2012 49ers needs
by 3k on Feb 20, 2012 11:44 AM PST
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PrintFooch's Note: I wanted to move this to the front page so we could help 3k sort this out for Mocking The Draft. Might as well get him as informed as possible!
NN, what's good? I'm covering the team needs for the NFC West over at Mocking the Draft, the SBN community for the NFL Draft. Before I put that post together, I wanted to get your input.
What would you guys say your biggest needs are? Obviously WR is getting the lion's share of coverage. Does Anthony Davis deserve another go at RT? As long as Alex Smith is re-signed, QB likely isn't something you guys will address. Same goes for Dashon Goldson at FS. I would think cornerback would be an area of concern as well, with Carlos Rogers reportedly looking for a long-term deal elsewhere.
What am I missing? What are the holes you think the Niners have to address to get to the Super Bowl in 2012?
You guys have a better sense of what the Niners need the offseason; help a brother out. Thanks, and stick with us at MTD for the best draft coverage on the intertubes.
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of Niners Nation's writers or editors. It does reflect the views of this particular fan though, which is as important as the views of Niners Nation's writers or editors.
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In order
CB… in the early rounds if Rodgers is not resigned
WR… possibly more than one,
RG… Rachal probably won’t be resigned and was area of concern in 2011
Safety help if Goldson is not resigned, but S depth
Joe and Steve were under the same system for years... don't expect ? to be super so soon.
OH
i didn’t know Aaron RODGERS was on our team as cornerback?!?!
49ers 2012 Offseason: HELP WANTED at WR, DBs, & O-Line
by Giants49war on Feb 20, 2012 12:34 PM PST up reply actions
Needs
Haven’t heard Rogers is looking for a long term deal elsewhere. Actually the opposite. Is there a first hand source for that or is it just some bored sportswriter in a CB needy town speculating? Between Brown, Culliver and Brock we’d still be better off than half the NFL if Rogers left but if that happens we do add some talent, but there is no panic to make it a 1st rounder or bust.
Unfortunately we don’t see Davis realistically going anywhere. But Snyder and Rachal are both disasters at right guard and both free agents. Snyder may be brought back for his versatility but we really must have a new starter there for what we want to do offensively. They have to be able to win in the trenches, have to be aware enough to pick up the blitz, and must be agile enough to pull into space and hit moving targets.
Wide receiver. We may go to this position twice in the draft. Bottom line, we’ll be looking for guys who can create separation consistently.
Safety has to add some depth. Currently we don’t have anyone besides Goldson and Whitner, our starters, who should ever see the field unless they are on a Jon Deere. Bringing Goldson back is a must because quite frankly this FS class is horrible.
Outside linebacker will be another position where we look to add depth. Specifically a high motor guy who isn’t a liability in short zone assignments, is hard nosed against the run, and has shown flashes of pass rushing ability.
Could also be looking in the lower rounds for a more traditional tight end to push Byham and Walker. Vernon is a big WR, Walker is a glorified pulling blocker, and Byham was a blocking specialist that spend the entire year on IR. It’d be nice to have a 6’5" 265-270 guy who can win in-line and be a good outlet in the 5-8 yard range.
Every time Jamie Dukes says something enlightening and informative about football Jerry Rice and I mount up on our flying grizzly bears and claim pirate treasure from the moon. That's how often it happens.
by Ougadas on Feb 20, 2012 10:06 AM PST reply actions 3 recs
I didn't mean to suggest that Rogers is looking first at other teams
I just meant that for him to leave you guys, it’s going to require a long-term (4 or 5 yrs) contract. He’s said he wants a long-term deal, and historically, I think it’s appropriate for his experience.
Thanks for the response though, Ougadas.
Turf Show Times editor, Mocking the Draft writer, and I gots that Twitter too, yo.
"my keyboard won't corporate, neighter will my smell check." - Knoxfan
Oh it's a real possibility
If he’s not willing to accept something incentive laced with easy outs in case of declining skill. I think this front office will move on.
Every time Jamie Dukes says something enlightening and informative about football Jerry Rice and I mount up on our flying grizzly bears and claim pirate treasure from the moon. That's how often it happens.
disaster?
Not sure I agree that he was nearly as bad as you think.
by David Fucillo on Feb 20, 2012 11:12 AM PST up reply actions
We want to be a power running team
Personally I wouldn’t but that seems to be what the coaches want. No matter how much of a band-aid he can be to cover up Anthony Davis’ issues reaching speed if you can’t move people of the ball on a power running team your job is always up for grabs. If he gets a decent offer he will be this years Baas.
Snyder did well pulling into space and he moves well laterally. Personally I’d only run the Power O, Counter, and Zone and Snyder would be a decent scheme fit. But we seem to also want to line up and run right at a 9 man front and to do that your guard has to be able to blow a 3 tech off the ball.
In our system, Snyder is a disaster because he can’t do it. Our running game did best this year when we ran the Power O, the Counter, the Wham — plays where we don’t ask him to.
Every time Jamie Dukes says something enlightening and informative about football Jerry Rice and I mount up on our flying grizzly bears and claim pirate treasure from the moon. That's how often it happens.
Don't confuse necessity with want
I know Harbaugh does like a good power running game, but much of what we saw this past year was as much a matter of what the coaching staff needed to do as wanted to do. With almost no offseason and installing a totally new offense, it’s much easier to get a ground game going than a sophisticated passing game.
While I expect the power run game to remain, I also expect a lot more passing options to be added to the mix this offseason.
by ColoradoNiner on Feb 20, 2012 12:31 PM PST up reply actions
I certainly hope so
I’m looking forward to a productive off-season for Alex and his receivers.
"It all depends on the quarterback."
---Jerry Rice
Snyder at RG was damned good
Don’t know where you get that he was awful.
Me either
Must have pulled it out of a hat.
Every time Jamie Dukes says something enlightening and informative about football Jerry Rice and I mount up on our flying grizzly bears and claim pirate treasure from the moon. That's how often it happens.
by Ougadas on Feb 21, 2012 7:06 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Maybe that in 3/4s of a season at GUARD
He gave up as many pressures as one of the worst right tackles in the league did in an entire season.
Gimme 1 round!
by ItBurnzWhenIP on Feb 21, 2012 7:10 PM PST up reply actions
Don't let the fans fool you
The Niners will not draft a WR in the first round.
"It all depends on the quarterback."
---Jerry Rice
why not?
Turf Show Times editor, Mocking the Draft writer, and I gots that Twitter too, yo.
"my keyboard won't corporate, neighter will my smell check." - Knoxfan
Crabs/Morgan are decent enough for now and WRs are always a crapshoot in the first round
not worth it in the 1st but they’ll be picking up 1 or 2 later on in the draft
"Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our light, not our darkness that most frightens us"
by FearTheTree on Feb 20, 2012 10:39 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
I'm guessing 2 WR drafted and one in FA
We’ll be looking hard for a RG to shore up our O-line for our first pick.
"It all depends on the quarterback."
---Jerry Rice
potentially
We’ll find out in March how much they think of Adam Snyder.
by David Fucillo on Feb 20, 2012 11:01 AM PST up reply actions
maybe, maybe not
Depends on what is there at the 30th pick. I don’t think they trade up for a receiver, but I also think if a receiver slips they would draft one. Their needs depend in part on free agency with cornerback and OLB being the two most likely impacted.
by David Fucillo on Feb 20, 2012 10:50 AM PST up reply actions
Highly doubt it
We need a RG more than WR right now.
Read Ougadas’ well thought out and reasonable post above.
"It all depends on the quarterback."
---Jerry Rice
RG
We don’t know how the 49ers view Snyder yet. If the price is right, it’s entirely possible they decide to stick with Snyder as the RG. Not to say they will, but we don’t know that yet.
by David Fucillo on Feb 20, 2012 11:11 AM PST up reply actions
Snyder
I wouldn’t say he was a disaster as Ougadas said.
by David Fucillo on Feb 20, 2012 11:12 AM PST up reply actions
Snyder certainly was missed during the Ravens game
But is he really the answer to our O-line problem? Would Alex have only been sacked 5-6 times instead of 9?
Like you said, we’ll find out in March, however I’ll stick by my prediction.
"It all depends on the quarterback."
---Jerry Rice
Yeah
I think Snyder could’ve earned another go around. The needs will depend on what is done once the free agency period begins/ends, as well as who is available at #30. RG, CB, WR obvious right off the bat, but OLB, S could play as well. We just don’t know for sure yet, too early
by Dylan DeSimone on Feb 20, 2012 12:47 PM PST up reply actions
I wouldn't say he's the answer
but he’s definately a competent back up
Rule #1) If you hate Joe Buck, watch this www.youtube.com/watch?v=fkCSZKbyL94
Rule #2) Follow rule #1
Yes, back up
That’s why I think we’ll be drafting an O-lineman in the first round.
"It all depends on the quarterback."
---Jerry Rice
Even in the passing game (can't remember the source where I saw this sorry)
Snyder gave up 1 less pressure than Anthony Davis. The were like 35 and 36 respectively.
Gimme 1 round!
by ItBurnzWhenIP on Feb 20, 2012 3:33 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
Source
Snyder, meanwhile, allowed 34 QB pressures in 2011, second most on the team behind Anthony Davis’ 35.
http://nfl.si.com/2012/02/16/free-agency-primer-nfc-west/?sct=hp_t12_a2&eref=sihp
Are we sure
all of those were his? I’m pretty confident we can find a way to pin those on Rachal.
by throwthedamnball on Feb 20, 2012 4:27 PM PST up reply actions
Thank you much
Off by 1. Not bad from memory. And yah I’m pretty sure the 34 were his (or Anthony Davis’ getting attributed to him). Rachel probably has another 15 from his few games worth of work.
A couple you can attribute to Goodwin (but most of his problems were early in the season when Rachel was there. And 10 or so total between Snyder and Davis can be attributed to Alex.
Gimme 1 round!
by ItBurnzWhenIP on Feb 20, 2012 5:54 PM PST up reply actions
Wow
I don’t agree with his take on Ginn. We need a burner to take the top off the the defense.
Ginn is that man until we find a replacement that’s better.
And he’s a hella return man.
"It all depends on the quarterback."
---Jerry Rice
Yeah, but what a dimension...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tWuHHYyGBak
"It all depends on the quarterback."
---Jerry Rice
Ginn
I really do hope the 49ers bring him back as the return man, but I don’t know if he’ll ever be able to take the top off the defense. He’s been better when the team gets the ball in his hands quickly (reverses and whatnot). For a reasonable deal I think he’s a great guy to bring back.
by David Fucillo on Feb 20, 2012 6:58 PM PST up reply actions
We still need a deep threat to keep the defense honest
We don’t have anyone on the team that can do that better than Ginn.
"It all depends on the quarterback."
---Jerry Rice
Due to his one great dimension, our wrs are hampered. There are speedy guys with hands that run good routes in this draft.
T.Y. Hilton in the 3rd or the kid from Cal, or Brandon Boykins.
Gonna make the WR position relevant again? When?
deep threat
I’d prefer to see what the 49ers can get in the draft. Ginn could suddenly develop consistent hands for the first time in his career, but I’d still rather the 49ers invest in a young deep threat in the draft.
by David Fucillo on Feb 20, 2012 9:02 PM PST up reply actions
That I agree with, but, keeping Ginn hurts the WR depth since he has kr/pr duties.
I’d like to see a deep threat and a big WR Target. That deep threat just needs better hands than Ginn. I like Ty Hilton…….a lot!!
Gonna make the WR position relevant again? When?
Don't forget (regarding T.Y. Hilton)
That he was a very prolific return man in college as well.
Cheering on the Mizzou Tigers in TX since 2011. Also the San Jose Sharks.
Jeez
I read that as deep throat initially…
"Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our light, not our darkness that most frightens us"
O Line
It’s not necessarily our top need, but it’s the smartest play at the top of the draft. Baalke loves small school CB’s, and there’s plenty to go around this year. Also, WR’s are deep in this draft.
I could also see the team drafting OLB/DE help at the top of the draft. So, if I were trying to predict the niner’s approach, I would definitely go BPA, with the emphasis being on OL and OLB.
by t p on Feb 20, 2012 11:31 AM PST reply actions 2 recs
I agree with G or OLB
I think OLB is being overlooked by a lot of people. There will be a few good fits for the niners scheme potentially at the end of the 1st or even later in the draft. This would allow the niners to let Brooks walk and use that cash elsewhere in FA on either WR or CB.
by slim on Feb 20, 2012 12:04 PM PST up reply actions 2 recs
Both these comments make a lot of sense to me
Hadn’t really given much thought about taking an OLB in the first.
"It all depends on the quarterback."
---Jerry Rice
The blueprint this year...
was really nice. i like how fang integrated Aldon into the defense as a DE. It shows that the niners can be flexible in adding talent to the defensive front, and that they can go for the BPA…and who knows…maybe they find a DE who they projected to line up as OLB- someone to give the DL the option of rotational play while in the base.
Remember the reaction when we took Aldon in the 1st?
People were thinking Harbaugh was nuts.
Makes me laugh just thinking about it.
"It all depends on the quarterback."
---Jerry Rice
I'm a Missouri fan...
But I was pretty surprised that Aldon got picked by SF. He is a tremendous talent, no doubt, and it certainly worked out well, but it was unexpected. I certainly felt better about his chances than Gabbert’s, though.
Cheering on the Mizzou Tigers in TX since 2011. Also the San Jose Sharks.
WR, BPA
A lot depends on if the resign Snyder obviously. If he is resigned Id say look for a RG in the 3rd, CB in the 2nd and WR in the 1st or depending on who is available BPA.
Niners need a Gore replacement
Yes they have Hunter, and more power and success to him, however he is more of a Sproles type back than a train like Gore. I think the Niners should address via the Draft and hopefully get Gore to do mentoring with the draftee, while ensuring Gore he is still and will remain the #1 back (baring injury of course).
forgot to say, the Gore replacement is not the most immediate need, as many others have said WR, RG, getting Rogers signed or draft a CB.
Could be a guy we like falls to a position where he's BPA and we go that way
Worst case scenario he pushes Dixon to excel or out.
Every time Jamie Dukes says something enlightening and informative about football Jerry Rice and I mount up on our flying grizzly bears and claim pirate treasure from the moon. That's how often it happens.
Someone to kick out Dixon would be a guy named Pierce
He plays for Temple and he is the guy we hoped Dixon would be.
And when we win, we want to dominate. We want to take guys out. We want to hurt guys. We want to win. We just want to dominate, hit them in the mouth. - Rathman
Follow @manraj76
by manraj7 on Feb 20, 2012 8:01 PM PST via iPhone app up reply actions
A new sideline reporter for preseason games?
Seriously, where did they find that lady?
At USC we're not snobs, we're just better than you.
Stanford Routt 3yr/20 mil with 4 guaranteed, what does this do to Rogers expectations? Do we make a run at Carr and take the chance on losing Rogers? I personally rank needs, in order, RG, OLB, CB, WR
Gonna make the WR position relevant again? When?
This makes me a little nervous that we are gonna lose Rogers
unless he is awesome enough to take slightly less money in SF than he would make on the open market.
Bright side.
Carr being a FA means Rogers isn’t the #1 FA. The big bidder will go after somebody else. We only need to compete with the #2 and 3 bidders now
Gimme 1 round!
by ItBurnzWhenIP on Feb 20, 2012 7:58 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
Not really, good teams will want the cheaper option, as they are usually watching the cap closer.
Carr to the Bucs along with Mario Williams
Gonna make the WR position relevant again? When?
Our needs depend so much on what happens in FA since a few key players are free agents
I’m getting restless, can Free agency and the draft just be here already?
We shall stop speculating who the Niners will draft
Until we find out who the Niners sign in FA, it is somewhat unclear who and which position would be addressed in the draft. Let’s wait and see who the Niners sign in FA first and talk draft afterward. At this time of the year, we are all just dreaming about the best scenario with our own mock draft.
by 49ersDude on Feb 20, 2012 2:02 PM PST via mobile reply actions
i know that;s the point tho
it passes the time till the draft and then we can all brag/chirp about how right or worng we all were
Snyder and Davis (RT) are the weak links.
We need to replace RG by either getting someone in the draft or sliding Davis over. The best possible scenario IMO is getting Konz. Konz can play guard while he’s groomed by Goodwin and in 2 years you slide him over. If Anthony Davis is not competent against a speed rush by then you slide him to guard and find somebody new for RT.
Gimme 1 round!
by ItBurnzWhenIP on Feb 20, 2012 3:39 PM PST via mobile reply actions
Kelechi can play guard and tackle. Id imagine if we draft someone to play guard, theyd stay there.
Gonna make the WR position relevant again? When?
I've seen you mention Osemele several times now
I haven’t been able to see much of the kid as I’d like to get a good handle on his skills. How well does he move at that size? Is this a guy we could trust to be able to get out in space?
Every time Jamie Dukes says something enlightening and informative about football Jerry Rice and I mount up on our flying grizzly bears and claim pirate treasure from the moon. That's how often it happens.
In order.
1) Tackle.
2) Quarterback
3) Tailback that can run with authority inside. (Gore’s future replacement)
4) Center
5) WR depth
6) Safety depth
7) CB depth
8) A situational pass rusher
Stay out of my territory
Your list is backwards.
Flip it from bottom to top.
"Bears are crazy, Willie. They'll bite your head off if you're wearing steak on it."
by Blank x2 on Feb 20, 2012 5:11 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
Agreed
Aside from situational pass rusher. That should be right below (above when flipped) QB and both should be below tackle
Gimme 1 round!
by ItBurnzWhenIP on Feb 20, 2012 5:56 PM PST up reply actions
Did you see the Tackle play this year?
It was pretty bad. Staley is average despite his meaningless pro bowl selection, and Anthony Davis is a huge liability in pass protection. Now Staley isn’t paid all that much, so I’m fine with keeping him at LT, but if you’re going to have an average tackle protecting the blindside you certainly need something other than the swinging door we have at RT.
As for QB, it is the most important position on the field. Kaepernick can’t even hand the ball off, so despite his raw potential, it is still a position of great need.
Stay out of my territory
You're contradicting yourself
You recognize the line is not good (while somehow missing RG is the biggest liability and RT is #2) but then say we need to draft a QB. We had a QB that played successfully behind that trash. We don’t need to draft a QB unless one slides drastically. (Say the kid from Arizona slides to the late 4th)
Gimme 1 round!
by ItBurnzWhenIP on Feb 20, 2012 8:04 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
No, I'm not.
The fact is it was an amazing feat that Alex didn’t get injured last year, considering his injury history and the line play. If alex goes down, we put the trust into the Pistol offense QB who can’t hand the ball off correctly, let alone produce in the passing game. You also assumed I wanted to draft a QB. I want to sign a veteran in FA and it’s of utmost importance.
As for RG vs RT, the stats may contradict me but to my eyeball test, Adam Snyder was “okay” whereas Anthony Davis was horrendous.
Stay out of my territory
Davis is horrendous he gave up 35 pressures
But Snyder is just as bad. In less games he gave up 34 from the GUARD position
Gimme 1 round!
by ItBurnzWhenIP on Feb 23, 2012 5:03 PM PST up reply actions
Dont know who calculates those stats
Or how legitimate they are. I don’t think Snyder is the answer, but I do think he’s a serviceable bandaid. The fact is with proper coaching and scheme you can usually get away with some stiffs inside as long as you have good bookend play. Look at how many guards in the league were late round draftee’s, compared with how many that are tackles.
I wouldn’t mind moving Davis inside as I think he would be a pretty good guard, but the bottom line is we need someone who can hold his own at RT.
Stay out of my territory
I tried to respond, but there are just too many variables until the FA is over, here's what I had
1) Guard (unless they’re sold on Kilgore or Person)
2) WR / unless we sign a big FA
3) S (unless we sign Goldson AND R. Smith)
4) Pass rush specialist
5) WR (got to be a tall guy, great verticle, from a small school / unknown)
6) Blocking TE
7) BPA
Needs:
Its been said many times here already, but RG is the biggest need right now. Rachal is bad and not coming back, Snyder is a utility backup at best, and the only other players capable of playing RG are late round rookies. I think Kilgore could play RG but we need to reinforce the interior O-Line nonetheless. Konz would be the ideal play as we also don’t have a backup Center.
I’d also say Safety is a much bigger concern then CB. Outside Whitner and Goldson (a FA) we have no depth at all. We have to spend a Top 100 on a Safety to have a reliable backup.
WR is another problem. The team could probably squeeze another season out of a starting tandem of Crabs and Morgan, but that’s not ideal. They need to dip into FA and the Draft to fix WR. But I don’t think WR is a 1st round problem.
Finally OLB. Brooks is a FA, Haralson isn’t very good, and Aldon is a situational rusher with little expierence standing up. This position could easily vault RG as the #1 problem if FA doesn’t go well.
1) RG
2) Safety
3) WR
4) OLB
5) CB
I survived the David Carr Press Conference Thread 3/06/2010
And Harbamania. And the San Francisco Giants 2010 World Series season.
by Hoopers Judge on Feb 20, 2012 5:36 PM PST via mobile reply actions
Safety
I think the coaching staff really like Spillman and are trying to make him a feasible backup. Spillman actually played on obvious running downs, like in the redzone, at the safety position.
If Goldson and R. Smith come back, then we are pretty set. If R. Smith leaves, I’d like to see him replaced in the draft in the 3rd. Could also see a scenario where Smith is retained, they let Goldson walk and then use a 2nd round pick on a safety.
R Smith
Didn’t the FO pretty much say to Reggie “Don’t let the door hit ya…”?
by ChesapeakeBay9er on Feb 26, 2012 3:31 PM PST up reply actions
BUT It has to be a RG who can pass protect and blitz pickup...
AND PULL. So maybe a tackle that slides to play guard… Or to kick Anthony Davis inside
Gimme 1 round!
We need a G that can pull and do it well.
And when we win, we want to dominate. We want to take guys out. We want to hurt guys. We want to win. We just want to dominate, hit them in the mouth. - Rathman
Follow @manraj76
by manraj7 on Feb 20, 2012 8:04 PM PST via iPhone app up reply actions
Draft Needs!
1. WR – even if it’s not the 1st rounder, I’d expect at LEAST one WR taken in the first 3 rounds, if not two, and one who doubles as a return threat
2. RG – here’s a potential 1st rounder
3. OLB – the next Aldon Smith please?
4. CB/S – combined the two b/c I have the feeling that either Rogers or Goldson will be gone
5. RB – Dixon should go, possible Gore replacement, copy the 3-headed RB like the Saints
6. TE – Improve on Peelle and challenge Walker, copy NE with two TE sets who double as slot threats
Obviously dependent on FA, based on who’s available right now in FA I’d say best bets to move down/off this list would be CB, RG and WR. I’m also hoping that one of two things happens:
1. Wallace gets signed to an offer sheet that only costs the 30th pick
2. 30th pick gets traded for a 2nd and extra 3rd, or maybe a 4th and a 5th?
Davis is going to get more than just a shot— I think the predominant view around here is that he’s the long term starter at RT as long as he continues to improve. He’s still incredibly young and made some tre Mendoza improvements last year to the point where I’m really not worried about him going forward.
So… Needs. A lot obviously depends on FA, so I’ll just write them up assuming no major FA signings and every major FA leaves. Obviously I don’t think that really happens, but I think it’s the only way to measure draft needs at this point in the offseason.
1) WR: Need a playmaker, especially if Morgan leaves. If that playmaker also has some good size/leaping ability and can be a real weapon on fades down in the red zone, so much the better.
2) OLB: Aldon Smith is a beast, and Ahmad Brooks was very good, but he’s a FA. We saw last year again how crucial the pass rush is to defensive success in the modern day NFL. Niners could use another player here.
3) Secondary: Carlos Rogers and Dashon Goldson are both FAs, but I think it’s more likely Dashon comes back… In any case, if one or both leaves, the secondary is a big priority.
4) RB: I think Hunter can be part of the long term future at RB, but I don’t know that he’s a lead back. It would be nice to find a long term, do-it-all replacement for an aging Frank the Tank.
5) OL/DL depth: can never have enough good players for the trenches. Thought about singling out OG in case Snyder leaves, but I think the coaching staff is pretty high on Kilgore… I’d be interested in seeing what he could do with the job.
Idolizing Robb Nen since 2002...
by Smoke on the Water on Feb 20, 2012 6:52 PM PST reply actions
He still gave up 10 sacks and 35 pressures last year.
That’s amongst the worst in the league. He needs to show DRASTIC improvement next year. And worst of all… Most of them came against the same style of player (speed rushers) which suggests an inherent weakness
Gimme 1 round!
by ItBurnzWhenIP on Feb 20, 2012 8:11 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
All of those sacks were not on him. Alot of the pressure came on plays the ball has to get out quicker.
Gonna make the WR position relevant again? When?
Dude how many times do the stats have to be posted about the number of sacks we took under 3 seconds?
Jason Babin, Demarcus Ware, Chris Long and Terrell Suggs were all in the top 15 in short sacks. Babin #1 (he abused Davis), Long (right in the middle) and Suggs right at the bottom. All those dudes went up against Davis and beat him badly on speed rushes. I think Ware also picked up a sack against Davis.
This could be a coincidence… But I think not. Davis got beat like drum and got beat by guys running right past him Most of those sacks were on Davis and the RG.
Gimme 1 round!
by ItBurnzWhenIP on Feb 20, 2012 9:19 PM PST up reply actions
Right, how many times do I have to say the ball can come out in two vs the blitz?
They put a clock on Stafford, he got the ball out under 3 seconds on two drives vs the Saints, so what’s the deal with this picture?
Gonna make the WR position relevant again? When?
Ok dude here you go. From Outsiders - Over the last 3 years.
… …… …… …ATTs …Scks.. .. drpbcks….. sck rate…. avg time in seconds
Alex Smith SF .. 1035.. .. 77 …. 1116 ……. 7.26%.. .. .. .. 2.9
Gimme 1 round!
by ItBurnzWhenIP on Feb 20, 2012 9:43 PM PST up reply actions
Over the last 3 years his average sack AVERAGE sack is under 3 seconds
Gimme 1 round!
by ItBurnzWhenIP on Feb 20, 2012 9:44 PM PST up reply actions
The defense rests your honor
Your honor the jury is ready to render verdict now. We find the offensive line guilty of poor pass blocking.
Gimme 1 round!
by ItBurnzWhenIP on Feb 20, 2012 9:46 PM PST up reply actions 2 recs
It’s not entirely on the line, its not entirely on the QB. However, every elite QB does not have an elite line. Pre snap adjustments and reads are of the essence!
Gonna make the WR position relevant again? When?
See I like where this is going. Now Alex is being compared to the "elite" QBs
Eli Manning got sacked on average at 2.7 seconds. He took 66 sacks compared to Alex’s 77 while throwing 355 more passes. That could suggest that the .2 average resulted in less sacks…
However:
OVERALL Manning NYG. . 1490 . 66 .. 1557 .. 4.54% . 2.7
OVERALL Matt Ryan ATL .. 1463 . 64 .. 1527 .. 4.19% . 3.0
OVERALL Tom Brady NE .. 1516 . 61 .. 1578 .. 3.93% . 3.1
As we can see Ryan got significantly more time and was much closer to Eli in attempts while only getting sacked a slightly lower % than Manning… And Brady of the awesome O-line gets 3.1 while passing even more.
I really wish this charted pressures so we could do a sacks per pressure comparison. (That should be a defense stat btw)
Gimme 1 round!
by ItBurnzWhenIP on Feb 21, 2012 3:50 AM PST up reply actions
Pure BPA draft
This is a random thought, but I was thinking what a purely BPA draft would look like for the 49ers regardless of need. There are couple of good players falling or expected to fall in the draft. What made me think of this was seeing Manraj take Hamilton over Jared Crick with something like a mid third round pick in Mocking the Draft. Sorry to call you out Manraj, but I thought there were some other highly regarded players still on the board that I would have preferred over the small school stud OLB with sacks galore. On the other hand, I thought your double trade back draft strategy was pure genius, and beauty is the eye of the beholder with some of these players.
Anyway, pure PBA draft regardless of need:
1. Mark Barron, S – Will fall to #30 due to recent surgery. Otherwise top 15 pick
2. Jared Crick, DE – Injury marred season taking him out of first round. Should still got in 30-40 but a lot of mocks have him falling.
3. Dwight Jones, WR – Was getting mocked to the 9ers in the 1st round in December before consensus turned against him.
4. Keenan Robinson, OLB
5. Andrew Datko, OG/OT – Is this dude that got snubbed by the Combine, or am I thinking of someone else?
6. Omar Bolden, CB – 2nd round talent before a knee injury last spring
7. Lance Lewis, WR – or any other dropping BPA.
The thought of Dwight Jones makes me cringe, but I was shooting for players who had at least been highly regarded at some point in the past. Couldn’t think of one for the 7th which is why I threw Lance Lewis in there. He’s a burner.
Lol only what... 1 of those guys in the first 4 rounds fits what we're looking for?
Barron is a pure SS. Crick is too small for a 4-3. Robinson is currently a 4-3 OLB.
Gimme 1 round!
by ItBurnzWhenIP on Feb 20, 2012 9:56 PM PST up reply actions
Say what
Justin Smith and Jared Crick are the same size, and Justin Smith seems to play alright at DE. Anyway, I did say it was BPA regardless of need.
Crick is too small for a 3-4 that is not a 4-3
They are listed the same but first I’d argue that Smith is no longer 285. Closer to 300 and solid muscle. Which leads into my second point. In terms of power and explosiveness they are not in the same galaxy.
Gimme 1 round!
by ItBurnzWhenIP on Feb 21, 2012 7:12 PM PST up reply actions
Factor in time
Smith has obviously improved and gotten stronger over time, due to his work ethic. Can Crick emulate this and get better over time? Every player should get stonger once they’re a professional athlete for a few years. Explosiveness is probably more limited to develop.
Just throwing it out there…I know nothing about Crick.
Combine
Combine will put to rest the weight / strenght concerns.
Look I actually like Crick. I just think comparing him in any way, shape or form to Justin Smith is ludicrous.
Justin Smith just got selected ALL-Pro at 2 different positions in the same season.
Gimme 1 round!
by ItBurnzWhenIP on Feb 23, 2012 5:04 PM PST up reply actions
Thanks for all the responses, everybody
Suffice to say, you guys are all on the same page…or in the same book…
Ah screw it. But hey, you guys helped a ton. Thanks.
Turf Show Times editor, Mocking the Draft writer, and I gots that Twitter too, yo.
"my keyboard won't corporate, neighter will my smell check." - Knoxfan
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