Better than Alex Smith? Who's available?

by 49erFanSince1950 on Feb 1, 2012 2:03 PM PST

On Monday smileyman posted an article entitled "49ers 2012 Free Agency Review: QBs" which included a poll asking how important it was for the Niners to upgrade at the QB position. I commented that I was surprised by the early poll results which indicated that most of us seemed pretty comfortable with Alex as our continuing starter. Why surprised? It seems to me that if you're a serious fan and you want your team positioned to complete in the Super Bowl every year that you would understand that that can only happen on a consistent basis if you have a grade-A player at the single most important position on the team ... regardless of what Mike Singletary thinks. But in the poll most seemed to find having a grade-B quarterback was satisfactory. Maybe I'm spoiled by having lived through the five Super Bowl and other winning seasons, but I am NOT satisfied. Let me be clear. I like Alex, have great respect and admiration for his ability to persevere all of the termoil that the Niners have put him through, and I think that he's competent to a point. But the fact is that he's a "B", and what's more IMO, will never be more than an "B" ... he may get a little bit better, but will never be an "elite" grade-A QB in the NFL. I'm not throwing rocks ... it's just a fact. So what the hell do I expect? Simple ... I want a grade-A quarterback. Who are they? In my book there are currently four (one on IR) grade-A QBs in the NFL: Brady, Brees, Payton (IR) and Rodgers. Whoa! But what about Bradford, Cutler, Freeman, Flacco, Gabbard, Eli, Newton, Palmer, Ponder, Rivers, Roethisberger, Ryan, Sanchez, Alex, Stafford and Vick ... they're all first-round draft picks? Very true ... but they're all also "B's" or "C's" in my book. A different performance standard? Maybe.

In response to my comment about the poll, Dan Peterson asked the question "who is available that is a better option than Alex?" A very good question. And, although it won't be popular among the readership, here is my somewhat elongated answer:

First, grade-A quarterbacks don't grow on trees, they aren't born knowing how, they are DEVELOPED ... none of them came out of college being an A; however, it is my belief that you cannot develop an A unless the individual has been born with that potential. And, that birthright is very rare; you either have it, or you don't ... wanting it badly and working hard to get there (see Smith, Alex) will certainly enable one to improve, but, if you're not born with the special potential, you just won't get there. You have to be born not only with the physical attributes including a far-better-than-average throwing arm, the eyes to see what others don't, the mental capacity to absorb the nuances of the game and be able to exploit them, the fortitude and guts to continue to push when there's no energy left, and the downright love of the game that enables you "do it" regardless of the pressures and conditions, and the ability to enspire others to do the same. But it's more than all that ... these guys are "different". A very few guys have it "all". Some guys have all the physical attibutes but not the mental capacity to be an "A" (Jay Cutler and Cam Newton are examples). Other guys have the mental makeup but lack the physical prowess to get there (Kellen Moore is a perfect example). We're talking about the few guys who have ALL of the necessary potential. So how do you identify these guys with the "right" raw material to be developed? Ah ... the billion dollar question. Honestly, I'm not sure that anybody can define "it" precisely ... most football people describe it as "unique talent", whatever that is. What I do know is (1) it's very rare, and (2) when you see "it" you know it. Since it's so rare, scouts have to gamble that a particular guy MAY have "it" when they draft him ... and usually end up with a Joe Flacco or Mark Sanchez. But once in a great while a guy comes along and, after studying him thoroughly, you know ... he's got "it." And, when you have a chance to get one of those, do whatever it takes to get him because the next such guy could be a LONG way off. Understand, they have to be drafted, not signed as a free agent, because once a team has one there is only one way that they will trade or release him and that is if there is a huge risk that the player may not be able to recover from a serious injury (examples are Drew Brees and now Peyton Manning). If you want a grade-B or grade-C QB via free agency, that's doable but at a steep price. A grade-A? NFW!

I've watched thousands of professional and collegiate football games in the last six decades. At the professional level I have seen fewer that two dozen guys that I would classify as grade-A ... that group includes the four guys mentioned above plus Otto Graham, Johnny Unitas, Fran Tarkington, John Brodie, Roger Staubach, Warren Moon, Dan Fouts, Dan Marino, Joe Montana, Steve Young and John Elway. The guys not still playing have three things in common: (1) each was an A, (2) they personally made a difference in every game they ever played in, regardless of the supporting cast, and (3) they are all in the Pro Football Hall of Fame. I've had the great pleasure to watch most of the collegiate games played by three guys who I KNEW would become pro-level A's BEFORE they played their first professional game: John Brodie, John Elway ... and Andrew Luck. I feel the same way about Luck that I felt about Brodie and Elway ... Luck is the ONLY collegiate QB that I've seen in the last twenty years that comes anywhere close to Elway as a collegian. Trust me guys ... every scouting report that I've read and every scouting service has Luck graded at their highest possible evaluation. These guys are NOT all wrong. Trust me again ... Luck will be an A within two years IF he doesn't get drafted by a team that can't give him the proper system, continued good coaching, and adequate protection so that he doesn't get maimed in the process. IMO Indy can't offer any of those things ... and his talent could be wasted, as Peyton's was in the early years. That is why I believe that the biggest single thing the Niners can possibly do to improve the team is to do whatever it takes to get the draft rights to Andrew Luck. And, I think that we are in a position to do that. Indy's roster is in shambles ... they need decent starting players, not draft choices to select unproven rookies. I would be willing to trade as many as a dozen players to get the #1 pick from Indy ... but I don't think that it will take THAT many. Accordingly, I would protect only 17 guys as being untouchable in such a trade: Akers, Bowman, Culliver, Vernon Davis, Hunter, Iupati, Jennings, Lee, Miller, Morgan, Rogers, Aldon Smith, Justin Smith, Snyder, Sopoaga, Whitner and Willis. In my book, anybody else is "available" (yes, including Alex). You would be willing to blow up a playoff team roster to get one prospect? Yep. Because most of those guys can be replaced with relative ease. A grade-A quarterback? Not so much ... if there is any single lesson that we should have learned during the past ten plus years of quarterback roulette it's that A's are rare and they're not easy to get. When you get the chance to get one, you must go for it.

This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of Niners Nation's writers or editors. It does reflect the views of this particular fan though, which is as important as the views of Niners Nation's writers or editors.

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You have to be kidding

First of all, the majority of what we would give up to do this is NOT current players on the roster, but it would be YEARS of future draft picks. We would be the Raiders, and for an unproven talent? Even for proven talent this is risky. Second, of the names on that list of MUST PROTECT, you listed an aging but accurate kicker (Akers), a fantastic punter (Lee), an under utilized TE (Davis), a couple of role playing rookies (Hunter, Culliver), an aging possession receiver coming back from a serious injury (Morgan), and above average lineman (Sopoaga, Snyder). While I like all of these guys and hope we keep them, none of them will break this team if they were not here next year (maybe all together would be a problem…). These players are replaceable – perhaps only Lee has in irreplaceable talent, but if we had to downgrade to an above average punter (I hope not, but a skill that can be found), we would be OK.

None of that even considers the fact that teams that put too much into one basket usually grow to regret it. If he outright fails, or is even marginal, after what we would have to give up, we would have set our franchise back dramatically. Even if he plays well, we would have a limited window to succeed (beyond unlikely that a rookie or even second year QB would take us to the promised land) before his contract demands would cause serious struggles for the front office and begin to erode the team and the talent around him.

by Da Bum on Feb 1, 2012 2:45 PM PST reply actions

Under utilized TE?

4 TD in postseason, and record setting game for TE is underutilized?

Who is utilized then?

by Mindless on Feb 1, 2012 4:40 PM PST up reply actions

Yeah, but for much of the season he was under-utilized

By his own admission, it took VD a large part of the season to get comfortable in the offense, and possibly for the coaches to fully gauge his role in said offense. Playoffs were his coming out party…except for the stupid penalties.

"The principle is competing against yourself. It's about self improvement, about being better than you were the day before." ~Steve Young #8

by Young_To_Rice on Feb 1, 2012 5:34 PM PST up reply actions

Not sure that you really understand what I propose ... see my additional comments below.

by 49erFanSince1950 on Feb 1, 2012 8:05 PM PST up reply actions

I don't understand your trade strategy

. they need decent starting players, not draft choices to select unproven rookies. I would be willing to trade as many as a dozen players to get the #1 pick from Indy … but I don’t think that it will take THAT many. Accordingly, I would protect only 17 guys as being untouchable in such a trade:

Am I reading this correctly? You want to trade all of our worst players to Indy for the #1 pick? 17 guys are untouchable? Even if we had 200 players named Moran Norris to offer, there’s no way they are going to accept that. You have to pony up to get that #1 pick, and I don’t think Indy is going to give it up.

by E-Train on Feb 1, 2012 4:05 PM PST reply actions

You're right ... you don't understand the strategy. My fault ... let me clarify ...

1. After retirements and the loss of free agents who have said that they won’t return, Indy’s remaining roster is in shambles … they basically must, and have admitted so, start over; and probably without Peyton Manning. They need help at virtually EVERY POSITION. They have a small cadre of decent young players, but will be faced with having to fill out the roster with either free agents (and they already have a BIG CAP PROBLEM) or draft prospects; the net result will be playing a lot of rookies (including Luck) or sub-par (i.e., cheap) vets. What my proposed trade offers, in exchange for the #1 pick (and more IF we can get them), is the opportunity to select up to ten young veterans (many starters, some Pro-Bowlers) to form the nucleus of their roster rebuild.

2. Our list of offerees is NOT throw-aways or chopped liver. Rather, the list is as follows:

Quarterbacks (select no more than 1): Alex Smith, Colin Kaepernick, Scott Tolzien
Running Backs (select no more than 1): Frank Gore, Anthony Dixon
Wide Receivers (seleect no more than 2): Michael Crabtree, Ted Ginn, Kyle Williams, Brett Swain, John Mathews
Tight Ends (select no more than 1): Delanie Walker, Nate Byham, Konrad Reuland
Centers/Guards (select no more than 1): Johathan Goodwin, Dan Kilgore
Offensive Tackles (select no more than 1): Joe Staley, Anthony Davis, Alex Boone, Mike Person
Defensive Linemen (select no more than 1): Ray McDonald, Ricky Jean-Francois, Will Tukuafu, Ian Williams
Linebackers (select no more than 1): Parys Harelson, Larry Grant, Tavares Gooden
Cornerbacks (select no more than 1): Tarelll Brown, Tramaine Brock, Shawntae Spencer
Safeties (select no more than 1): Colin Jones, CJ Spillman, Madieu Williams

3. The negotiating strategy could be flexible, depending upon what other draft picks Indy might be willing to offer; for example, maybe they don’t want a linebacker but would like two corners … that’s negotiable depending upon who the corners are and what level additional draft pick Indy would offer. Hopefully this is understandable.

4. No matter which ten players they might select our roster WOULD NOT be that badly damaged; given our broad and deep roster, salary cap space for free agent signings, plus available draft picks, we can replentish the roster pretty quickly.

5. The key issue for this whole proposal is simple: The ONLY position on any football roster that is not easily replaceable is A GRADE-A FRANCHISE QUARTERBACK. If you have one, everything else will fall into place. If you don’t (and we haven’t since Steve Young went down), you will have varying degrees of success, if any, in reaching the Super Bowl UNTIL YOU DO HAVE A GRADE-A QB. This is not rocket science, guys. Luck has “it” … let’s go get him!

by 49erFanSince1950 on Feb 1, 2012 8:04 PM PST up reply actions

Not happening.

Not in your wildest dreams is this remotely possible. You don’t ship 12 guys out of the locker room for 1 person without losing your locker room’s confidence in themselves.

"Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our light, not our darkness that most frightens us"

by FearTheTree on Feb 1, 2012 8:40 PM PST up reply actions

That being said

Football is not nearly as black and white as many would like to think. There is no quantifiable “number” of players that you can ship to another team in return for someone who is unproven (but I personally feel will go down as one of the greats). These guys are people not machines…people. Indianapolis can’t operate under the pretense that acquiring all these players (most of whom are nothing more than depth on our team) is going to amount to as much value as a great QB like Luck will. Not to mention it would be an absolute PR disaster for Indianapolis and given how much grief that owner gets it would be basically suicide. The team would be better off packing its bags back to Baltimore.

Also, Indy is fixated on Luck. The only way they give up anything for him is if they possibly believe that CK7 is better than Andrew. But, like I said, that would still be a PR disaster.

"Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our light, not our darkness that most frightens us"

by FearTheTree on Feb 1, 2012 8:46 PM PST up reply actions

I’d love to hear what the Indy GM would say to you if you started the conversation : “You can have anyone on my roster, except for my top 17 players.”

by E-Train on Feb 3, 2012 1:03 PM PST up reply actions

Before or after the laughter?

Who's got it better than Honey Badger? Honey Badger don't give a ....

by ak4niner on Feb 3, 2012 1:31 PM PST up reply actions

lol...

,,,you don’t understand the strategy.

-- I have many leather-bound books.
-- You show me a guy that can’t juggle 3 tennis balls within an hour and I’ll show you a guy that’s not going to be in the NFL very long.

by I'm Friends With Merlin Olsen on Feb 2, 2012 4:11 PM PST up reply actions

Do you agree with that strategy?

by E-Train on Feb 3, 2012 11:53 AM PST up reply actions

The only player I wouldn't trade to Indy for Andrew Luck is Patrick Willis

Honestly. Players like Luck and Willis come around once in a decade, per position, if you’re lucky. You don’t trade Willis for Luck because without Willis our defense crumbles. I don’t think Indy would make any such trade though. You would need 2 Aldon Smiths a Vernon Davis and a Iupati to even get them on the phone.

Indy would be crazy to trade away Andrew Luck. No one can afford that gamble anyway. Here is a guy who could be as good as Bo Jackson, but is just as human. He could break. You don’t want to trade away too many quality guys because you never know what will happen.

I don’t see any way an Andrew Luck trade ever happens. It would be like us trading away Patrick Willis to get some recievers. Why give away greatness for role players?

"I feel like I'm the best, but you're not going to get me to say that."
--Jerry Rice

by Pat Willie on Feb 1, 2012 4:28 PM PST reply actions

A question ... you're Indy's GM ...

Would you rather have an expensive Andrew Luck being pummeled repeatedly because he’s being protected by a bunch of rookies and provided with little help at the skill positions, or

Alex Smith at QB, being protected by Joe Staley, Dan Kilgore, Nate Byham, and throwing to Crabtree and Ginn? And, substantial additional help on the defensive side of the ball? And, Ginn returning kickoffs and punts where you have NOBODY now?

by 49erFanSince1950 on Feb 1, 2012 8:15 PM PST up reply actions

You are seriously underestimating the fact that football is played by humans

The only way Indianapolis takes this great of a risk is on players that very well may or may not be better than Andrew Luck is if they go Tony Montana with the cocaine.

Or if Luck pulls a Manning/Elway. But he’s too classy to do that.

"Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our light, not our darkness that most frightens us"

by FearTheTree on Feb 1, 2012 8:50 PM PST up reply actions

Dan Kilgore, Nate Byham, Tedd Ginn? Dude... These guys have ZERO TRADE VALUE. Give it a rest.

-- I have many leather-bound books.
-- You show me a guy that can’t juggle 3 tennis balls within an hour and I’ll show you a guy that’s not going to be in the NFL very long.

by I'm Friends With Merlin Olsen on Feb 2, 2012 1:52 PM PST up reply actions

If they think as you do that he is an A level quarterback

Do you really think that they will be willing to give him up. They just had Peyton and saw what he did and how he carried that franchise. You don’t give up the chance for a great QB for a marginal one in Alex so that he can be protected in the short term.

Tell me this if your the colts would you rather have Luck banged around the first few years as you build the team around him and try to win super bowls in the future(like they did Manning and he turned out fine) or trade for Alex and other players to win a few games now (most likely not win any super bowls) and for a few years only to still be looking for your franchise QB for years to come.

We are taught from an early age how to deal with failure not success. (If at first you don't succeed try try again, if at first you succeed then what....) -Charlie Sheen

I come ready, when I came out the womb I was ready, tell them mama that's why you had me, you knew I was ready. -Moss

Dominating your opposition physically is great and all, but confounding them mentally is sooo much more fun.

2-15-DEN 44(14:36) (Shotgun) K.Moreno up the middle to DEN 47 for 3 yards (N.Suh). FUMBLES (N.Suh), RECOVERED by DET-N.Suh at DEN 47. N.Suh to DEN 47 for no gain (K.Moreno). FUMBLES (K.Moreno), recovered by DET-C.Houston at DEN 47. C.Houston to DEN 47 for no gain (O.Franklin). Denver challenged the fumble ruling, and the play was REVERSED. (Shotgun) K.Moreno up the middle to DEN 49 for 5 yards (S.Tulloch).

Follow @josephgray23

by Redwolf333 on Feb 3, 2012 12:05 PM PST up reply actions

Too late , they didn't suck for Luck and to give up the picks to aquire him .. Is Asinine ...!!

I'm your " Huckelberry "...it's just my game ..( .AleX ) was asked , what do you think about all the game manager talk ... AleX i guess i just managed myself a VIctory ... Extend the Man ...!!

by Edggy on Feb 1, 2012 4:35 PM PST reply actions

Asiten, with this crap.

1. Kelechi Osemele, OT/G, Iowa State
2.Xavier Rhodes CB FSU/ Vinny Curry OLB/DE Marshall/ LaMichael James*, RB, Oregon
3. Brandon Boykin, CB/KR/PR, Georgia/ Alex Okafor*, DE, Texas
4. DeMarlo belcher WR Indiana
5. Casey Hayward, CB, Vanderbilt
6. Marvin Jones WR Cal
7.T.J. Barnes*, DT/NT, Georgia Tech

by rlott#42 on Feb 2, 2012 7:11 AM PST up reply actions

Oooop's ( acquire ) ...!!

I'm your " Huckelberry "...it's just my game ..( .AleX ) was asked , what do you think about all the game manager talk ... AleX i guess i just managed myself a VIctory ... Extend the Man ...!!

by Edggy on Feb 2, 2012 7:37 AM PST up reply actions

Who's got it better then us?

by Mindless on Feb 1, 2012 4:39 PM PST reply actions

on draft day Indy does.

"You know whats funny? I always thought uhm dogs lay eggs and I learned something new today" Peter Griffin

by HUNGRY HUNTER on Feb 3, 2012 2:06 AM PST up reply actions

No freaking way Indy trades the pick

If Luck is an “A” talent, why would the Colts want to deal a chance to get him? The prospect of being set at QB for another decade is the only reason Colts fans aren’t ganging up to chase Irsay out of town after his dealings regarding Peyton.

Indy would want players we don’t want to give. The players we want to send won’t be acceptable to the Colts. What GM would make that deal?

by NinerEd on Feb 1, 2012 4:39 PM PST reply actions

Interesting thing I noticed about your list of QBs

And this is not saying anything for or against your “All for Luck” scenaro but let’s look at your list:
Otto Graham, Johnny Unitas, Fran Tarkington, John Brodie, Roger Staubach, Warren Moon, Dan Fouts, Dan Marino, Joe Montana, Steve Young and John Elway. And let’s add on to it the names you mentioned as well: Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, Drew Brees and Aaron Rodgers.

Otto Graham – Round 1 Pick
Johnny Unitas – Round 12 Pick
Fran Tarkenton – Round 1 Pick
John Brodie – Round 1 Pick
Roger Staubach – Round 10 Pick
Warren Moon – Undrafted
Dan Fouts – Round 3 Pick
Dan Marino – Round 1 Pick
Joe Montana – Round 3 Pick
Steve Young – Supplemental Pick
John Elway – Round 1 Pick
Peyton Manning – Round 1 Pick
Tom Brady – Round 6 Pick
Drew Brees – Round 2 Pick
Aaron Rodgers – Round 1 Pick

That’s 15 picks. Out of those 7 were Round 1 picks, 2 of those the first pick in the draft, the majority of those 7 were late first rounders. So it sounds like pretty much of a crap shoot to me. Montana, Unitas, Staubach, Brady…most of those were guys picked up just off a guess or an idea. Heck there was debate in the NE war room whether to take Brady or Rattay with that pick. Ya never know.

by ChesapeakeBay9er on Feb 1, 2012 6:35 PM PST reply actions

I laughed a little

Tarkenton, Brodie, Moon, Fouts, and Marino never won a superbowl. So 33% of grade A quarterbacks EVER will not take you to the promised land even if you are lucky enough to get that 1% player.

Follow @FLPReliableCPR

by mcwagner on Feb 1, 2012 7:49 PM PST up reply actions

Did you ever see any of those teams play? Talk about running for your life! None of them ever really had the support that they needed to get there. Mind you, I didn't say that an "A" QB could do it alone.

by 49erFanSince1950 on Feb 1, 2012 8:19 PM PST up reply actions

thats why I don't understand why you would trade away the team for one player

Follow @FLPReliableCPR

by mcwagner on Feb 1, 2012 9:55 PM PST up reply actions

Yes you did...

The ONLY position on any football roster that is not easily replaceable is A GRADE-A FRANCHISE QUARTERBACK. If you have one, everything else will fall into place.

Plain as day you said that if you have a franchise QB, that is a given that you are going to win a SB. The “everything falls into place” scenario does not happen and that is exactly why the Colts finished 2-14 and had a very good chance of not winning a single game. You don’t bank your entire franchise on a single player.

by 9thevolution on Feb 2, 2012 6:38 AM PST up reply actions

You're the guy in fantasy football that...

offers 3 mediocre players for my #1 stud. I’m laughing at your offer because I can go get three mediocre players off the waiver wire. Why would I make that trade?

by GB9er on Feb 1, 2012 9:28 PM PST reply actions

Just Curious

What’s the minimum salary for a 1st pick overall QB these days??? Is there an NFL minimum that you cannot go below?

by Mapletreemarty on Feb 2, 2012 6:15 AM PST reply actions

Last year Cam Newton

Got 4 years and 22 million. That’s #1 pick money. No longer matters what position. New CBA. There is still some wiggle room but not much. Not sure if that will escalate each year or by how much if it does.

The 5th year option that teams can exercise does matter on position. If the Panthers decide they want a 5th year under his rookie contract they pay him the average of the 10 highest paid quarterbacks at his position. If he was a linebacker it would be the average of top 10 linebackers.

Every time Jamie Dukes says something enlightening and informative about football Jerry Rice and I mount up on our flying grizzly bears and claim pirate treasure from the moon. That's how often it happens.

by Ougadas on Feb 2, 2012 1:01 PM PST up reply actions

Had to block quote this from above...

The ONLY position on any football roster that is not easily replaceable is A GRADE-A FRANCHISE QUARTERBACK. If you have one, everything else will fall into place.

That would be why Manning only has one SB ring and Marino has none, right? A franchise QB does not guarantee you anything; at all! It’s taken Brady how many years since his last ring to earn only his second opportunity at a 4th; Manning has only played in two SBs, winning one; Roethlisberger isn’t even good enough to win a SB MVP in his two wins and lost his third….. should I continue?

Having a franchise QB, and only a franchise QB, is not going to do squat for your team.

I’ll also add on that Indy is not going to make any trade in a million years for players considered average by all other standards that costs them a shot at the same franchise QB you are clamoring for. Your arguement is all the more reason for them to draft Luck without a second thought and hope that “all the other pieces fall into place.”

Quoted from Bruce Arians, Colts new OC, yesterday, “Hopefully Peyton can come back and get ready to go. But, there will be a new quarterback and a new beginning.” Does that sound like someone who wants Smith Kaepernick or Tolzien? F- no, he wants Luck and there’s no way the Colts would trade that chance away.

At least try to be realistic in your disdain for Smith and wanting him off the team. Make an arguement why we should pursue Flynn at all costs or trade away all of our picks this year so we can go after Barkley next year, but it is completely ridiculous to believe Luck will ever wear red and gold.

by 9thevolution on Feb 2, 2012 6:33 AM PST reply actions

Back to reality please, no one will wager that many players for a rookie QB. Get over it. What is this, your 3rd or 4th post about it? Stop it, just stop it. This team will have Peyton before Luck. And even that is just hoping. Gtfohwtbs, please!!

by rlott#42 on Feb 2, 2012 7:10 AM PST reply actions

We'll have neither before we have either.

We won’t give up the players and picks for Luck (and rightfully so), and Harbaugh and Peyton would not get along. Both scenarios are pipe dreams.

by Odekerk on Feb 2, 2012 7:55 AM PST up reply actions

Not doubting you here

but why would Manning and Harbaugh not get along?

by jobharve on Feb 2, 2012 11:59 AM PST up reply actions

They'll both want to control the offense.

by Odekerk on Feb 2, 2012 12:25 PM PST up reply actions

Really? If thats the case Id rather Hatbaugh didnt touch the offense.

Please get over this nonsense idea. They both want wins and wins alone.

by rlott#42 on Feb 2, 2012 1:31 PM PST up reply actions

It's not nonsense. Both of them will want to control the offense.

It’s drama waiting to happen.

by Odekerk on Feb 2, 2012 1:53 PM PST up reply actions

What is this, your 3rd or 4th post about it? Stop it, just stop it.

lol… I share those sentiments.

You have asked for that, haven’t you?

;-D

-- I have many leather-bound books.
-- You show me a guy that can’t juggle 3 tennis balls within an hour and I’ll show you a guy that’s not going to be in the NFL very long.

by I'm Friends With Merlin Olsen on Feb 2, 2012 4:05 PM PST up reply actions

This is so full of laughable fail

My head now hurts.

Please, stop playing Madden. LoL

"Bears are crazy, Willie. They'll bite your head off if you're wearing steak on it."

by Blank x2 on Feb 2, 2012 8:20 AM PST via mobile reply actions

Madden

only allows trading 3 players at a time, not half your team

by jobharve on Feb 2, 2012 11:58 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs

Ok, I just have a few comments on this.

First off, I don’t think saying “its a fact” that Alex Smith is a “B” and always will be is going to be full agreed upon. Some people think he CAN become an “A” grade QB, and others don’t think he is any better than a C at best.

Personally, I agree he is a B right now, but that is considered “good,” especially on a team with an A+ defense and A+ special teams. And his grade is also better than the WR’s on the team. I’d grade them as a C, and a D+ once Morgan went down. Push that position into B or A territory and the QB’s grade may very well increase on that change alone. You think Montana and Young were great despite mediocrity at WR? Hell no. They had some of the best WR corps out there.

One last note: I disagree that Alex Smith has reached his ceiling in ability (your implication that he will never exceed “B”). Eli Manning, for most of his career, would have been graded by me either a C+ or B-, but recently he has shot into the “A” grade. Are you saying players can’t improve with time and stability? I think the best of Alex Smith is yet to come. That doesn’t mean I think we sit on our hands and leave the QB position alone, I’m simply explaining my view on why a 49ers fan would be comfortable with our status at QB.

Alex Smith went from "We Want Carr!" to "The Run" and "The Catch 3."
SAN FRANCISCO GIANTS: WORLD CHAMPIONS!
Jim Harbaugh and Alex Smith are our future!
Giants Baseball: Torture. It hurts so good.

by Effage on Feb 2, 2012 12:02 PM PST reply actions

O “BOY”…!!!

by rlott#42 on Feb 2, 2012 1:34 PM PST up reply actions

People said Eli was a bust the season he led the Giants to the SB too (he was 27)

Can you people not notice a trend of improvement in Alex’s game over the last however many years? Is it REALLY out of the question that young QB can improve, even slightly, from a season where he played well… if he stays in the same system, is given superior weapons and protection?

"Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our light, not our darkness that most frightens us"

by FearTheTree on Feb 4, 2012 9:32 AM PST up reply actions

of course not

he never does everything good and everything bad that happens on the offense is his fault. Or that’s what they would have you believe anyway.

by Andrew9erfan on Feb 4, 2012 3:59 PM PST up reply actions

I would trade Kaep., and 2012 and 2013 #1s pick for Luck

Joe and Steve were under the same system for years... don't expect Kaepernick to be super so soon.

by bayboy on Feb 2, 2012 12:48 PM PST reply actions

I think everyone would go for that deal.

Everyone except the Colts.

by Odekerk on Feb 2, 2012 12:59 PM PST up reply actions

Hell no, I wouldn’t trade those picks for a rookie.

by rlott#42 on Feb 2, 2012 1:34 PM PST up reply actions

Maybe the 49ers CAN land Andrew Luck... This is HOW THOSE TRADE TALKS WILL GO DOWN

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S96DVTtvXqY&feature=related

-- I have many leather-bound books.
-- You show me a guy that can’t juggle 3 tennis balls within an hour and I’ll show you a guy that’s not going to be in the NFL very long.

by I'm Friends With Merlin Olsen on Feb 2, 2012 2:09 PM PST reply actions

Nice , it could go like this too ...!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jIMLaIieko0&feature=related

I'm your " Huckelberry "...it's just my game ..( .AleX ) was asked , what do you think about all the game manager talk ... AleX i guess i just managed myself a VIctory ... Extend the Man ...!!

by Edggy on Feb 2, 2012 3:41 PM PST up reply actions

below

-- I have many leather-bound books.
-- You show me a guy that can’t juggle 3 tennis balls within an hour and I’ll show you a guy that’s not going to be in the NFL very long.

by I'm Friends With Merlin Olsen on Feb 2, 2012 4:10 PM PST up reply actions

Nice!

Not only a very dope song (love me some GOING THE DISTANCE as well…) but I am now going to PASTE THAT LINK every time the Alex Smith HATER/APOLOGIST goes into overdrive.

Going to TEST THAT ABOVE… Boy, if anyone thought I was hated before…… ( ;-D )

-- I have many leather-bound books.
-- You show me a guy that can’t juggle 3 tennis balls within an hour and I’ll show you a guy that’s not going to be in the NFL very long.

by I'm Friends With Merlin Olsen on Feb 2, 2012 4:03 PM PST reply actions

(whoops, wrong thread... will test in another)

-- I have many leather-bound books.
-- You show me a guy that can’t juggle 3 tennis balls within an hour and I’ll show you a guy that’s not going to be in the NFL very long.

by I'm Friends With Merlin Olsen on Feb 2, 2012 4:10 PM PST up reply actions

Yes , Cake is one of those bands that stands the test of time, always relevent in my book ...!!

I'm your " Huckelberry "...it's just my game ..( .AleX ) was asked , what do you think about all the game manager talk ... AleX i guess i just managed myself a VIctory ... Extend the Man ...!!

by Edggy on Feb 3, 2012 6:23 AM PST up reply actions

Trust Harbaugh

If he sees a QB in the draft he likes and thinks he can develop, they’ll draft him.

Sure, maybe 8/10 teams in a decade will win the Super Bowl with an elite QB, but it’s just not that easy to find one. 49ers were a few plays away from being in the Super Bowl, and the same can be said for the Ravens… With Alex Smith, and Joe Flacco respectively.

Maybe not record-wise, but this team can only get better going into next year.

by TheFreakSFG on Feb 3, 2012 2:53 AM PST reply actions

We got to give Alex Smith a full chance. With pretty much no preseason and learning as the year went on. I wasn’t happy with the passing game all year, but it has shown promise. I think for his effort this year, Smith deserves the start next year. But at what point do we usher Kaepernick along? I don’t know. Kaepernick I do feel might be more consistent than Alex Smith. But lets trust in Baalke, Harbaugh, and for the time being Smith to work it out this offseason. Hopefully with a deep threat WR.

by fireroad01 on Feb 3, 2012 3:53 AM PST reply actions

response to 49er fan since 1950

we gave up the golden state bridge for OJ it would be insane to do it again even for LUCK. A team with chemistry can win as we did this year evan with a C AT QB. alex S is a A- which hasn’t peaked. our team will make improvements will return to dethronethe super bowle champions NY GIANTS in 2012. It will be sweet and more satisfying. must keep our chemistry, its truly a winner. I too am a 49erfan faithful since1970

by John oldshool 49er faithful on Feb 3, 2012 2:46 PM PST reply actions

ps

IT ONLY TAKES ONE POINT TO WIN BUT IT TAKES A TEAM EFFERT TOGETHER A THOUGH Z PAYERS WITH CHEMISTRY TO MAKE IT HAPPEN

by John oldshool 49er faithful on Feb 3, 2012 2:51 PM PST reply actions

This I wish for

but it will never happen. We will ride into the sunset on the Alex Smith ship! As long as Harbaugh is steering, we should be fine. But I understand how you want the next Franchise/HOF QB after Montana, and Young. I as well, but who knows! We gotta see how Alex grows this year. Hoping it to be an ELITE growth as well!

49ers 2012 Offseason: HELP WANTED at WR, DBs, & O-Line

by Giants49war on Feb 3, 2012 10:57 PM PST reply actions

once in a lifetime

As 49er fans we’ll always be looking for that next Montana/Young dream…and for the most part thats what it is ….A DREAM !!!!!!! Its just to hard to find a QB of that caliber … your talking about athletes with not only physical talent but a mental frame of mind thats just uncanny!!!…We would have to gamble and negotiate away the future…and on WHAT? A big …MAYBE and WE HOPE !…lets just stick behind Alex and he may show us all what his true potential can be.

by darkman69 on Feb 4, 2012 5:13 PM PST reply actions

Any trade conversation for The Luck pick starts with...

Patrick Willis. Bowman’s name will be on the table too along with Aldon Smith. That’s where the conversation starts with Grigson. They have every intention of taking Luck and we’d have to gut our defense and future drafts to get that pick. Not going to happen. We have a better shot at signing Manning.

by throwthedamnball on Feb 4, 2012 8:25 PM PST reply actions