is simple , just great WR with HANDS & GOOD TIMING (see Quarterbacking by Bill Walsh Video on You Tube). We need to get Jerry Rice, Steve Young & Joe Motana to help with coaching the WCO using our Archives. My greatest worry is losing coaches than how well we will do next season.
T.O. T.O. T.O T.O T.O. T.O. T.O T.O T.O. T.O. T.O T.O T.O. T.O. T.O T.O T.O. T.O. T.O T.O T.O. T.O. T.O T.O T.O. T.O. T.O T.O !!!
And injured. And old. And not the best teammate.
Oh, and retired. LoL
"The Harbaughcolypse is upon us. No one in the NFL is safe"
Nope........... IFL
take that!!
Niners,Nets,Reds & USC!!!
The Most Interesting Man In The World---->Mikhail Prokhorov!!!
by Kidd2Petrovic on Jan 5, 2012 4:19 PM PST up reply actions
I don't think people really think when they say TO.
They just randomly say his name because he used to play for us. Because it makes no sense whatsoever to sign him.
free agency is the way to go
Just like the 2010 free agent CB class, the 2011 WR class is ridiculously deep. Colston, D-Jax, and Vincent Jackson all have a chance to be the Nnamdi of next season (aka free agents who will get paid but struggle fitting into new schemes). But that still leaves Dwayne Bowe, Pierre Garcon, Plaxico Burress, Roy Williams, Patrick Crayton, Mario Manningham, Harry Douglas, Eddie Royal, Early Doucet, Jerome Simpson, Andre Caldwell, Laurent Robinson, and Chaz Schilens potentially in the “pleasant surprises” category. Like I said, ridiculously deep.
Garcon and Robinson would be nice, if the 49ers can get them for reasonable deals
"The principle is competing against yourself. It's about self improvement, about being better than you were the day before." ~Steve Young #8
by Young_To_Rice on Jan 5, 2012 3:40 PM PST up reply actions
also
with the niners finally back in contention some big name free agents might actually consider the bay area….im a firm beliver of building through the draft but a few missing pieces beign filled by FA could be great
by Frisco_Kid on Jan 5, 2012 3:41 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
totally agree
The draft is the right way to go, but this FO knows when to pull the trigger on a free agent (see: Rogers, Carlos). With next year’s market, I feel like the 49ers will definitely jump on a mid-tier free agent like Douglas, Royal, or Schilens.
Should have picked up Robinson after...
he shredded the 9ers in the preseason with San Diego. That would have been a great deal.
i know ill get popped in the mouth for saying it
But I really think we could use desean Jackson(fast and can catch), and we get a young corner in the draft we are pretty solid everywhere else except the line. I think we can afford to pay real wideout, because we wont be getting one any other way. Wr are always slow maturing when first coming to the NFL even Jerry.
by texasniner31 on Jan 5, 2012 8:15 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
I agree
I think DeSean would compliment crabtree and open doors for him and K williams. And with our first pick draft a corner since out secondary is the only real question mark on our defense if there is a question mark. Then draft d line and get a WR in the 3rd or 4th rd!!
DeSean can't catch
That’s one of his major issues.
Every time Jamie Dukes says something enlightening and informative about football Jerry Rice and I mount up on our flying grizzly bears and claim pirate treasure from the moon. That's how often it happens.
when he's on, he's on
He has games where he steps it up and takes over, the problem is consistency. For the right price, he would be a great ginn replacement, and with some coaching he might be a phenomenal pick-up.
Those are usually games where the protection is sub par
When he has to go up against a skilled corner he usually disappears.
Every time Jamie Dukes says something enlightening and informative about football Jerry Rice and I mount up on our flying grizzly bears and claim pirate treasure from the moon. That's how often it happens.
Whatever Jim and Trent want to do...
I’m all for. They have my trust 110%.
"The Harbaughcolypse is upon us. No one in the NFL is safe"
Glad you gave your approval
Only thing they were waiting on.
:)
Attack this day with an enthusiasm unknown to mankind. ~ Jack Harbaugh
seems pretty bad
they’re a long way from 1000%
Good point.
I always gave 110%. Maybe that’s why I’m not in the pros.
Knew I should have gave more effort!!
"The Harbaughcolypse is upon us. No one in the NFL is safe"
by Blank x2 on Jan 5, 2012 5:09 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
All depends on free agents Niners retain
If we can keep Roger at CB and potential Goldson at Safety (though I wouldnt be that bothered) and is Brooks a FA at the end of the season? then I will be very happy to see them focus on receiver in either free agency or draft, I wont be questionning Baalke anytime soon.
If we lose what decent secondary players we have, WR becomes less important anyway. I’d prefer a free agent in that case at WR with some experience if only because the WR of the Niners is still young and more youth with a high draft pick aint necessarily beneficial.
For any of you who read my rants...
You know I’m an Eagle hater (stuck in eastern PA). With that said, I would love D. Jackson on this team (hard for me to even write that). I’m forced to watch broadcasts of the Eagles every Sunday. This guy can flat out fly. He would completely change how defenses play this team. I’m hoping he wants a change of scenery. Go west, young man. Bowe would be a great addition, too.
would love D-Jax too, but...
what makes you think he’d come here? He was disgruntled in an offense where Michael Vick was throwing the ball 35 times a game. Alex Smith throwing it 25 times a game is not what you call an ideal situation, especially for a deep ball receiver.
If the niners did get jackson to replace Ginn, though? This offense goes to the next level overnight.
This offense goes to the next level overnight
how can it go to the next level when alex can’t even throw deep balls to the receivers we have now, let alone a short guy meant for huge plays?
"And thank you to God for making me an Atheist." - Ricky Gervais
by MichaelClutchtree on Jan 5, 2012 4:15 PM PST up reply actions
Give him someone who can get open deep
Not saying that smith becomes drew brees, but those long passes are easier to make with a receiver who consistently gets open deep (and doesn’t lose the ball in the sun). Plus, teams would have to actually focus on covering Jackson. Do you think any d-coordinator is scared of Ginn?
If the 49ers win the SB with this style of football, then why would he change it?
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Because good coaches will always look for ways to get better
If you can add dimensions, you should. But I see your point. Harbaugh wouldn’t change, even if we don’t win the SB.
If the formula is working, you don’t add anything to it… until it stops working, there is no reason to do anything different.
If it stops working, then you add.
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If you are winning games…. and you win the Superbowl based on that formula, changing things could actually hurt your chances of success. You NEVER do something different unless what you are doing stops working.
It’s really a fairly easy concept to grasp.
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the same can be said of
standing pat. There is no cookie-cutter way of sustaining success in the NFL. Aside from a HOF Qb..
Really?
Seems like the Packers are doing it quite well. Giants are in again… Ravens, Patriots and Steelers are in again… etc… all those teams have not overhauled their team philosophies; and none of those quarterbacks are in the Hall of Fame as far as I knew; Brady will be for sure out of all of them… the rest still have a pretty heafty uphill climb to the HOF.
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Well...................
Not entirely accurate. Ravens upgraded at WR Boldin. Steelers traded in H Ward for Mike Wallace. Victor Cruz replaced Steve Smith. So you are correct in not overhauling team philosophies, but you can keep team philosophies with using different players. Personally I think D Bowe would fit well into our team philosophy!!
Complete overhaul...
These are small pieces and upgrades… and they are personnel…NOT philosophy… which is what is being talked about.
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My apologies......
This started talking about D Jax and changing up the game plan a bit, so assumed that was what we were talking about. So you would agree to bring in a FA WR and say draft a CB?
I don't know... I am ton a bit...
I like Crabtree… I think he will for sure get 90 catches and 1,000+ yards with a full season if he stays healthy again.
Williams has big time potential and if he gets more opportunity could wind up being a huge playmaker… better than DJax even because DJax has dropsies issues every now and again… Williams has had 20 catches already in a fairly limited amount of time.
And Morgan was really, really starting to shine at the beginning of the year and come in to his own. If he can get 100% back to normal, I’d really like him to return.
Ginn has got to come back because he simply rocks in special teams… he is good for the locker room and field position.
And that 5th spot doesn’t really warrant a high draft pick… so the best policy would be to get a few UDFA’s and maybe a late round WR… plus bring back Swain and possibly Bogan and have those guys battle it out for that spot.
So long-short of it is no, I don’t think we should spend high this year on a wide receiver and or go get a free agent.
I’d really like to draft another OLB like Brandon Jenkins or someone to go on the other side of Aldon Smith for our 1st…. if he was available of course….
I think Brown has really stepped it up and I like Cully’s potential as well.. maybe in the 2nd or 3rd for a CB just because it is a packed draft class at the position… I think you have to look at the class as a whole and try and balance your needs versus the talent and whoever you have on your own big board.
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Subject line is supposed to say *torn a bit
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I see the miscommunication.
I was actually referring to adding small tweaks and pieces, not an overhaul, that would not be wise..
I beg to differ.
All of these teams have changed personnel, and scheming to the strengths of their current personnel, very frequently. Regardless, I say “cookie-cutter” meaning they don’t all have success the same way or by using the same formula. I threw in HOF QB as a sure-fire way of being consistently successful, never claimed you NEEDED one to find success..
And I never claimed that schemes aren’t adjusted here and there… nor did I claim that teams do not acquire free agents… think that goes without saying…. but we are talking about philosophies … not sure why that is a hard thing to grasp right now…
Steelers for instance, they are balanced on offense for the most part but love and take pride in the power run… it’s been that way since Jerome Bettis (maybe even before) … Defense… they always take pride in their defense and Linebackers… that’s been a fact for ages. And certainly it has not changed much, or if at all, since Tomlin has been there… and that is just one example… all the others I mentioned there have had the same HC’s and kept the same philosophies since they’ve been there. Obviously with coaching and or front office changes, things will adjust…
If you go back to the very top of the post, the comment I responded to was alluding to a complete overhaul of philosophy … my response is that it’s not necessary if we are winning and making the playoffs year in and year out with Superbowl’s and things of that nature.
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so if niners win SB
there is no need to improve personnel or play calling? Okay…
by salary_cap on Jan 5, 2012 5:23 PM PST up reply actions
this is where the conversation turned away from philosophy to personnel and scheming..
you responded with:
If you are winning games…. and you win the Superbowl based on that formula, changing things could actually hurt your chances of success. You NEVER do something different unless what you are doing stops working.
It’s really a fairly easy concept to grasp.
So you can see why everybody is responding this way..
Play-calling would insinuate a philosophy change...
Right???
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LOL!!! Lets clear the air.
We all know what we mean! Minor tweaks and certain personnal changes may be warranted but defintely not a change in philosophy like say lets draft or sign a big name WR and throw the ball 30 times a game.
I will accept tweaks. Tweaks and adjustments happen.
But for those claiming play-calling is a by product of philosophy and don’t realize it’s the other way around…. and by that I mean, philosophy dictating play-calling have really got issues.
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And
/sarcasm
just to make it clear.
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No.
Play-calling is a byproduct of philosophy. Play-calling is dependent on personnel and situations in-game with hopes of adjustments to maximize results. It is derived from certain philosophies, but not philosophies themselves.. Regardless, just admit you misread/assumed wrong instead of trying to be defensive and create a “thing”.
Byproduct? Really?
The two go hand and hand…
A heavy passing team doesn’t just out of the blue start calling a crap load of run plays… don’t try and twist it… you’re the one who’s got it twisted.
I don’t have to admit to ish I am not wrong about…
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How does your example
disprove my point? I don’t think you quite understand what I am trying to say. And please don’t stoop to being childish and petty. You are the most confrontational poster here
Cool story...
I don’t care…
Your comment doesn’t disprove mine either….
Philosophy dictates play calling and I don’t care what you think about me to be quite honest… or anyone else on this board… it’s a frikin blog.
But I have seen enough posts from the original poster to know what the hell he meant by it. I don’t see you around enough here to know what’s up exactly … so in the event that you are uninformed, which I think is the case… you get a pass for lack of knowledge.
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Huh??
Go back to my previous comments.. You know you just agreed with me right? lol. About philosophy being the root of play calling.
Sure I have seen you and salary_cap go at it a lot (I am informed) and its pretty comical, but you got it wrong this time. You were the only one who interpreted that particular comment that way, while Fooch, Johnveeskys, and I saw it for what it was.
by itsAteamGAME on Jan 5, 2012 10:26 PM PST up reply actions
Nah… that is not what he meant. He wants us to get Peyton Manning or Matt Flynn … and turn this team in to some high flying Patriots, Saints, or Packers type of offense… that is what he meant by it.
But think what you want. I know better.
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So this:
so if niners win SB
there is no need to improve personnel or play calling? Okay…
Is not what you think it is, because there are approximately 2,923 comments of his that suggest otherwise.
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In other comments here,
yes, he expressed that. Not in this conversation. Your letting your bias towards him affect how you view the initial comment.
by itsAteamGAME on Jan 5, 2012 10:37 PM PST up reply actions
No... it's not affecting anything.
I knew exactly what he meant by it. It’s ALL he talks about.
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haha ok.
I knew I shouldn’t have jumped in between the two of you! So much history, it’s the oldest NN rivalry!
by itsAteamGAME on Jan 5, 2012 10:41 PM PST up reply actions
Actually it's not...
That award would have gone to drummer and I if he were still around… but I somehow suspect he is still lurking behind a sock puppet or another handle.
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And even that rivalry may not hold the title.
James had some way back in the day when NN was still just a baby.
Anyway, it’s getting away from football talk now… so back on track.
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niners caught lightening in the bottle this regular season
and some breaks along the way to a 13-3 record. They played so many games where they just wanted the clock to run out by the 2nd qtr. Doubt it will happen in the post season, but if it does, I hope it doesn’t reinforce these bad habits.
lightning in a bottle
For now that’s only an opinion. We’ll see how they come back next year.
by David Fucillo on Jan 5, 2012 5:27 PM PST up reply actions
whether they win 13 games next year or not
it’s still the same overrated team if they don’t improve their play on offense.
How can they be "overrated" if they win the same amount of games?
And with a tougher schedule at that?
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overrated
Not sure I agree they’re overrated with that defense and special teams unit. I think you underestimate them in determining the team is overrated.
by David Fucillo on Jan 5, 2012 5:34 PM PST up reply actions
and how great...
the special teams and defense has been. Yes there’s room to improve, but that doesn’t automatically make this team overrated.
by David Fucillo on Jan 5, 2012 5:40 PM PST up reply actions
at 10-6
I wouldn’t call them overrated. But they are the no. 2 seed and arguably have the least upside of all the playoff teams.
least upside?
Given that the offense has shown improvement in the red zone in recent weeks I actually think they have some very solid upside.
by David Fucillo on Jan 5, 2012 5:42 PM PST up reply actions
Really?
Less upside than:
Tebow and Denver?
4th String Delhomme and Texans?
Cincy who hasn’t beaten a winning team?
Affectionately,
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar,
NBA’s All-Time Leading Scorer
by afrikabamboodle on Jan 5, 2012 5:43 PM PST up reply actions
I guess if you meant offensively compared to other NFC teams.
But there’s 3 phases to football and we’re dominant in 2 of them. I like our odds. But I understand your point purely from an offensive standpoint.
Affectionately,
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar,
NBA’s All-Time Leading Scorer
by afrikabamboodle on Jan 5, 2012 5:52 PM PST up reply actions
I wouldn't be upset
at losing to Saints or Giants. They are better teams in my opinion. We’ve overacheived already. I just hope its not a conservative call(s) that prevents us from winning
really?
I’d be pissed if we lose to anyone.
by NinerOptimus on Jan 5, 2012 6:01 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
That's if you base things PURELY off of one aspect of football.
Yes they have better offenses. But most of us are evaluating our 49ers on a complete basis and that includes 3 aspects of football. Offense, Defense, and Special Teams. They may be better than us in 1 aspect, Offense, but we’re superbly better in 2, Defense and Special Teams. 2 > 1 in my book. Therefore we are the better team.
Affectionately,
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar,
NBA’s All-Time Leading Scorer
by afrikabamboodle on Jan 5, 2012 6:06 PM PST up reply actions
r u serious?
Dude we beat the giants, have a first round bye and have 4 more wins than them. How can you possibly say they are better. I like the giants I really do. Its my sons favorite team, but they are wildly inconsistent and have a worse secondary than we do. And we are superior to the saints in every facet except for offense. IMHO we are the very least on the same level as n.o.
by texasniner31 on Jan 5, 2012 9:05 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
Because they pass more than us… anybody who passes the ball more than we do, or throw more long-bombs… in some people’s minds, that makes them better.
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You are confusing fantazy football numbers with mundane
This offense is not mundane. It is well run and efficient.
At least at some point in the season it was leading NFL in yards per point. (and on defense as well – if I remember that was fairly unprecedented for a team to lead on both ends of this statistic) That is actually a very telling stat – used by many professional handicappers.
Here is the final yards per point standing
There is no frigging fluke:
http://www.bettorsworld.com/2011/nfl-playoff-predictions.htm
They lead on both defense and offense.
49ers 13.1 and 22.6 +9.5 +18 10-1 ATS
Packers 11.6 and 18.2 +6.6 +16 8-4 ATS
Patriots 12.4 and 20 +7.6 +8 7-5 ATS
Ravens +14 and +18 +4 +4 7-4 ATS
Bears 13.4 and 17.8 +3.4 +7 6-6 ATS
Saints 13.7 and 16.9 +3.2 -2 8-4 ATS
Titans 15.4 and 18.6 +3.2 +6 6-5 ATS
Texans 14.6 and 17.4 +2.5 +12 8-3 ATS
Jets 12.9 and 14.7 +1.8 even 5-7 ATS
Lions 13.8 and 14.7 +0.9 +5 6-5 ATS
Broncos 14.8 and 15.1 +0.3 -3 7-5 ATS
Steelers 16.5 and 16.8 +0.3 -7 6-6 ATS
Falcons 16.2 and 16.2 even -1 4-6 ATS
But that's a very poor statistic
Because the offense wasn’t leading the NFL in yards per point, the 49ers were.
There are two ways to get a lower yards per point — increase the denominator, score more points, or decrease the numerator, gain less yards. The defense and special teams units can help you out with the numerator — and both of those units for us were the best in the league.
Every time Jamie Dukes says something enlightening and informative about football Jerry Rice and I mount up on our flying grizzly bears and claim pirate treasure from the moon. That's how often it happens.
basically
it’s net starting field position (which includes turnovers/defense/special teams)
[Poorly Wrought THING] is what Brian Sabean would have made if he were a [THING-maker] instead of a MLB GM
Where did I say that the offense was leading anything?
I have said that it is well run and efficient. Yard-per-point, which is indeed an indicator of the overall team performance, prove that. Offense did what it was supposed to do – if they kept turning the ball over it would not have been the case.
..ah.
I see where it was confusing. By “it” I was referring to offensive yard per point.
It is in that context
I thought you were claiming it was a pure function of our offense, instead of a team effort, which makes all the difference.
Every time Jamie Dukes says something enlightening and informative about football Jerry Rice and I mount up on our flying grizzly bears and claim pirate treasure from the moon. That's how often it happens.
I disagree with lightning in a bottle.......
The only stat I will mention is the turnover margain. That is sound football, not lightning in a bottle!!! Taking care of the ball will win games. Hence 13-3 record.
was one of those breaks ronnie brown throwing the ball for no reason when the eagles were on the one yard line?
"And thank you to God for making me an Atheist." - Ricky Gervais
by MichaelClutchtree on Jan 5, 2012 5:30 PM PST up reply actions
The pass was supposed to go to the fullback who was open on the outside.
Our defense stifled him immediately and he was unable to do the Tebow-like jump pass that was called.
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We were winning when that happened.
Do you even remember last season?
"The Harbaughcolypse is upon us. No one in the NFL is safe"
Doesn’t seem like it… “clouds” all the way across the board.
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EVERY team that wins 11, 12, or more games catches breaks.
It happens. So what?
"The Harbaughcolypse is upon us. No one in the NFL is safe"
the good teams always do
You don’t win 13 games by accident. If u think about it, if our offense was even better(which its not near as bad as some like to think) we wouldn’t have lost any games. Deficient offense or not we still won 13 games. We’ve been doing way more things right this year than wrong, and as soon as we get some consistency at wideout the offense will be fine.
by texasniner31 on Jan 5, 2012 8:55 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
15 total point differential.
And a couple of Akers misses would have resulted in 2 more wins probably.
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I disagree
I think the team is open to tinkering with the formula if there are ways to improve. I’d rather have a proactive coach than a reactive coach.
by David Fucillo on Jan 5, 2012 5:27 PM PST up reply actions
proactive vs reactive...
This is a matter of perception… yes, you always want to try and be ahead of the curve. Especially in the NFL…
However, I am from the school of thought in that if it’s not broke, don’t fix it.
And speaking solely on football and the Niners situation… if their style of football is winning games, if we go to a shotgun offense, that’s really going to hinder things… because it goes against the principle of not turning the ball over…
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I'm not saying drastic changes
But there is still room to tinker with these team even if they win the Super Bowl.
by David Fucillo on Jan 5, 2012 5:33 PM PST up reply actions
Sure. I totally get that and agree with it.
But I don’t think that was the premise of the comment I responded to. Just about certain of it.
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splitting hairs?
You may be splitting hairs here…Harbaugh is definitely REACTIVE in that he dictated very little of the active roster and has coached them to success. But maybe they could be more successful when he becomes proactive in deterimining his guys.
Success vs success
We also have to realize at some point that Harbaugh is a rookie coach this season.
Just like the team, if he’s not getting better, then he is getting worse.
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worse?
I agree. if he gets worse it would prob have to be an indictment on the FO and his ability to evaluate the players/talent they want….I don’t see that a problem.
Brady's first SB
They were a conservative O with a good. No turnovers and great DB’s. You always need to look to get better cuz ppl retire or go to other teams. You never know what ur team will look like season after season
by david w gibson on Jan 5, 2012 6:01 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
personnel vs philosophy...
There are points to getting better at both… but not to the extreme on either… Philadelphia Eagles are living proof of that this season.
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So when it stops working during a game you wait until its over to adjust? Good luck with that dumb ass philosophy.
"What the hell are you mixing in that look-aid"
Way to follow the entire string... learn how to read the entire thing before you comment.
I was obviously not talking about in-game adjustments.
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People are just nitpicking at individual points to point out irrelevant arguments.
Clearly the message is simply if we’re a successful power running TE heavy team, why do we need to transition to a high octane spread offense when it’s clearly not our identity. Change for the sake of change is not a good thing.
Affectionately,
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar,
NBA’s All-Time Leading Scorer
by afrikabamboodle on Jan 6, 2012 12:45 AM PST up reply actions
Thank you.
At least one person got it.
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there’s no reason to expect it to turn from a power run game to a spread offense. i never said anything of the sort and didn’t really see anyone else say anything like it either.
there’s a difference between just wanting one receiver who can maybe open up the passing game or wanting a complete spread offense.
i dont see why this idea of possibly having our QB actually throw the ball means we have to change our entire identity. like noted below, it would probably end up like someone like matt ryan, who has a power run game in tuner and a top TE in gonzalez, but has the added reward of julio and roddy. we just need one
"And thank you to God for making me an Atheist." - Ricky Gervais
by MichaelClutchtree on Jan 6, 2012 1:24 AM PST up reply actions
BTW this wasn’t necessarily a dig at alex, it was just a generalization of our entire offense and what i was saying about if our offense is a result of a lack of faith in smith, our receivers, or just harbaugh’s philosophy.
id just like to see us with a QB (whether its smith or someone else) and offense who could utilize our great RBs and TEs as well as possibly open the field with crabtree, KW, morgan, and hopefully another solid #2 or even #1
"And thank you to God for making me an Atheist." - Ricky Gervais
by MichaelClutchtree on Jan 6, 2012 1:28 AM PST up reply actions
But that is the key
If we’re a successful power running TE heavy team.
We aren’t. We’re one of the worst (29th in the league) at successfully running for 2 yards or less on 3rd or 4th down. You can’t be that bad getting the tough yards and call yourself a power running team.
Every time Jamie Dukes says something enlightening and informative about football Jerry Rice and I mount up on our flying grizzly bears and claim pirate treasure from the moon. That's how often it happens.
You're looking in the wrong place.
Five variations of “ZOMG Alex sucks get him out of here” is about the limit. MAYBE six.
"The Harbaughcolypse is upon us. No one in the NFL is safe"
by Blank x2 on Jan 5, 2012 5:11 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
ignore what i say then if you dont like it
"And thank you to God for making me an Atheist." - Ricky Gervais
by MichaelClutchtree on Jan 6, 2012 1:24 AM PST up reply actions
its why i dont really pay much attention to blank’s comments because almost everything is blind unabashed defending/praise for alex smith, as im sure he doesnt read my comments because its criticism of him/the offensive philosophy
"And thank you to God for making me an Atheist." - Ricky Gervais
by MichaelClutchtree on Jan 6, 2012 1:26 AM PST up reply actions
If that's what you think.....
you DEFINITELY don’t read my comments. At all.
I’d love to know where I’ve blindly defended and praised Smith. All I’ve done is say you and some others are WAY WAY WAY too harsh and critical, and at times you do it when it has NOTHING to do with Alex. His mistakes are down, he protects the ball better, and is generally playing better football than he has since we drafted him.
I’m sorry that I see an improvement this year and you don’t. He’s no where near elite, and is still average, but you can’t give the guy credit ever on anything. And PLEASE don’t sit here and try to claim that you aleays criticize the entire offense as much as you do Smith. GO READ THE FIRST TWO COMMENTS ON THIS THREAD ABOUT WRs. Yeah, you never just bash Alex. LoL. What a joke.
So pay attention before you start trying to claim what I’m saying for me. Thanks so much.
"The Harbaughcolypse is upon us. No one in the NFL is safe"
because he has no one who can go deep
Hard to throw deep to slow recievers
by texasniner31 on Jan 5, 2012 9:33 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
Wow Michael Silver got pissed off at John Herrera
I don’t blame him. Herrera should not lie to the press. The Raiders are a joke.
If you're watching a blowout, you can pass the time by counting the double teapots.
Samurai Champloo > Macross
The Falcons have 2 GREAT deep threats in Roddy White and Julio Jones.
In fact they mortgaged their future for Jones and as a result had a worse defense (lack of young and new talent), a barely improved offense and actually won even less games this year than the year before. A WR is only as good as the QB and the coordinator who uses them both. We have AleX Smith (whom I love) and an offense built on running and TE’s as the main vertical threat. Definitely don’t want a FA to come in here and command a large contract. Any WR we pick up should be from the draft.
Affectionately,
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar,
NBA’s All-Time Leading Scorer
Crabtree better really step it up next season ... if he doesn't, he can go after his contract is up.
He did much better this year when healthy, but if it’s not an arrow up, and this is all we get from him, I’d be down to upgrade at the No. 1 or No. 2…
But I think Williams could be that number one based on where I believe his ceiling is at. Think we are just seeing the beginning of (soon to be) one of the leagues best playmakers.
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This
You know I agree
We're as good as we play each week, no better, no worse.
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by Tre9er on Jan 5, 2012 5:17 PM PST via Android app up reply actions
I can’t wait to see him (hopefully) shred these playoffs up. Gotta get him going somehow… If they give him enough cushion, he could make someone pay… if they are playing up, he has the speed to get over the top.
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He's not very fast but he has a solid set of paws and has been clutch in some crucial moments.
He’s def a good go-to on 3rd downs.
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No he's not.
Morgan was pretty clutch when he was playing, and Williams has come up with some pretty clutch grabs, not only on 3rd’s, but in the RZ a couple times as well. He has 4 TD’s in a very limited time playing… all the dude does is make the most out of his opportunities. If he had as many as Crabs, he would probably be better.
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Morgan is not playing
and the term “go-to” is kind of dumb anyways. We shouldn’t be using it since. What does it even mean? Ever QB has a “go-to” guy. Whether that guy is any good or not is a different story.
Hence the "go-to" on 3rd down... was pretty specific with the term.
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He doesn't need top end speed.
His acceleration is what makes him dangerous. I remember reading some Walsh guide to drafting/evaluating players and what was important was how fast someone got to “full stride speed” as Walsh put it. Jerry didn’t have top end speed but once he got to “full stride speed” faster than anyone else and once he was at “full stride speed” no one was going to catch him.
Affectionately,
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar,
NBA’s All-Time Leading Scorer
by afrikabamboodle on Jan 5, 2012 5:31 PM PST up reply actions
This
Rice wasn’t a burner
We're as good as we play each week, no better, no worse.
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by Tre9er on Jan 5, 2012 8:17 PM PST via Android app up reply actions
With the Kyle Williams part
We're as good as we play each week, no better, no worse.
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by Tre9er on Jan 5, 2012 5:18 PM PST via Android app up reply actions
we know
I’m new to posting, but been looking around for quite a while. Seen you sing Williams’ praises for a long time.
I think he’s got a lot of talent and upside, don’t see him as a number 1 though. Similar to how I see Crabtree. With a true double coverage earning no. 1 recever they’d both be setup.
i see it the other way
We haven’t been deep at wr in years hence the lack of production. Singletary accidentally drafted crabs when he was gifted to us, otherwise we would still be woefully average at the position
by texasniner31 on Jan 5, 2012 9:17 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
Reggie Wayne...wouldnt mind him
"I hate it! It looks like a stickup at 7-Eleven. Five guys standing there with their hands in the air."
Norm Sloan
"We have a great bunch of outside shooters. Unfortunately, all our games are played indoors."
Weldon Drew
by EcERyda69 on Jan 5, 2012 4:25 PM PST via mobile reply actions
I would still like them to draft one in the first 2 rounds if one is around
"I hate it! It looks like a stickup at 7-Eleven. Five guys standing there with their hands in the air."
Norm Sloan
"We have a great bunch of outside shooters. Unfortunately, all our games are played indoors."
Weldon Drew
by EcERyda69 on Jan 5, 2012 4:26 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
Just out of curiosity while we are on the WR topic.
Who would you guys rank as the top 3 WR in the league this year? You can base your rankings on stats, who they are catching from, intangible contributions etc.
My ranking would be:
Larry Fitz
Calvin Johnson
Victor Cruz
Affectionately,
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar,
NBA’s All-Time Leading Scorer
I would have liked to include Andre as well but he's missed too many games for my liking.
Solid group nonetheless.
Affectionately,
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar,
NBA’s All-Time Leading Scorer
by afrikabamboodle on Jan 5, 2012 4:29 PM PST up reply actions
No not period
I love Andre. But it is very easy to make a case for any 3 of em.
Andre
Calvin
Larry
Attack this day with an enthusiasm unknown to mankind. ~ Jack Harbaugh
Larry Fitzgerald is the best WR in football…..period.
Then Calvin
Then Andre
"And thank you to God for making me an Atheist." - Ricky Gervais
by MichaelClutchtree on Jan 5, 2012 7:20 PM PST up reply actions
Those three are interchangeable.
Those three, then everybody else. AJ Green will join them in a few years.
"The Harbaughcolypse is upon us. No one in the NFL is safe"
Fitzgerald is #3. megatron 2 A Johnson 1
Fitzgerald doesn’t possess their speed and they both can do what he does.
"What the hell are you mixing in that look-aid"
Ummmm no... maybe Calvin can but not Johnson
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Next years free agent list looking kind of skimpy:
http://www.kffl.com/static/nfl/features/freeagents/fa.php?option=WR&y=2012
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There's a couple...
But being that there is only a couple, they’re gonna get overpaid
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"Overpaid"
is relative… if you have the money, cap space, need… and he fills it to a T
Dunno… I think our F.O. would rather draft a rookie or two instead of going out and getting the big-named players.
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Depends on where they throw the picks
If the first few picks go to other needs, they may fill the WR with free agency
Ain't gonna happen...
I doubt Kyle Orton is the answer…and he is just about the only one that will be out there worth a damn.
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How in the hell do you KNOW Flynn is anything?
Manning (IF 100% ZERO NECK ISSUES) better than 95% of the quarterbacks in the NFL… but again, flawed for this system. Would have to change the playbook if we got him.
And Orton is not really an improvement over Smith… turnover machine.
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I don't know how good or Flynn might be
I have an idea though. And I do know who Alex Smith is. We have a large sample size from him
Yet you don't know anything about Kaepernick either and that hasn't stopped you from bashing him.
Let me get this straight then: You want some Green Bay Packer guy that plays virtually in spread offense to come get behind center and our offensive line, in our offensive system, and some how plant some sort of magical bean in S.F. and climb the metaphorical bean stock to the top?
Dude, get on your unicorn and ride away with that dream theory.
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I know something about Kaep
I know more about Flynn. We’ve been over this. Nobody in NFL or outside of it, besides you maybe, would rather have Kaep over Flynn, all things being equal ($$$ etc.)
Sample size is a HUGE factor in both or either equations.
You really don’t know enough about either…. even you should know that much.
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I watched Flynn his whole senior year in college.
52ish percent comp percentage and not even a 2:1 TD-INT ratio doesn’t scream “franchise”.
Said it before, there’s a reason he fell to the 7th round. Dude will end up being more Kolb than Schuab if he goes from back up to payday.
"The Harbaughcolypse is upon us. No one in the NFL is safe"
Exactly.
He screams Matt Cassel/Kevin Kolb to me.
Affectionately,
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar,
NBA’s All-Time Leading Scorer
by afrikabamboodle on Jan 5, 2012 6:41 PM PST up reply actions
Would be a horrible idea to pay him what teams will be willing to.
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Or a million other busts you never heard of.
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One exception is just a proof of a the rule.
You do not build strategy on outliers. Its dumb.
This
taking one exception to a rule doesn’t change a rule. That’s why it’s the EXCEPTION.
"The Harbaughcolypse is upon us. No one in the NFL is safe"
Montana, Brees, Schaub, there are tons of QB's taken in other rounds than 1st that pan out. Maybe not 7th but,
The Packers staff molded Rodgers, do you think they are playing hop skotch with FLynn??
Get real and get over it, Kolb and Cassell never put up those numbers.
"What the hell are you mixing in that look-aid"
Not 7th is the key.
Good QB prospects do not go in the 7th, and the odds of a not so good prospect being molded into something are prohibitively slim. Definitely slim enough not to be overturned by ONE game. Give him half a season to see if a miracle indeed occurred.
People who know football.
Drafted Flynn in 7th and traded up to take Kaep in 2nd.
There is a really, really good reason for such a discrepancy.
are you saying kaepernick is better because he was drafted in a higher round?
are you f***ing serious right now
"And thank you to God for making me an Atheist." - Ricky Gervais
by MichaelClutchtree on Jan 5, 2012 7:49 PM PST up reply actions
Fact
Alex Smith > Tom Brady.
Attack this day with an enthusiasm unknown to mankind. ~ Jack Harbaugh
Face it.
Flynn is average. At best.
I was force fed his games while at LSU. Serviceable, but nobody to get excited about. Kaep will be as good or better IMHO.
"The Harbaughcolypse is upon us. No one in the NFL is safe"
A guy has one 400 game on a SB team
And everyone all of the sudden goes ape shit over him.
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-100 yards on a dump off that Ryan Grant took all the way too.
And add a clumsy fumble in the 1st minute of the game due to poor ball handling.
No thanks.
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With his mechanics, hes gonna be more accurate than Alrx, wherever he goes.
Alex hasn’t had one game where he’s looked that good.
"What the hell are you mixing in that look-aid"
Only if his mechanics weren't crap on stick.
And his clumsy play in the small sample size he has had.
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So yeah...
Let’s pay the guy 65 million dollars based on 1 good game and potential mechanics… makes total sense.
I can’t believe what I see on this board sometimes.
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I wouldn't pay him 40 million, but I do think he will be a good QB.
"What the hell are you mixing in that look-aid"
Alex fundamentals are just fine.
He can make all the throws and runs even after years of film on him.
He has poor mechanics, he doesn't have the bend in one of his legs, I believe the plant leg, in which balls tend to sail when you have this problem.
What’s his MO, throws high too often, so I guess Jaworski knows more about his mechanics than you Homer.
"What the hell are you mixing in that look-aid"
He hasn't been sailing passes in a good while now.
Beginning of the year, yeah… but not lately or recently.
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No he does not.
He can make every throw and he is a starting QB for your San Francisco 49rs. That is a much bigger endorsement that a single talking head sounding off.
Exactly the opposite.
I am saying that Kaepernick was drafted in higher round because he is better.
Causality. Serious stuff.
not really a good sample
We have Smith’s rookie and sophomore, and this year. Every other season he was either injured or second string and played sparingly. When he has played a full season(only twice) he has been fine.
by texasniner31 on Jan 5, 2012 9:39 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
Prorated to 16 games
Orton had 18 TDs, 18 INTS… That the guy you want over Smith? The 3 years before that he threw 20 and 9, 21 and 21 and 12 and 18 and 12. His best year ever he threw twice as many picks as Smith.
Orton = Quality backup, starter if you have no other options.
And as I said the biding wars aren't our thing
We're as good as we play each week, no better, no worse.
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by Tre9er on Jan 5, 2012 5:19 PM PST via Android app up reply actions
Receivers like Colston are the ones I worry about.
Brees hurts his stock just as much as he helps it in my eyes. Not sure how he fares without one of the best QBs in the league.
Affectionately,
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar,
NBA’s All-Time Leading Scorer
by afrikabamboodle on Jan 5, 2012 4:31 PM PST up reply actions
Resign Morgan and Ginn for return duties.
We also need to get a big redzone threat like Dwayne Bowe. Though, he’d probably be expensive. If not Bowe, there’s not really anyone else in free agency I’d like to get. So if we don’t get him we need to get a WR in the draft. Maybe Kendall Wright.
Crabtree
Bowe
Williams
Morgan
Ginn
Bogan
There's no way we could get Bowe.
Especially after the year he has had.
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way I see it
Crabtree
high round draft pick
Morgan
Williams
Ginn
We’ll have 3 TEs for sure under Harbaugh, so unlikely we’ll carry more than 5 WRs
Either Bowe or a high draft pick.
Ya we’ll probably keep 5 WR’s. So I’d put Bogan on the practice squad.
I just don't see our FO going to the FA
unless they can get Bowe for less than he’s worth, which is very unlikely
big time = big attitude
I don’t know if that would work with the current locker room character…Colston’s prob the best FA fit for that reason.
Team football is much more effective.
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49ers football
team football yes, but they’ve got some significant big time players as part of that team.
by David Fucillo on Jan 5, 2012 5:52 PM PST up reply actions
Who?
There’s like three teams mentioned in this string haha
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not so sure
Davis pre-benching yes, Crabtree prior to this season – yes, but really to me it seems the better the player the more down to earth their character. See Gore, Willis, J Smith. Seems like a really solid locker room….at least from the outside. I think Goldson is probably the biggest “me” on the team.
I will say I am happy for Clements, seeing his interview after the Bengals made the playoffs was pretty cool.
He was never as good as how much he was paid and never as bad as the fans thought.
Attack this day with an enthusiasm unknown to mankind. ~ Jack Harbaugh
Lawson/ Clements/ and Mays... all going to the playoffs too.
I’m actually happy for them.
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How crazy would it be
If the Niners beat the Bengal in the SB
meant to say
how crazy would it be if it’s the Niners and Bengals in the SB
And Abrayo F
I think TKO Spikes i the only 2010 9er not going to the playoffs. Sad.
Meh
Screw Abrayo haha… just ‘cause we’ll probably have to face him.
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Laboy
We're as good as we play each week, no better, no worse.
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by Tre9er on Jan 5, 2012 8:20 PM PST via Android app up reply actions
Cant see Williams that low on the depth chart with what he has shown.
High Rd. draft pick would be the guy lower more than likely.
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It's a depth web, not a depth chart
If we draft a second round pick, big jump ball receiver, williams splits #3 duties with morgan.
Sorry but Williams is #2/#3
To me this is clear
We're as good as we play each week, no better, no worse.
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by Tre9er on Jan 5, 2012 5:20 PM PST via Android app up reply actions
What do y'all think about John Carlson
Seahawks TE. Will be a FA next year. They got Zach Miller now. Maybe he’d be better than a FA WR for the 49ers?
Jimmy Raye sighting:
He’s the offensive coordinator of the white team in the HS All-America game on ESPN right now.
All Star coaching staff right there.
Affectionately,
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar,
NBA’s All-Time Leading Scorer
by afrikabamboodle on Jan 5, 2012 5:31 PM PST up reply actions
Spending a 1st round pick on a WR
In my opinion, there are only between 1-3 WRs that come out each year that are clearly going to be stars, or have a tremendous chance at success. You see it with Calvin Johnson out of Georgia Tech. More recently, Julio Jones and AJ Green. Heck, at the time of the draft, I would include Crabtree on that list. Those guys, in the top-10, it might be worth it spending your first round pick.
After that, I think it’s a crapshoot. A superstar WR might emerge in the 5th round, just as likely as at the end of the 1st. I wouldn’t spend our first round pick on a WR. I’m guessing Golston will be gone, so I would personally go after a safety, if there is an elite one, with that #1 Niners pick.
On that note, I couldn’t be happier that, for once this decade, we aren’t in full-blown draft mode! I’m so happy to be picking at the end of the first round (especially if it’s 32nd!!)
WRs
This year the draft its full of large but slower guys, not fast big dominant guys
We're as good as we play each week, no better, no worse.
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by Tre9er on Jan 5, 2012 5:22 PM PST via Android app up reply actions
no, no!!
Jeffreys is a burner; he can fly!! Floyd on the other hand is a beast not as fast as the other two but he demanded double coverage in college….
Niners,Nets,Reds & USC!!!
The Most Interesting Man In The World---->Mikhail Prokhorov!!!
by Kidd2Petrovic on Jan 5, 2012 6:38 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
Jeffery Carries a burner around with him so he can eat at any time
If you look at how fat he got
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by Tre9er on Jan 5, 2012 8:23 PM PST via Android app up reply actions
His head grew like O.J. Simpson and Barry Bonds's...
Wonder if he is juicing.
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He has moobs and a keg
We're as good as we play each week, no better, no worse.
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by Tre9er on Jan 5, 2012 8:27 PM PST via Android app up reply actions
Then maybe he stopped haha … what was the dude on Fight Club’s name? That’s Jeffery’s new nickname whatever it was.
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"His name......
was Robert Paulson."
Or just “Bob”. Bob had bitch tits.
"The Harbaughcolypse is upon us. No one in the NFL is safe"
Have you seen that guy recently?
He lost like 3/4 of his weight. He weighs like 185 pounds. Doesn’t even remotely look like the same human being.
"The Harbaughcolypse is upon us. No one in the NFL is safe"
Here. Just because I thought about it....THAT is Billy Bob from Varsity Blues
"The Harbaughcolypse is upon us. No one in the NFL is safe"
Many of the guys this year are bigger and not burners
There are a few exceptions
We're as good as we play each week, no better, no worse.
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by Tre9er on Jan 5, 2012 8:21 PM PST via Android app up reply actions
Def not Rd 1...
Unless of course out of some crazy craziness Blackmon fell.
But, seriously I think our depth at WR is pretty good. If you sign a high profile FA then he’ll expect the ball as a priority option, which I don’t think fits with this teams attitude/character. Colston seems like the best FA fit for this reason.
I like the idea of finding depth/competition for the WR position in the late rounds though.
Maybe we offer the world for Calvin Johnson
so we don’t need a good QB to move the ball. We could just throw jump balls when we need to drive!
We do need a good QB
Fortunately we have one in Alex. I do agree with the need to upgrade at WR though.
id definitely like to upgrade at WR and maybe get a true #1 (i consider clutchtree a #2 or 1.5) if i knew that i could trust the QB to have the ability or be given the opportunity to throw to him and not be forced or choose to throw dumpoffs all the time
wouldnt that be fantastic if we signed someone like bowe and all of a sudden be become a strong passing offense
"And thank you to God for making me an Atheist." - Ricky Gervais
by MichaelClutchtree on Jan 5, 2012 5:33 PM PST reply actions
A true Number 1 WR would open up the offense
I understand the frustrations with the short yardage plays but how do we know Harbaugh isn’t being conservative because our receivers can’t get open deep consistently? It seems to me that at least a few times each game Alex looks to throw deep but has to go to the other reads. We also dont have a receiver that take a short pass and turn it into a long gain consistently ala Jerry Rice or Victor Cruz this season.
how do we know Harbaugh isn’t being conservative because our receivers can’t get open deep consistently?
thats the question. but is harbs playing conservative cause he knows our WRs arent skilled enough, because he wants to rely on lack of TOs and our defense, or because he doesnt think alex is capable
"And thank you to God for making me an Atheist." - Ricky Gervais
by MichaelClutchtree on Jan 5, 2012 5:53 PM PST up reply actions
That's a good question
However, given his public support of Alex I would wager that he believes Alex is capable.
well he’s obviously not gonna say right before the playoffs that he want to get rid of our starting QB
"And thank you to God for making me an Atheist." - Ricky Gervais
by MichaelClutchtree on Jan 5, 2012 5:57 PM PST up reply actions
True
But he didn’t have to say anything at all. The fact that he did I think is a vote of confidence.
Need All-22 tape to see
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by Tre9er on Jan 5, 2012 8:25 PM PST via Android app up reply actions
Bowe would be great.
Bowe, Crabtree, Morgan, Williams, Ginn, with VD and Delanie? Yes please.
Then use our earliest picks on CB and OL (IMO).
"The Harbaughcolypse is upon us. No one in the NFL is safe"
we just need to make sure our QB is willing/able/allowed to throw to them
"And thank you to God for making me an Atheist." - Ricky Gervais
by MichaelClutchtree on Jan 5, 2012 5:57 PM PST up reply actions
I agree
don’t waste $$ on a big time WR if you are going to maintain this underwhelming, ultra conservative offensive philosophy.
Agree, but
The more we run this system under Alex with an actual offseason and such, it will improve. Harbaugh actually having an offseason for him and his staff to teach the schemes and fundamentals will improve everything.
If Alex can’t improve after having the practice time he didn’t get this year, I’ll be with you and Clutch saying its time for him to go. But that time this coming offseason will do wonders for everyone on the offense IMO. I honestly think that’s the biggest reason for the careful and conservative offense this year. It’ll open up a lot after a TRUE offseason.
"The Harbaughcolypse is upon us. No one in the NFL is safe"
Bowe is the only one that makes sense...
I just think people will be asking too much… Maybe Vincent Jackson but he kinda strikes me as too Braylon Edwardsy.
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agree on jackson
I think he is a little overrated and would fit in anyway
by texasniner31 on Jan 5, 2012 10:01 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
Is there any AJ Green caliber WR in the upcoming draft
that we can trade all our picks for, well not all all, but a few (could be worth it)
Blackmon but he's not going to be AJ Green in the NFL.
But that would cost everything because he’s probably going 2nd or 3rd.
No.
I would assume the top 2 WR this year are Blackmon and Jeffries. Blackmon should go top 10-15 and Jeffries is projected in the 20s. And there is no WR out there we should be trading all of our picks for. Almost never.
Affectionately,
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar,
NBA’s All-Time Leading Scorer
by afrikabamboodle on Jan 5, 2012 5:45 PM PST up reply actions
I'm sure Blackmon goes top 10 at the very least, but I went with the safe route :P
Affectionately,
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar,
NBA’s All-Time Leading Scorer
by afrikabamboodle on Jan 5, 2012 5:50 PM PST up reply actions
Yeah
Not really excited about our guys having to matchup with Bradford-Blackmon-Jackson twice a year
I don't believe Blackmon will be THAT dominant of a receiver.
He’s 6’1’’ 215 and doesn’t have elite speed. Has good hands and is a physical receiver who is best in space and can juke and stiff arm his way for YAC. Also a Biletnikoff award winner….. Michael Crabtree anyone?
Affectionately,
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar,
NBA’s All-Time Leading Scorer
by afrikabamboodle on Jan 5, 2012 5:55 PM PST up reply actions
to your point
I thought I heard him and Crabtree only two-time Biletnikoff Award winners ever…I think he could be pretty dominant though.
If Crabtree were super dominant, I would agree as well.
But they are a bit too similar to say one will be dominant and one won’t be. I don’t see Crabtree becoming a perennial All Pro so I can’t say I’d see Blackmon becoming one either. But of course…. you never know :P
Affectionately,
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar,
NBA’s All-Time Leading Scorer
by afrikabamboodle on Jan 5, 2012 6:02 PM PST up reply actions
I don't see Blackmon turning into a top WR in the league.
And I’m not at all concerned about Jackson or Bradford.
Both will climb
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by Tre9er on Jan 5, 2012 8:27 PM PST via Android app up reply actions
Could probably find one in the draft but doesn' t have to be in the 1st round
Always those diamonds in the rough that people overlook. Hopefully our scouting department are on it.
Voted to have best scout by one group. Will be fine
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by Tre9er on Jan 5, 2012 8:29 PM PST via Android app up reply actions
Michael Floyd may be worth if it he slides down to us.
I also like Notre Dame’s TE, Tyler Eifert… maybe back to back picks for us 1st and 2nd Rd.
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ANOTHER TE?!?!?!!??!?
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by MichaelClutchtree on Jan 5, 2012 6:05 PM PST up reply actions
Yeah
I think he can be better than Walker… he is more like a Gronk type of player… just think he and Vernon would be pretty leathal… assuming he panned out like I think he can.
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he is more like a Gronk type of player
id like to see what kind of TE gronk would be like without brady throwing to him
would probably be like vernon davis’s position here i assume
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by MichaelClutchtree on Jan 5, 2012 6:08 PM PST up reply actions
Only catching more passes than he drops unlike Vernon.
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Not inconceivable that Vernon isn't around forever.
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by Tre9er on Jan 5, 2012 8:30 PM PST via Android app up reply actions
Particularly if he continues to drop passes on a regular basis as frequently as he has been.
Maybe there has been too much blocking for him this year opposed to others because I cannot remember a season since he has been here that he has dropped as many as he has this year.
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he's playing softer too. He's definitely a WR in a TE's body.
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I approve your message of Malcolm Floyd...lol
Anyone that can get double team coverage week-in, week-out in BIG TIME college football & still produce gets my attention!! Now obviously he’s no saint, but look @ his #‘s it doesn’t matter what QB ND put back there he still “balled out”!!
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by Kidd2Petrovic on Jan 5, 2012 6:45 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
yes sir thank you for correcting my typo....
I’m thinking of sooo many WR’s right now; SF has endless possibilities
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by Kidd2Petrovic on Jan 6, 2012 7:04 AM PST up reply actions
Is Larry Fitz up for grabs this year?
If so, maybe we can trade him for Rachal, Peele, Norris and a 6th round draft pick or something.
No.
The Cardinals locked him up for a LONG time.
Affectionately,
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar,
NBA’s All-Time Leading Scorer
by afrikabamboodle on Jan 5, 2012 5:57 PM PST up reply actions
hey come on, who do you think we are? giving up norris just makes the offer way too steep for us
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by MichaelClutchtree on Jan 5, 2012 5:58 PM PST up reply actions
People just don’t understand that when they throw Norris in these crazy trades it actually decreases value…
Attack this day with an enthusiasm unknown to mankind. ~ Jack Harbaugh
i know right
i think rachal, peele, and a 6th would be plenty for fitzgerald. maybe throw in philip adams to be sure
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by MichaelClutchtree on Jan 5, 2012 6:01 PM PST up reply actions
Andy Lee straight up for Fitzgerald.
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reported this post to fooch, enjoy your upcoming ban
"And thank you to God for making me an Atheist." - Ricky Gervais
by MichaelClutchtree on Jan 5, 2012 6:12 PM PST up reply actions 2 recs
HAHA
Affectionately,
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar,
NBA’s All-Time Leading Scorer
by afrikabamboodle on Jan 5, 2012 6:12 PM PST up reply actions
I think we're going to get a lot of calls this offseason
inquiring about Bowman. He could fetch us a very nice play maker if the team were willing to part with him.
Affectionately,
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar,
NBA’s All-Time Leading Scorer
well think about it
if he keeps up this production, we’d likely have to be paying him and willis huge contracts. is it really worth it to have 2 stud MLBs like that when we could expend one for an upgrade somewhere (maybe DE to replace justin smith) and still have larry grant who played well in his place?
"And thank you to God for making me an Atheist." - Ricky Gervais
by MichaelClutchtree on Jan 5, 2012 6:22 PM PST up reply actions
im not saying its even feasbile to do so. just wondering
"And thank you to God for making me an Atheist." - Ricky Gervais
by MichaelClutchtree on Jan 5, 2012 6:24 PM PST up reply actions
Larry Grant is a free agent next season.
Besides, as long as Fangio and Harbaugh are there, I really doubt they would be willing to part with Bowman.
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- contact teams that bowman is available (dont make it public)
- see who bites
- if we get a great offer, trade him and sign larry grant to an extension
- if not, do nothing
HOW CAN IT GO WRONG
"And thank you to God for making me an Atheist." - Ricky Gervais
by MichaelClutchtree on Jan 5, 2012 6:27 PM PST up reply actions
We would only get draft picks for Bowman though.
Doesn’t make sense… you already have a proven and we don’t have all that many people to replace next year. Continuity is important for NFL teams.
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Grant is good but he’s not Bowman who is arguably the second best ILB in the game right now and no worst than top 5.
Bowman...
He may not be top 5 yet, but he is on his way.
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Here's 10:
1- Patrick Willis
2 – Jon Beason
3 – Ray Lewis
4 – London Fletcher
5 – Chad Greenway
6 – D’Quell Jackson
7 – Curtis Lofton
8 – James Lauranitis
9 – Derrick Johnson
10 – Pat Angerer
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1- Patrick Willis
2 – Jon Beason
2b – Bowman
4 – London Fletcher
5 – Derrick Johnson
6 – Ray Lewis
7-J.Vilma
8– D’Quell Jackson
9– Curtis Lofton
10- Sean Lee
HM- D.Ryan
Not yet.
No way is Bowman as good as Beason yet.
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No no no...
You have not seen the guy play if you honestly believe that. Bowman is on his way but has not arrived yet. He still makes a lot of rookiesh mistakes.
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Beason isn't a slouch.
He did steal away 1 First Team All Pro from our very own Willis.
Affectionately,
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar,
NBA’s All-Time Leading Scorer
by afrikabamboodle on Jan 5, 2012 7:04 PM PST up reply actions
okay, your homerism is a little too much now
"And thank you to God for making me an Atheist." - Ricky Gervais
by MichaelClutchtree on Jan 5, 2012 7:19 PM PST up reply actions
Pat Angerer?
Seriously? He’s a product of a lot of Defensive plays, a below average DL, and tons of runs winding out the clock coming his way. Not even close to top 10. Other than that Greenway is prob too high in my opionion, but overall I think you’re right….Bowman is young and trending up, but he’s got work to do to be a solid Top 10.
49ers FO tried going silent with Taylor Mays!!
Look how that turned out….
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by Kidd2Petrovic on Jan 5, 2012 6:48 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
Well
The thing is having two ILB’s with the ability to stay on the field all downs gives the defense so much more flexibility. Between Dobbs and RJF, the Niners have their Smith replacment
I really think Dobbs has a really legitimate shot at it.
Especially if Tomsula is the guy that keeps developing him for the next year or two.
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RJF is a solid back up and good special teams contributor.
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RJF
Dude has talent, similar to RayMac before this season. When he has played he has held his own and there was no slip defensively.
I want to get Kwame Geathers out of Georgia to be Sopoaga's successor in a couple years.
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Or this guy out of Kent State just because he has a cool name:
Ishmaa’ily Kitchen
The Fridge? Forget the Fridge.. we have the whole Kitchen
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Needs size for sure
Saw him on field last week. Size of 7 technique right now
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by Tre9er on Jan 5, 2012 8:34 PM PST via Android app up reply actions
I feel like he was heavier in preseason after I saw him on the sidelines a few weeks ago.
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he looks incredibly long right now.
He needs the offseason program and lots of food
We're as good as we play each week, no better, no worse.
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Bowman is not going anywhere.
It’s too bad we didn’t lock up Grant for longer though.
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Not saying the team is going to trade him,
But he would definitely be a very enticing player to go for if a team is LB needly like the Eagles or Lions. I definitely would not want him to leave but I wouldn’t be surprised if he’s constantly being mentioned in trades.
Affectionately,
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar,
NBA’s All-Time Leading Scorer
by afrikabamboodle on Jan 5, 2012 6:25 PM PST up reply actions
bowman and alex smith for calvin johnson and stafford
make it happen
"And thank you to God for making me an Atheist." - Ricky Gervais
by MichaelClutchtree on Jan 5, 2012 6:26 PM PST up reply actions
Trades rarely happen in the NFL (player for player)
Usually, if a trade IS even made, it’s typically done for draft picks.
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If a lesser team like say the Bills,
who will probably pick top 15 or higher on a fairly consistent basis, offer you Stevie Johnson and a 1st rounder, do you swap for Bowman? Just curious. Personally I wouldn’t.
Affectionately,
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar,
NBA’s All-Time Leading Scorer
by afrikabamboodle on Jan 5, 2012 6:33 PM PST up reply actions
First team that popped in my mind for some reason.
A guess Bills and lesser team is practically synonymous at this point hahah. Anyway yes you’re correct.
Affectionately,
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar,
NBA’s All-Time Leading Scorer
by afrikabamboodle on Jan 5, 2012 6:37 PM PST up reply actions
Thing is, it rarely is a reality that things like that happen.
I cannot even recall the last time an actual player was traded during the draft.
And if that hypothetical were realistic, I would decline.
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Oakland trade for Campbell...
would be the highest profile draft day trade in recent memory.
Nope!!!
Bowman and Willis complement each others skills so well and it gives the Niners a unmatched duo upfront. Grant, who has probably better instincts than Willis doesn’t have the speed to make the plays Willis does. Bowman has the instincts and speed and that’s why he’s so valuable. He’s what Willis and Grant would be if they did the fusion dance.
BOWMAN FOR JAIRUS BYRD AND SWAP SECOND ROUNDERS
"And thank you to God for making me an Atheist." - Ricky Gervais
by MichaelClutchtree on Jan 5, 2012 6:42 PM PST up reply actions
The only way it make sense to trade Bowman is if
The Niners are able to move up in the first and get an extra 2nd. That way they could take Vontaze Burfict before the Ravens and still take a WR in the second.
Burfict is a penalty machine and plays undisciplined, selfish football.
And I actually like ASU a lot.
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I know but the same was said about Brooks.
In a lockeroom with Willis, Cowboy, Gore, Staley, Rodgers, Whitner and Davis……I think he’d be alright. Too much talent and on this team paired with Smith outside and Bowman and Willis inside……nasty.
Burfict is a penalty machine and plays undisciplined, selfish football.
So the raiders are drafting him in the first round right
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by MichaelClutchtree on Jan 5, 2012 7:18 PM PST up reply actions
If they had a 1st rounder it wouldn't shock me.
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yall would be crazy to split them
Bowman and Willis are beasts and its my hunch the FO finds a way. They didn’t give up a 100 yard rusher or td for 15 games guys, and those 2 were big reasons why. And they are both young. Lunacy letting either go
by texasniner31 on Jan 5, 2012 10:19 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
moot point
Larry Grant won’t be back with the 49ers after his ridiculous 3 game stretch. You can’t tell me that Grant isn’t getting a big money contract in Philly next year.
Larry Grant may be our version of Kevin Kolb...
The only difference is Grant will probably produce wherever he goes… I would really hate for him to go to a division rival…
Pete Carroll will prob swoop in on him as he does all our former players.
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Wish the FO had signed him to multi-year contract
Grant would be worth so much right now on the trading block. 2nd round pick at least.
Crabtree and Williams
Crabtree on another team is probably a top 15 wideout. Since the bye Crabtree has been pretty darn good and consistent. Another year in this system for Alex and I think everyone’s numbers go up. I don’t think it’s a coincidence that when Crabtree finally was able to go full speed in practice his production went up. The Wild Card is Williams! If Williams plays well in the playoffs I doubt the Niners go after a FA. If I’m the Niners I’m thinking if I bring in a FA guy to go with Crabtree and Morgan what do I do with Williams and how do we develop him as a #4? You really can’t unless there is an injury so I see the Niners standing pat and drafting WR in the mid rounds to be the guy they develop rather than forcing Williams back to the sidelines.
ESPN reporting O'Brien got the PSU job.
Attack this day with an enthusiasm unknown to mankind. ~ Jack Harbaugh
damn, first he loses the tonight show now he gets this?
"And thank you to God for making me an Atheist." - Ricky Gervais
by MichaelClutchtree on Jan 5, 2012 7:17 PM PST up reply actions 2 recs
Literally LoLed
They should have just handed it to Leno on a platter.
"The Harbaughcolypse is upon us. No one in the NFL is safe"
Landry Jones is staying in school.
Affectionately,
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar,
NBA’s All-Time Leading Scorer
Sucks for the 'Fins and Seahawks....
That QB well is drying up faster the a hoochie’s coochie.
No, that sucks for Oklahoma, Landry Jones is terrible.
Attack this day with an enthusiasm unknown to mankind. ~ Jack Harbaugh
Maybe
But those teams wanted a young QB and now that Barkley and Jones are staying it’s really RG3 or bust.
He looked really good last year and at the beginning of this year too… if he can stay consistent next year and get back whatever he lost, then he will be drafted really, really high.
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Seahawks will over shoot for a guy like Tannehill probably.
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happens every year. Ponder skyrocketed, even Gabbert did.
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Good decision...
He still has a lot left on the table to prove… and still may not based off of what he did, or didn’t do this season… He better play like a super hero next year to erase the negative views of his play from scouts.
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It is a great decision by Jones. Tannehill would have overtaken him as No.3 QB in draft anyways.
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"I am our future, forget Kory"
by nocal81(Vincent) on Jan 5, 2012 10:52 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
Tannehill is Blaine Gabbert but worse.
And someone will take him high just because everyone went back to school.
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Not sold on Tannehill, however Gabbert was thrown in and the Aggie QB would need time to develop.
Jones, whenever he comes out is going to flop. Weeden sure the heck looks good.
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"I am our future, forget Kory"
by nocal81(Vincent) on Jan 5, 2012 10:59 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
There’s a few sleepers on my list that I would like to replace Tolzien with on the depth chart.
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Mainly Ryan Lindley and Kirk Cousins
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Lindley throws the better pass though.
I am really surprised he is ranked as low as he is with the solid mechanics and nice arm:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hvrt-CiUE0Q
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Needs some brush up on his footwork
but nothing too bad.
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Cousins is smart kid who could end up like a TJ Yates
taken late but turning out well after a season-ish
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BUT...
I actually think Weeden has a shot at the No. 3 now after they beat Stanford….even though he is 45 years old.
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What about Russell Wilson from Wisconsin?
I know the knock on him is he’s not tall enough but he’s accurate,mobile ,smart and looks very cool in the pocket – and he looks good wearing no 16
by Dubniner on Jan 6, 2012 2:50 AM PST via mobile reply actions
Just like Scott Tolzien did...
except Russell Wilson has stronger arm & is more moblie
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by Kidd2Petrovic on Jan 6, 2012 7:10 AM PST up reply actions
I'm actually reasonably comfortable going into next season with Crabtree, Morgan, and WIlliams as our 1-2-3.
Certainly I think a DB or OL is a more important use of our first-round pick. We need a RT.
Whereas first-round receivers tend to be very dicey and hard to evaluate. eg, Crabtree was supposed to be a sure-fire great receiver, right? One of the best ever. And he’s a good player, but …
Mike Lombardi was talking on Bill Simmons podcast about part of the reason why drafting WRs high is so dicey. They just face fundamentally different covereage in college (where there’s very little bump and run) than they do in the pros. They also tend to just be faster and/or stronger than the guys covering them week in and week out.
This is a good page to help establish your expectations for what you might get with a draft pick. http://www.pro-football-reference.com/draft/WR-1980-now.htm
The last 10 WRs taken between 20-30 (excluding rookies, too soon to evaluate) are:
Demaryius Thomas, Dez Bryant, Percy Harvin, Hakim Nicks, Kenny Britt, Dwayne Bowe, Robert Meechum, Craig Davis, Matt Jones, Mark Clayton, and Roddy White. (Okay, that’s 11, to include a complete draft year).
How many of those guys would start over a healthy Crabtree/Morgan/Williams combo? Not more than 50%, in my mind, and that’s being charitable.
Whereas you do the same exercise for tackles, and while there are a couple of question marks (Kwame Harris won’t bring back any fond memories) you’re talking something close to 100% of them starting over Anthony Davis.
So unless you think Anthony Davis is going to show us something that he hasn’t yet (which is possible, he’s still very young) it’s hard to understand why you’d take a WR over a tackle, if you’re looking at a typical-for-that-draft-slot level prospect.
How many of those guys would start over a healthy Crabtree/Morgan/Williams combo? Not more than 50%, in my mind, and that’s being charitable.
Probably Dez, Harvin, Nicks, Britt, Bowe, and Roddy
"And thank you to God for making me an Atheist." - Ricky Gervais
by MichaelClutchtree on Jan 6, 2012 9:37 AM PST up reply actions
Well ideally
You don’t spend a 1st round pick on a right tackle either in our type of offense. Davis is going to get another year. I’m going to hate it, I don’t think he’ll show us anything different — but I can’t see us moving him to guard where he belongs.
Every time Jamie Dukes says something enlightening and informative about football Jerry Rice and I mount up on our flying grizzly bears and claim pirate treasure from the moon. That's how often it happens.
Bigger needs than WR early in the draft....
Personally, I would rather see one of our bigger needs addressed early in the draft. We have major needs at OL, OLB, FS and CB. I’d rather see some combination of these addressed in the first two rounds and then begin to look at WR prospects. Don’t forget that not all the big name WRs that put up huge stats are 1st round picks. I’m confident enough to roll into next season with Crabtree, Williams and Morgan as our top 3 with a mid-round pick and Ginn to round out our WR corps.
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